[Ambrose]

Matthew,

In recent weeks a group of apparently organized schismatics, all united in their rejection of Pope Pius XII's teaching on a moral matter have taken control of your forum.

They hurl rash accusations and judgments against faithful Catholics who peacefully adhere to Pope Pius XII's binding teaching.  

They pretend that Pius XII established a new morality that contradicts with his predecessors and the Fathers.  Despite numerous corrections given to them by many posters such as Mith, SJB, Nishant, Jehanne, and others, they have dug in and are deceiving Catholics to follow them in revolt against Pope Pius XII.

To be clear, this has nothing to do with abuses of the Pope's teaching, this is an attack on the Pope's authoritative teaching itself, therefore an attack on the Papacy.

This is your forum, and I respect you and your decisions, but I thought you should be aware of this, as you may have been busy and not noticed what has been going on.  

This group, if left alone to convince Catholics, will only succeed in leading them into schism, and therefore outside the Church.  

[Ambrose]

AllMonks,

Contrary to what you claim, it is impossible for the Pope in his universal teaching to lead the flock into sin.  

Pope Pius XII's teaching is infallibly safe, and is binding on the consciences of every Catholic.  To deliberately refuse assent is a mortal sin.
 
To deny that the Pope's teaching is infallibly safe and binding, and lead Catholics to revolt against it, is a schismatic act.

[Ambrose]

Yes, the readers will have to decide.   I hope that all readers of this forum will not throw away their souls by rejecting the authoritative teaching of the Pope.

I have nothing further to say on this, and ask any readers to consider carefully this matter.  Your soul is at stake.  To reject the teaching of the Pope is to reject Christ.  This movement against the teaching of Pope Pius XII has all the marks of the beginning of a sect.

I am reposting one of my posts below, which I consider my summation on this and now I leave this matter to God and the good will of Catholics on here to see the truth when it is so obviously looking straight at them.  This will be my last post on this topic, with my words below summarizing my final thoughts on the matter:

To AllMonks and all that are part of the rebellion against Pope Pius XII,

I have tried to correct you on these points, but my efforts have not borne any fruit.  You have made up your mind to place yourself in open rebellion to the authoritative teaching of the Supreme Pontiff.  You are urging Catholics to reject the Pope's universal teaching on a moral matter.

The Vatican Council States:

9. So, then, if anyone says that the Roman Pontiff has merely an office of supervision and guidance, and not the full and supreme power of jurisdiction over the whole Church, and this not only in matters of faith and morals, but also in those which concern the discipline and government of the Church dispersed throughout the whole world; or that he has only the principal part, but not the absolute fullness, of this supreme power; or that this power of his is not ordinary and immediate both over all and each of the Churches and over all and each of the pastors and faithful: let him be anathema.

The Pope has taught the Church on a moral matter, every Catholic is bound to his judgment.  By refusing to assent to Pope Pius XII's teaching to the universal Church, you refuse to hear Christ, "He who hears you, hears me."  

Pope Pius XII, in his address to the Hemotologists, that I cited, specifically teaches that the principles taught in Casti Connubii are those taught by him.  Pope Pius XII has answered you and Bowler on this point, yet you will not hear him.

The Sacred Penitentiary under numerous Popes going back to the 19th century, specifically taught that the use of the sterile times under certain conditions is licit.

The Sacred Penitentiary under Pope Pius XI, two years after Casti Connubii was issued again explicitly taught that the use of the sterile times was lawful for those with an upright reason.  Yet, you would have us believe that the Sacred Penitentiary under Pius XI taught directly against his teaching in Casti Connubii, even though they worked under Pius XI, and operated under his authority.

This position that is being advocated goes far beyond a refusal to assent to the Pope's binding teaching, which alone is a mortal sin.  The group of you are urging Catholics to follow you in your rejection of the Pope's teaching, and some are now calling Pope Pius XII a heretic.

Your position is schismatic, you are severing yourself and other Catholics from the binding and authoritative teaching of the Supreme Pontiff.  You are teaching Catholics to privately interpret the Fathers against the judgment of the Pope.  You are teaching Catholics that they can refuse to give their assent to the Pope's ordinary magisterium.

I pray and hope that you repent, that you make amends for the damage you have already done.  I will pray for all of you, I believe all of yours souls are in grave danger.  

You have two choices, submit to the teaching of Pope Pius XII, give your assent to it, and end your rebellion, or choose to reject the teaching of the Pope and gravely risk your salvation.  In order to save your soul, you must submit yourself to the Roman Pontiff.

[2Vermont]

I'm going to bet that most aren't even reading.  As far as I'm concerned the constant threads on this topic is rivaling the constant threads on BOD and BOB.  Perhaps there should be a separate sub-forum for the "controversial" topics where those who wish to beat their virtual chests can keep it contained.

[Stubborn]

I'm going to bet that most aren't even reading.  As far as I'm concerned the constant threads on this topic is rivaling the constant threads on BOD and BOB.  Perhaps there should be a separate sub-forum for the "controversial" topics where those who wish to beat their virtual chests can keep it contained.

That is what the Crisis sub forum is for - controversial topics.

I find it amusing that many of the same posters who do not believe the popes and councils meant what they taught as regards the necessity of the sacrament of baptism, do believe that pope Pius XII meant what he taught as regards NFP.

Go figure.

 

[LaramieHirsch]

Matthew,

In recent weeks a group of apparently organized schismatics...have taken control of your forum...

Gosh, you're fun!

I hope that all readers of this forum will not throw away their souls by rejecting the authoritative teaching of the Pope.

What a tangled web of confusion.  I love watching it.

 


It's always funny watching the people in open schism claiming that the members of the Catholic Church are in schism.  

