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Author Topic: Responses to the Crisis: Conciliar Church = Catholic Church?  (Read 9915 times)

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Re: Responses to the Crisis: Conciliar Church = Catholic Church?
« Reply #85 on: January 18, 2020, 08:28:15 AM »
How silly. I don't smoke, btw. Never have, never will. But you must be smoking something, because as I already explained, Kasper et al belong to the Conciliar Church - Conciliar Church is an amorphous term that is only properly used to describe those who hold to a completely heretical tendency. But Cardinal Burke or Cardinal Sarah, Bp. Athanasius etc certainly do not hold to any heretical tendency - they are more orthodox than some so-called traditional prelates, who teach salvation without Christ, which Burke and Schneider rejected in their Declaration of Truth - and therefore they represent the Catholic Church and are Her legitimate authorities. If you claim they do not, prove they teach some heresy.

Bp. Fellay has already given you an irrefutable argument which you cannot answer: His Excellency said, from memory "the doctrine of Jurisdiction shows us that the Church of today is indeed the Catholic Church". Do you believe the Bishops appointed by the Pope to the offices of the Catholic Church are the legitimate authorities of the Catholic Church or not? Yes or no.

Syllogism: Bishops appointed by the Popes are the legitimate authorities of the Catholic Church. The legitimate authorities of the Catholic Church cannot be outside the Catholic Church, belong to some supposed separate "Conciliar Church". Therefore, the Bishops appointed by the Popes do not all necessarily belong to the "Conciliar Church" (only those with heterodox thinking do).

When we say some Prelates can be influenced by Conciliar thinking, that doesn't mean all of them are heretics - but they have to be heretics for them to fall outside the Church. Have you read Mystici Corporis Christi? Do you agree with it? You fell for the trap I mentioned of thinking that the Conciliar Church is a separate Church in the same sense as is the Orthodox Church. It is not. It is a tendency or spirit within the Church. And only those who fully adhere to it, in the sense of accepting a full-fledged heresy, against the Mass, Transubstantion, etc only those Prelates fall outside the Church. This is the meaning of those expressions which you are confused by, "to the extent that one gets influenced by Conciliar thinking, one is separated from the Church" etc. If only you would read what Popes like St. Pius X and Pope Ven. Pius XII have written on the Church, you would not be so confused on ecclesiological matters. I tell you again, the opinion that you have unwittingly adopted is implicit SVism.

You don't know it. But the sedes know it. And also those who are non-sedes and see things rightly know it.

Viva Lefebvre!

Down with GREC-Fellay!

Re: Responses to the Crisis: Conciliar Church = Catholic Church?
« Reply #86 on: January 18, 2020, 08:32:10 AM »
How silly. I don't smoke, btw. Never have, never will. But you must be smoking something, because as I already explained, Kasper et al belong to the Conciliar Church - Conciliar Church is an amorphous term that is only properly used to describe those who hold to a completely heretical tendency. But Cardinal Burke or Cardinal Sarah, Bp. Athanasius etc certainly do not hold to any heretical tendency - they are more orthodox than some so-called traditional prelates, who teach salvation without Christ, which Burke and Schneider rejected in their Declaration of Truth - and therefore they represent the Catholic Church and are Her legitimate authorities. If you claim they do not, prove they teach some heresy.

Yes, the Lumen Gentium/Dominus Iesus ecclesiology they endorse, the Article II of Dignitatis Humanae they accept, the new illicit Mass they say, the ecuмenism they practice.  All that is perfectly traditional.

You need to smoke another bowl of crack, and perhaps in a moment of lucidity, it will occur to you that you too are a modernist if you are championing sellouts like Fellay, and modernists like those you name.

I find Poche to be more cogent than you.


Re: Responses to the Crisis: Conciliar Church = Catholic Church?
« Reply #87 on: January 18, 2020, 08:33:48 AM »
Bp. Fellay has already given you an irrefutable argument which you cannot answer: His Excellency said, from memory "the doctrine of Jurisdiction shows us that the Church of today is indeed the Catholic Church". Do you believe the Bishops appointed by the Pope to the offices of the Catholic Church are the legitimate authorities of the Catholic Church or not? Yes or no.

A total rejection of Lefebvre, as I explained above.

Re: Responses to the Crisis: Conciliar Church = Catholic Church?
« Reply #88 on: January 18, 2020, 08:37:40 AM »
How silly. I don't smoke, btw. Never have, never will. But you must be smoking something, because as I already explained, Kasper et al belong to the Conciliar Church - Conciliar Church is an amorphous term that is only properly used to describe those who hold to a completely heretical tendency. But Cardinal Burke or Cardinal Sarah, Bp. Athanasius etc certainly do not hold to any heretical tendency - they are more orthodox than some so-called traditional prelates, who teach salvation without Christ, which Burke and Schneider rejected in their Declaration of Truth - and therefore they represent the Catholic Church and are Her legitimate authorities. If you claim they do not, prove they teach some heresy.

Bp. Fellay has already given you an irrefutable argument which you cannot answer: His Excellency said, from memory "the doctrine of Jurisdiction shows us that the Church of today is indeed the Catholic Church". Do you believe the Bishops appointed by the Pope to the offices of the Catholic Church are the legitimate authorities of the Catholic Church or not? Yes or no.

Syllogism: Bishops appointed by the Popes are the legitimate authorities of the Catholic Church. The legitimate authorities of the Catholic Church cannot be outside the Catholic Church, belong to some supposed separate "Conciliar Church". Therefore, the Bishops appointed by the Popes do not all necessarily belong to the "Conciliar Church" (only those with heterodox thinking do).

When we say some Prelates can be influenced by Conciliar thinking, that doesn't mean all of them are heretics - but they have to be heretics for them to fall outside the Church. Have you read Mystici Corporis Christi? Do you agree with it? You fell for the trap I mentioned of thinking that the Conciliar Church is a separate Church in the same sense as is the Orthodox Church. It is not. It is a tendency or spirit within the Church. And only those who fully adhere to it, in the sense of accepting a full-fledged heresy, against the Mass, Transubstantion, etc only those Prelates fall outside the Church. This is the meaning of those expressions which you are confused by, "to the extent that one gets influenced by Conciliar thinking, one is separated from the Church" etc. If only you would read what Popes like St. Pius X and Pope Ven. Pius XII have written on the Church, you would not be so confused on ecclesiological matters. I tell you again, the opinion that you have unwittingly adopted is implicit SVism.

You don't know it. But the sedes know it. And also those who are non-sedes and see things rightly know it.

Son, you need to recognize that you have no business arguing with me.  Your childish arguments are received by me as high school cheerleaders rooting for their team.  It is embarassing to read your juvenile arguments spewed across the internet as an apostle for your traitorous Bishop Fellay.  But I am happy to let you continue making them, as nobody with any degree of doctrinal acuмen can take you seriously.  

Do you realize that most people who read your ramblings believe you are a teenager, whereas in fact you are quite a bit older?

Ponder that.