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Author Topic: Questions for Catholic Martyr  (Read 2760 times)

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Offline Belloc

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Questions for Catholic Martyr
« on: September 02, 2009, 11:47:54 AM »
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  • Looking at your site, you feel not only B16 is an antipope, butthat B15 was as well......

    IF I am correct, then what were the Popes in between? any of them real Popes?

    If not, when was last legit Pope? and Who?


    also, what are we to make of Pius X prophecy of the future Pope fleeing Vatican,etc.?
    Proud "European American" and prouder, still, Catholic


    Offline spouse of Jesus

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    « Reply #1 on: September 02, 2009, 11:57:28 AM »
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  •  According to him, every non-feeneyite is an antipope.


    Offline Belloc

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    « Reply #2 on: September 02, 2009, 12:02:34 PM »
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  • Quote from: spouse of Jesus
    According to him, every non-feeneyite is an antipope.


    Too much of Feeney then on a pedastal?
    Proud "European American" and prouder, still, Catholic

    Offline Belloc

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    « Reply #3 on: September 02, 2009, 12:08:04 PM »
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  • http://www.columbia.edu/cu/augustine/arch/cdffeeney.txt

    Appears as he did not claim exigency circuмstances as supported of LEfvbre, but appeard to get a doctrine in craw and not submit to legit authority.goes back to a original queston, was any Pope since Pius x legit then? or did Pius XII lack legit to discipline Feeney,etc....?
    Proud "European American" and prouder, still, Catholic

    Offline roscoe

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    « Reply #4 on: September 02, 2009, 12:16:35 PM »
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  • Show evidence that Pius XII(XIII) acted against Fr Feeney.
    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'


    Offline Belloc

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    « Reply #5 on: September 02, 2009, 01:15:33 PM »
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  • Quote from: roscoe
    Show evidence that Pius XII(XIII) acted against Fr Feeney.


    Letter was signed off by Ottiviani......why did Feeney not writea letter t ohis superior or if superior fails to help, Pope,etc?

    Do we beleive then Ottiviani acted alone and the priest who wrote the letter? Why when things reached critical mass, Pius XII did not intervene in his own hand and words?

    Please clarify....
    Proud "European American" and prouder, still, Catholic

    Offline Belloc

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    « Reply #6 on: September 02, 2009, 01:16:44 PM »
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  • Quote from: roscoe
    Show evidence that Pius XII(XIII) acted against Fr Feeney.


    Nope....I am asking questions to those who beleive Feeney was right........why do you feel the letters,etc are wrong? I posted a link to letter-is this letter right or wrong,etc???
    Proud "European American" and prouder, still, Catholic

    Offline roscoe

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    « Reply #7 on: September 02, 2009, 01:20:08 PM »
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  • The phoney letter is not signed by any ecclessiastical authority. Even if it was, it contains no specific allegation against Fr Feeney.
    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'


    Offline Belloc

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    « Reply #8 on: September 02, 2009, 02:00:45 PM »
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  • Quote from: roscoe
    The phoney letter is not signed by any ecclessiastical authority. Even if it was, it contains no specific allegation against Fr Feeney.


    How do we know it is phony-or not? It appears to be co-signed by Ottiviani-thoughts on this?

    BTW-catholic Martyr has not weighed in yet, maybe is is offline...look forward to his thoughts on this.....
    Proud "European American" and prouder, still, Catholic

    Offline Vladimir

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    « Reply #9 on: September 02, 2009, 03:18:46 PM »
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  • Quote from: Belloc
    Quote from: spouse of Jesus
    According to him, every non-feeneyite is an antipope.


    Too much of Feeney then on a pedastal?


    No, that is untrue. He rejects Benedict XV as an antipope on the grounds that he (supposedly) taught heresy in his encyclicals, and publicly supported the "Co-Redemptrix" "movement" (for lack of a better word).

    Obviously, an "pope" coming from a line of antipopes would be an antipope himself, so he also rejects Pius XI and Pius XII as antipopes.

    I don't agree with his conclusions, but you have to remember that in the past, antipopes weren't all heretical, they were probably just as orthodox as the true pope, they just happened not to have a legitimate claim to the Papal Throne.




    Offline CM

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    « Reply #10 on: September 02, 2009, 03:19:00 PM »
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  • I gold that Benedict XV was an antipope, yes.  Because he subtly taught heretical doctrine in his first encyclical, even if he missed it with orthodox statements.  If anybody followed him, they were following an antipope.