[Ambrose]

Matthew,

In recent weeks a group of apparently organized schismatics...have taken control of your forum...

Gosh, you're fun!

I hope that all readers of this forum will not throw away their souls by rejecting the authoritative teaching of the Pope.

What a tangled web of confusion.  I love watching it.

 


It's always funny watching the people in open schism claiming that the members of the Catholic Church are in schism.  

You get your laughs while the Church is further divided, new sects are formed, and Catholics are led by wolves to Hell.  

[SJB]

Matthew,

In recent weeks a group of apparently organized schismatics...have taken control of your forum...

Gosh, you're fun!

I hope that all readers of this forum will not throw away their souls by rejecting the authoritative teaching of the Pope.

What a tangled web of confusion.  I love watching it.

 


It's always funny watching the people in open schism claiming that the members of the Catholic Church are in schism.  

You get your laughs while the Church is further divided, new sects are formed, and Catholics are led by wolves to Hell.  

That's absolutely correct, he doesn't care about Catholic doctrine any more than stubborn, bowler, allmonks, and the seemingly endless parade of those other "monks" who appear and reappear. It's all just a game to them.

I'm not sure what Matthew is thinking in allowing this type of "discussion," which isn't a Catholic discussion at all.

[Ladislaus]

http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/CathInfo-rules-refresher-and-summary

You need not agree with everyone (or even most people) here, and you are free to disagree with the moderator. However, you have to consider CathInfo members your "fellow Catholics" -- you may strongly disagree with some of them, but you have to have enough humility to "live and let live" and "agree to disagree".

Ambrose and Laramie and SJB are in clear violation of forum rules in declaring fellow members to be schismatics (=non-Catholics).  Matthew needs to intervene.  Either Matthew needs to agree with them and ban the "schismatics" or discipline them for their accusations of schism; if the latter, they need to retract or else be banned from the forum.  Otherwise, the above forum rules rings hollow.

[SJB]

http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/CathInfo-rules-refresher-and-summary

You need not agree with everyone (or even most people) here, and you are free to disagree with the moderator. However, you have to consider CathInfo members your "fellow Catholics" -- you may strongly disagree with some of them, but you have to have enough humility to "live and let live" and "agree to disagree".

Ambrose and Laramie and SJB are in clear violation of forum rules in declaring fellow members to be schismatics (=non-Catholics).  Matthew needs to intervene.  Either Matthew needs to agree with them and ban the "schismatics" or discipline them for their accusations of schism; if the latter, they need to retract or else be banned from the forum.  Otherwise, the above forum rules rings hollow.

I've made no such "declaration" and I stand by the fact that these "discussions" are not Catholic in any sense.

[Emerentiana]

For most of you, the agenda of the Feenyites is clear.
They continually hammer there points on this forum.  
their agenda is

1   belief in BOB and BOD is heretical
2.  NFP as spoken of by Pius X11 is sinful
3.  I also understand some of them go along with the Diamonds and believe that The  belief that Mary  as  Co Redemptrix is erroneous.

  The Diamonds come up with new twists often.

   They Feenyites use this forum to push their heretical beliefs, and Matthew allows it.  No other forum would tolerate it.  It confuses new people here.  These  confused people will check out the Diamonds website and fall into their heresies. :heretic:
 

[roscoe]

Edit

[roscoe]

For most of you, the agenda of the Feenyites is clear.
They continually hammer there points on this forum.  
their agenda is

1   belief in BOB and BOD is heretical
2.  NFP as spoken of by Pius X11 is sinful
3.  I also understand some of them go along with the Diamonds and believe that The  belief that Mary  as  Co Redemptrix is erroneous.

  The Diamonds come up with new twists often.

   They Feenyites use this forum to push their heretical beliefs, and Matthew allows it.  No other forum would tolerate it.  It confuses new people here.  These  confused people will check out the Diamonds website and fall into their heresies. :heretic:
 

There is No Such Thing as a 'Feeneyite'.   :reporter:

[Cantarella]

3.  I also understand some of them go along with the Diamonds and believe that The  belief that Mary  as  Co Redemptrix is erroneous.  

This shows that you have no real understanding of who you call a "feeneyite". No disciple of Father Feeney could ever be a sedevacantist.

The Diamond brothers and their so called "Most Holy Family Monastery" adhere to the sedevacantist position. You are making unnecessary and off- topic accusations.  

[Ambrose]

http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/CathInfo-rules-refresher-and-summary

You need not agree with everyone (or even most people) here, and you are free to disagree with the moderator. However, you have to consider CathInfo members your "fellow Catholics" -- you may strongly disagree with some of them, but you have to have enough humility to "live and let live" and "agree to disagree".

Ambrose and Laramie and SJB are in clear violation of forum rules in declaring fellow members to be schismatics (=non-Catholics).  Matthew needs to intervene.  Either Matthew needs to agree with them and ban the "schismatics" or discipline them for their accusations of schism; if the latter, they need to retract or else be banned from the forum.  Otherwise, the above forum rules rings hollow.

It's strange how you jump in now, after I have been called all sorts of vile names repeatedly by AllMonks and we never heard a word from you.

The definition of schism:  

The refusal to submit to the authority of the Pope or to hold communion with members of the Church subject to him. It differs from apostasy and heresy, but often leads to them. Anyone guilty of an external act of schism is ipso facto excommunicated." (Definition from A Catholic Dictionary, 1951)

 
I do hope for the sakes of all involved that they are just ignorant on these matters, and are not knowingly willful.  But regardless, their public rejection of Pius XII's binding authoritative teaching with the goal of urging other Catholics to also reject that teaching is rebellion and objectively schism against the Roman Pontiff.