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Poll

Sedevacantists:if you were convinced sede-ism was wrong, what would you do next?

Become an R&R Traditionalist
12 (35.3%)
Become an Indult Traditionalist
6 (17.6%)
Become an NO Cath Conservative
9 (26.5%)
Become a very liberal Catholic
1 (2.9%)
Cease to practice Catholicism
6 (17.6%)

Total Members Voted: 28

Author Topic: Sedevacantists:if you were convinced sede-ism was wrong, what would you do next?  (Read 26924 times)

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If I believed Francis was the Pope and Vatican II was the Church, I would convert to Orthodoxy. 

As the responses to this thread right from the very beginning clearly show, some sedevacantists have taken the term "dogmatic sedevacantism" to a whole new level. It's one thing even to say "I believe Pope Francis is not the Pope with the same certitude with which I believe in the Immaculate Conception, for the same authority assures me of both". It is another matter entirely to treat defection from the Catholic Faith, and apostasy into Protestantism or worldliness as a light matter, if SVism gets proved incorrect. 

If someone sincerely believes this and would do those things upon being proved incorrect, I'm not going to try to dissaude him from SVism, until he admits he would become an Indult Traditionalist, if Svism were proved false. SVism is easily proved false, btw.

There are two rock solid arguments against it, both 62 year SVism and single Pope Svism. But I won't go there till sedes get this right. 

I'll bet the Orthodox will have joined the Catholic Church, with the Consecration of Russia completed, in another 10 to 15 years. To "go Orthodox" is wrong and throws out many dogmas still taught in the New Catechism, including the Immaculate Conception and the Filioque. See this article on that: "whatever the past may have been, Pope Francis and Patriarch Bartholomew have invited all Christians to gather together in 2025 at Nicaea, to commemorate its 1,700th anniversary. Therefore, by God’s Grace, Greek and Latin Churches can once more profess dogma together ... 

Dear Orthodox Christians: A word from our hearts to yours — if we wish Christianity to successfully combat and entirely overcome the new paganism of the culture of death, of abortionism, contraception, divorce, pornography, and other forms of immorality and lawlessness, if we hope for the worldwide Church to receive more conversions from paganism and baptize more individuals into Christ and the Triune God, and make them members of the Church, the time to reunite is now and quickly.

The Immaculate Heart of Mary, the first defender of Christian civilization, alone warned the world about the dangers and errors of communism and the great persecutions threatening the Church and all Christendom. The history of the last century bears sad testimony to the truth of her words and the urgency of her calling. The time is ripe and the hour is now for the Greek and Russian Orthodox churches to profess the Filioque dogma and unite with the Catholic Church for the glory of God. 
From: https://onepeterfive.com/filioque-separated-east/



Offline Ladislaus

  • Supporter
As the responses to this thread right from the very beginning clearly show, some sedevacantists have taken the term "dogmatic sedevacantism" to a whole new level. It's one thing even to say "I believe Pope Francis is not the Pope with the same certitude with which I believe in the Immaculate Conception, for the same authority assures me of both". It is another matter entirely to treat defection from the Catholic Faith, and apostasy into Protestantism or worldliness as a light matter, if SVism gets proved incorrect.

Your'e not really getting it, Xavier.  If you had asked the question, "What would you do if the dogma of the Immaculate Conception were proven false?" ... what would the response be?  It's a bad question because Catholics have certainty of faith regarding it.  So asking a Catholic a question along the lines of what IF a certain dogma were proven wrong is not legitimate ... since no Catholic would ever entertain your hypothetical.  Your'e doing the same thing here to the dogmatic sedevacantist.  But IF the Immaculate Conception were proven wrong, it would not be an inappropriate hypothetical response to say then that one would cease to believe in the claims of the Catholic Church.  If one cannot have certainty of faith regarding the Church's dogmatic teaching, then the entire Catholic system would be illegitimate.

What exactly do you think is meant by DOGMATIC sedevacantism anyway?

Dogmatic Sedevacantism (DS): SVism is dogma. If you don't believe it, you are in heresy!

Moderate Sedevacantism (MS): SVism is a personal opinion. The Church may confirm or reject it in future.

Ultra-Dogmatic SVism (UDS): If the "dogma" of SVism is proven incorrect, I will simply leave the Catholic Church.

Am I mistaken or are the persons here going even beyond DS to UDS? And I thought many were MSes.