Author Topic: should I be a seda? uncertain  (Read 1985 times)

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Online Ladislaus

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Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
« Reply #30 on: January 12, 2018, 02:48:21 PM »
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  • There certainly are similarities with the Old Catholics in their view about the Church of Rome.
    And there are no similarities between what St. Robert and what they are saying about a heretical pope.
    They ignore St. Robert's teaching about the local Church of Rome. He wrote a whole chapter on it but it is conveniently ignored by the sedes.

    You appear obsessed with this Church of Rome issue.  But has this Church of Rome retained the faith any more or less than the broader Conciliar Church?  No.  So it's a moot point ... even though you think yourself quite clever.  Yes, some critics of sedevacantism make the so-called Ecclesiavacantist argument, and they have a point.  But that's where the CT and so-called sedeprivationism fit in.

    Offline Meg

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #31 on: January 12, 2018, 02:48:34 PM »
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  • As per usual, Meg, you see what you want to see.  You base everything on emotion and should therefore probably recuse yourself from all theological discussions.

    I'm pretty sure that laymen aren't supposed to be teaching theology at all. That includes you.


    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #32 on: January 12, 2018, 02:49:09 PM »
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  • How so?

    Like knowing that he didn't have any and operating as if he did anyway?

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #33 on: January 12, 2018, 02:50:31 PM »
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  • I'm pretty sure that laymen aren't supposed to be teaching theology at all. That includes you.

    Who exactly is "teaching"?

    And, if you truly believe this, then why are you on here promoting your various positions?

    Offline Meg

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #34 on: January 12, 2018, 03:00:48 PM »
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  • Who exactly is "teaching"?


    You are. 


    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #35 on: January 12, 2018, 03:02:53 PM »
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  • Online Ladislaus

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #36 on: January 12, 2018, 03:03:54 PM »
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  • You are.

    Well, I don't believe this ... while you do.

    So the only consistent thing for you to do is to stop "teaching" here on CI, whereas I can continue in good conscience since I don't consider myself as teaching anything.  Nice knowing you.  So long.

    Offline Meg

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #37 on: January 12, 2018, 03:09:23 PM »
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  • Well, I don't believe this ... while you do.

    So the only consistent thing for you to do is to stop "teaching" here on CI, whereas I can continue in good conscience since I don't consider myself as teaching anything.  Nice knowing you.  So long.

    No one here is going to stop you from teaching your brand of theology. But I can point out that this is what you are doing.

    Carry on.


    Offline Jaynek

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #38 on: January 12, 2018, 03:54:11 PM »
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  • No one here is going to stop you from teaching your brand of theology. But I can point out that this is what you are doing.
    Are you saying that Ladislaus is teaching when he posts his opinions but you are not?  How does that make sense?  What is the difference?  
    Most sweet Jesus, whose overflowing charity for men is requited by so much forgetfulness, negligence and contempt, behold us prostrate before you, eager to repair by a special act of homage the cruel indifference and injuries to which your loving Heart is

    Online Cantarella

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #39 on: January 12, 2018, 03:55:11 PM »
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  • There certainly are similarities with the Old Catholics in their view about the Church of Rome.
    And there are no similarities between what St. Robert and what they are saying about a heretical pope.
    They ignore St. Robert's teaching about the local Church of Rome. He wrote a whole chapter on it but it is conveniently ignored by the sedes.

    I am curious about the point you try to make here. It is my understanding that in the mentioned chapter St. Bellarmine is defending the proposition that the local Church is indefectible precisely because the legitimate sucessor of St. Peter lives there and will not transfer to any other episcopate but Rome. We will never have a pope who is bishop of Constantinople, for example, but only of Bishop of Rome.

    If this is so, then I don't see how this argument can be made against sedevacantism, because the promise of indestructibility of the local Church of Rome would be compromised when there is NO legitimate Vicar of Christ living there. During an interregnum, there is no Roman Pontiff.
    If anyone says that true and natural water is not necessary for baptism and thus twists into some metaphor the words of our Lord Jesus Christ" Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit" (Jn 3:5) let him be anathema.

    Online Hermenegild

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #40 on: January 12, 2018, 08:25:16 PM »
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  • I am curious about the point you try to make here. It is my understanding that in the mentioned chapter St. Bellarmine is defending the proposition that the local Church is indefectible precisely because the legitimate sucessor of St. Peter lives there and will not transfer to any other episcopate but Rome. We will never have a pope who is bishop of Constantinople, for example, but only of Bishop of Rome.

    If this is so, then I don't see how this argument can be made against sedevacantism, because the promise of indestructibility of the local Church of Rome would be compromised when there is NO legitimate Vicar of Christ living there. During an interregnum, there is no Roman Pontiff.

    As you say, the local Roman Church is indefectible. An interregnum doesn't change this fact.

    Do you agree with this:

    Quote
    Catholic Encyclopedia:

    The gift of indefectibility plainly does not guarantee each several part of the Church against heresy or apostasy. The promise is made to the corporate body. Individual Churches may become corrupt in morals, may fall into heresy, may even apostatize. Thus at the time of the Mohammedan conquests, whole populations renounced their faith; and the Church suffered similar losses in the sixteenth century. But the defection of isolated branches does not alter the character of the main stem. The society of Jesus Christ remains endowed with all the prerogatives bestowed on it by its Founder. Only to One particular Church is indefectibility assured, viz. to the See of Rome. To Peter, and in him to all his successors in the chief pastorate, Christ committed the task of confirming his brethren in the Faith (Luke 22:32); and thus, to the Roman Church, as Cyprian says, "faithlessness cannot gain access" (Epistle 54).



    Online Hermenegild

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #41 on: January 12, 2018, 08:40:32 PM »
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  • You appear obsessed with this Church of Rome issue. 
    Yeah - most Roman Catholics are.

    Online Hermenegild

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #42 on: January 12, 2018, 08:43:10 PM »
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  • has this Church of Rome retained the faith any more or less than the broader Conciliar Church?  No.
    Thank you for honestly admitting that you believe the Roman Church has defected.

    Offline Fanny

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #43 on: January 12, 2018, 09:13:24 PM »
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  • As per usual, Meg, you see what you want to see.  You base everything on emotion and should therefore probably recuse yourself from all theological discussions.
    You are a bully. 

    Offline Fanny

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #44 on: January 12, 2018, 09:15:24 PM »
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  • You appear obsessed 
    It's o.k. for you to go on and on about a subject but if someone else does they're obsessed?
    You really are a bully...

     

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