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Author Topic: should I be a seda? uncertain  (Read 5791 times)

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Offline Meg

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Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
« Reply #30 on: January 12, 2018, 03:00:48 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on January 12, 2018, 02:50:31 PM
    Who exactly is "teaching"?


    You are. 
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    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #31 on: January 12, 2018, 03:02:53 PM »
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #32 on: January 12, 2018, 03:03:54 PM »
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    • Quote from: Meg on January 12, 2018, 03:00:48 PM
    You are.

    Well, I don't believe this ... while you do.

    So the only consistent thing for you to do is to stop "teaching" here on CI, whereas I can continue in good conscience since I don't consider myself as teaching anything.  Nice knowing you.  So long.
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    Offline Meg

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #33 on: January 12, 2018, 03:09:23 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on January 12, 2018, 03:03:54 PM
    Well, I don't believe this ... while you do.

    So the only consistent thing for you to do is to stop "teaching" here on CI, whereas I can continue in good conscience since I don't consider myself as teaching anything.  Nice knowing you.  So long.

    No one here is going to stop you from teaching your brand of theology. But I can point out that this is what you are doing.

    Carry on.
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    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Jaynek

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #34 on: January 12, 2018, 03:54:11 PM »
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    • Quote from: Meg on January 12, 2018, 03:09:23 PM
    No one here is going to stop you from teaching your brand of theology. But I can point out that this is what you are doing.
    Are you saying that Ladislaus is teaching when he posts his opinions but you are not?  How does that make sense?  What is the difference?  
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    Offline Cantarella

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #35 on: January 12, 2018, 03:55:11 PM »
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    • Quote from: Hermenegild on January 12, 2018, 02:11:37 PM
    There certainly are similarities with the Old Catholics in their view about the Church of Rome.
    And there are no similarities between what St. Robert and what they are saying about a heretical pope.
    They ignore St. Robert's teaching about the local Church of Rome. He wrote a whole chapter on it but it is conveniently ignored by the sedes.

    I am curious about the point you try to make here. It is my understanding that in the mentioned chapter St. Bellarmine is defending the proposition that the local Church is indefectible precisely because the legitimate sucessor of St. Peter lives there and will not transfer to any other episcopate but Rome. We will never have a pope who is bishop of Constantinople, for example, but only of Bishop of Rome.

    If this is so, then I don't see how this argument can be made against sedevacantism, because the promise of indestructibility of the local Church of Rome would be compromised when there is NO legitimate Vicar of Christ living there. During an interregnum, there is no Roman Pontiff.
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    Offline Fanny

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #36 on: January 12, 2018, 09:13:24 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on January 12, 2018, 02:45:04 PM
    As per usual, Meg, you see what you want to see.  You base everything on emotion and should therefore probably recuse yourself from all theological discussions.
    You are a bully. 
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    Offline Fanny

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #37 on: January 12, 2018, 09:15:24 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on January 12, 2018, 02:48:21 PM
    You appear obsessed 
    It's o.k. for you to go on and on about a subject but if someone else does they're obsessed?
    You really are a bully...
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    Offline Cantarella

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #38 on: January 12, 2018, 10:43:52 PM »
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    • Quote from: Hermenegild on January 12, 2018, 08:25:16 PM
    As you say, the local Roman Church is indefectible. An interregnum doesn't change this fact.

    Do you agree with this:

    Yes, I agree.

    The local Roman Church is indefectible in virtue of the pope. What makes it indefectible is that St. Peter and his legitimate successors reside there and Our Lord specifically prayed for the intention of His Vicar not ever losing his Faith. However, I am uncertain of what may occur when the legitimate successor of St. Peter is NOT there.
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    If anyone says that true and natural water is not necessary for baptism and thus twists into some metaphor the words of our Lord Jesus Christ" Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit" (Jn 3:5) let him be anathema.

    Offline Fanny

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #39 on: January 12, 2018, 11:15:05 PM »
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    • Quote from: graceseeker on January 11, 2018, 04:44:45 PM
    I have heard different things on the seda vacantist issue.. about going to NO masses

    Should u stay away from NO Masses even if you feel the HOly Spirit at those masses?

    I frankly think the answer is No, you shouldn't stay away.

    I did feel like staying away from this one, though... but it was bc teh priest is evil... uncharitable, etc... may be a heretic... probably is, in fact
    Are you sure you are traditional Catholic?  
    You don't speak as though you are.

    I encourage you to remember that silence is a virtue.
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    Offline 1st Mansion Tenant

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #40 on: January 13, 2018, 12:37:49 AM »
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    • I'm not sure if graceseeker lurked for a bit here at CI in order to take the membership's temperature before joining. It seems like she jumped in blindly. That's not an altogether bad thing though, if she makes it safely away from the NO because of it.  I am only worried that she finds some of us uncharitable because she doesn't understand some things and isn't on the same wavelength. I hope she will stick around and do some reading; and keep asking questions about the faith while remaining open to charitable instruction and correction.

    P.S. Patience is also a virtue.  (mea culpa)
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    Offline 1st Mansion Tenant

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #41 on: January 13, 2018, 12:50:16 AM »
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    Offline Fanny

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #42 on: January 13, 2018, 09:48:25 AM »
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    • Quote from: 1st Mansion Tenant on January 13, 2018, 12:37:49 AM
    I'm not sure if graceseeker lurked for a bit here at CI in order to take the membership's temperature before joining. It seems like she jumped in blindly. That's not an altogether bad thing though, if she makes it safely away from the NO because of it.  I am only worried that she finds some of us uncharitable because she doesn't understand some things and isn't on the same wavelength. I hope she will stick around and do some reading; and keep asking questions about the faith while remaining open to charitable instruction and correction.

    P.S. Patience is also a virtue.  (mea culpa)
    You are right.  Mea culpa graceseeker.  Thankyou for the reminder MT.
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    Offline Cantarella

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #43 on: January 13, 2018, 11:30:55 AM »
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    • Quote from: Hermenegild on January 12, 2018, 10:49:52 PM
    It is not just the pope alone. It is the whole Roman Church cannot defect and fail in her mission. St Robert Bellarmine actually points this out.
    Don't you see a steep contradiction between what it used to emanate from Rome decades ago and what it does today?
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    If anyone says that true and natural water is not necessary for baptism and thus twists into some metaphor the words of our Lord Jesus Christ" Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit" (Jn 3:5) let him be anathema.

    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: should I be a seda? uncertain
    « Reply #44 on: January 13, 2018, 03:05:18 PM »
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    • I'm pretty sure that Herm is not a traditional Catholic.  In other words, he sees nothing wrong with Vatican II nor its popes.  
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    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)
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