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Author Topic: R&R -- why don't you get behind Father Chazal's sede-impoundism?  (Read 55116 times)

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Offline Yeti

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Re: R&R -- why don't you get behind Father Chazal's sede-impoundism?
« Reply #630 on: June 29, 2023, 11:57:44 AM »
And it's even more credible because he seems to mention this in passing and does not put any emphasis on it as being particularly important ... since he doesn't really understand or care about the theological ramifications, viewing the papacy to be similar to any political office.
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I don't see how this makes it any more credible. He mentions it because it suits his agenda, which is to portray the Church as a corrupt and incompetent institution. Telling a story about the leader of an institution getting overthrown by an internal faction right as he is getting elected definitely makes the Church look corrupt and incompetent.

The way books work is that when an author makes a claim, he has to put a footnote providing the source for his claim. This allows people to verify that his claim is true. The more serious a book is, the more footnotes it has. Now, if someone puts in a footnote that cannot be verified, that detracts from the credibility of the book and outright negates the claim attached to that footnote, since it is now not only an unsupported assertion, but an assertion "supported" by a footnote that is either a deception or the result of incompetence, either of which further detract from the assertion that has the footnote.

So, when trads try to track down Williams's footnotes and find they are false, and Williams refuses to provide any explanation for why the footnotes are false, this destroys both Williams's credibility and even more so the claims which he supported with false footnotes.

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What makes his claim even more credible is where he adds the detail that Siri took the papal name Gregory XVII.  If he was just making something up, where did he get that particular detail.  Also, Williams was capitalizing on his credibility due to his background, which makes it unlikely that he'd make something up just to mention it in passing that might compromise his credibility.

Nah, the name "Gregory XVII" had been circulating for years before this book came out, mainly from Gary Giuffre and Malachi Martin, who likely stole it from Giuffre.

And if you think Paul Williams was a man who had any concern about his credibility, please just read some of this ridiculous book we're talking about. It's literally a kitchen-sink of copy-pasta of urban legends and lies against the Church. It's about on the level of Maria Monk. Just spend a few minutes reading random parts of that book; seriously it won't take you long to get a feel for it and for its author.




Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: R&R -- why don't you get behind Father Chazal's sede-impoundism?
« Reply #631 on: June 29, 2023, 01:29:55 PM »

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There will be an uncanonically elected Pope who will cause a great schism,
This doesn't apply to Francis because the "schism" (i.e. V2) existed long before he was even a bishop.  So it either applies 1) to John23/Paul6, due to Siri being the actually, canonically-elected pope....or,


2) it could apply in the near-future, because many prophecies talk about an orthodox pope who is elected, starts enforcing orthodoxy and but there is pushback.  Then, he is forced to flee the Vatican due to Moslems invading Rome.  The liberal cardinals re-enter Rome, post moslem destruction, and declare (falsely) that the good pope died in the chaos.  Then an anti-pope is "elected" and starts the one-world religion, declaring "all religions are equal" and the Church breaks into cινιℓ ωαr.  This doesn't last long, as the true pope regains his position.

In either case, Point #2 is simply the culmination of Pt #1, (i.e. V2/new mass), whose whole purpose was to brainwash bad-catholics to (eventually) accept the NWO govt and religion.  They have succeeded, and will succeed further, but in the end, will fail.


Offline Ladislaus

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Re: R&R -- why don't you get behind Father Chazal's sede-impoundism?
« Reply #632 on: June 29, 2023, 01:41:12 PM »
Siri Theory for the win, as the best explanation for what happened to the Church.


Re: R&R -- why don't you get behind Father Chazal's sede-impoundism?
« Reply #633 on: June 29, 2023, 02:13:18 PM »
From Universi Dominici Gregis:

77. I decree that the dispositions concerning everything that precedes the election of the Roman Pontiff and the carrying out of the election itself must be observed in full, even if the vacancy of the Apostolic See should occur as a result of the resignation of the Supreme Pontiff, in accordance with the provisions of Canon 333 § 2 of the Code of Canon Law and Canon 44 § 2 of the Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches.

Get it? Even it there is "a resignation," all of "the dispositions concerning everything that precedes the election" (such as death, funeral and burial) "must be observed in full."

And what happens if those "dispositions" are not "observed in full?" UDG tells us:

76. Should the election take place in a way other than that prescribed in the present Constitution, or should the conditions laid down here not be observed, the election is for this very reason null and void, without any need for a declaration on the matter; consequently, it confers no right on the one elected.

Get it? "Null and void." No "declaration" needed. Anyone with a eyes and a brain can recognize the truth and act as their God-given reason tells them to, i.e. that Bergoglio is a usurper with no authority over the spiritual lives of Catholics.
:jester: No comment on the antichrist's stupid "law."

Anyone with eyes and a brain can also see that the man who gave communion to the founder of a Protestant sect, denied the resurrection of the body, prayed in a mosque, said it is legitimate to read the OT so it doesn't point to Christ, that eastern schismatics need not accept Vatican I, preached heresy on and on and on, is the same kind of usurper as Bergoglio.

Offline Angelus

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Re: R&R -- why don't you get behind Father Chazal's sede-impoundism?
« Reply #634 on: June 29, 2023, 02:53:11 PM »
:jester: No comment on the antichrist's stupid "law."

Anyone with eyes and a brain can also see that the man who gave communion to the founder of a Protestant sect, denied the resurrection of the body, prayed in a mosque, said it is legitimate to read the OT so it doesn't point to Christ, that eastern schismatics need not accept Vatican I, preached heresy on and on and on, is the same kind of usurper as Bergoglio.

Universi Dominici Gregis is just the most recent revision of the papal law of elections. The same essential requirements can be seen in the papal law promulgated by Pius XII

https://www.vatican.va/content/pius-xii/la/apost_constitutions/docuмents/hf_p-xii_apc_19451208_vacantis-apostolicae-sedis.html

Here is what Pius XII says about the process of the election when there is a resignation:

91. What has been said so far about the previous election and about the actual election of the Roman Pontiff, we declare that all this must be observed even if it happens that a vacancy in the Apostolic See occurs through the resignation of the Supreme Pontiff.

91. Quae de praecedentibus electionem et de ipsa electione Romani Pontificis hactenus dicta sunt, haec omnia servanda esse declaramus etiam si contingat vacationem Sedis Apostolicae occurrere per renuntiationem Summi Pontificis.


Pius XII's papal election law, Vacantis Apostolicae Sedis, allows a papal election to be held ONLY AFTER the death, funeral, and burial of the previous Pope. It does not differ in essentials from Universi Dominici Gregis