    And if they were not certain, all they had to do was observe his actions in silencing the pious defenders of Tradition and dogma, the Sodaltium Pianum, who were the greatest public enemies of heresy and Modernism of the time.

    His 'Code of Canon Law' was riddled with evil heresies.

    Finally, his encyclicals have a distinct Freemasonic flavour, not to mention his telling ties with Gasparri, Rampolla, Bugnini, etc.

    I firmly believe that he was not a Vicar of Jesus Christ, but a wolf, who had ZERO authority within the Church.

    I also uphold the necessity of the Catholic discipline of abjuration, that it, that a convert to the Faith from heresy or schism is bound by justice to specifically and publicly repudiate under oath all the heresies and sects they may have been subject to prior to their conversion.

    Not only did Pius XI not abjure, he never even indicated once that he thought something was wrong with Benedict XV.  He publicly accepted him and was subject to him, despite the telltale signs of his invalidity.

    Pius XII was even worse, with Modernism and Freemasonic inculcation oozing out of his 'encyclicals'.

    In paragraph 87 of Mystici Corporis Christi, he starts under the pretense of condemning an error.

    Quote from: Antipope Pius XII
    They would attribute the whole spiritual life of Christians and their progress in virtue exclusively to the action of the Divine Spirit, setting aside and neglecting the collaboration which is due from us.


    Only to assert another.  The following is heresy.

    Quote from: In the same paragraph of Mystici Corporis Christi,
    The social Body of Jesus Christ in which each individual member retains his own personal freedom, responsibility, and principles of conduct.


    He contradicted Trent (and common sense).

    Quote from: Trent, Session 7, On Baptism, Canon 7
    If anyone says that those baptized are by baptism made debtors only to faith alone, but not to the observance of the whole law of Christ, let him be anathema.


    Quote from: Trent, Session 7, On Baptism, Canon 8
    If anyone says that those baptized are free from all the precepts of holy Church, whether written or unwritten, so that they are not bound to observe them unless they should wish to submit to them of their own accord, let him be anathema.


    So NO, a person does not retain his individual freedom and principles of conduct.  What absurdity!

    He was a public heretic on this point alone, in addition to later (in his allocution to Italian midwives of Oct. 1951) explicitly stating that the effects of baptism could be supplied even if baptism was lacking.  Note that he was the FIRST so-called 'pope' to actually explicitly say this ever since the promulgations of the decrees of Vienne, Florence and Trent.

    In the same allocution, he goes on to state that for "grave reasons" (including economic and EUGENIC so-called "indications"!) a person may engage in the rhythm method of BIRTH CONTROL!

    Not to mention that he never abjured from his subjection to antipopes Benedict XV and Pius XI.

    Pius XII had ZERO authority in the CATHOLIC Church to condemn or to bind anybody.


    Offline CM

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    « Reply #11 on: September 02, 2009, 03:20:40 PM »
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  • Correction

    Quote from: Catholic Martyr
    I hold that Benedict XV was an antipope, yes.  Because he subtly taught heretical doctrine in his first encyclical, even if he mixed it with orthodox statements.  If anybody followed him, they were following an antipope.

    Offline Vladimir

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    « Reply #12 on: September 02, 2009, 03:22:28 PM »
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  • Studying Benedict XV's encyclicals, you can see the relation between his semi-ambiguous statements and the Conciliar popes' docuмents. I think of the Conciliar popes as a more mature version of him, although he was more discreet, so arguably he was more dangerous.

    H.H. Pius XII, did make many mistakes in his papacy, such as elevating Roncalli so that he could be a canidate for the papacy. Without Roncalli, whose sole purpose was to make Paul VI the next pope after him, the modern crisis would not be half as bad.



    Offline CM

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    « Reply #13 on: September 02, 2009, 03:27:40 PM »
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  • Quote from: Vladimir
    H.H. Pius XII, did make many mistakes in his papacy, such as elevating Roncalli so that he could be a canidate for the papacy.


    Not to mention explicit heresy, as I have said.

    Offline roscoe

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    « Reply #14 on: September 02, 2009, 06:47:20 PM »
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  • Quote from: Belloc
    Quote from: roscoe
    Show evidence that Pius XII(XIII) acted against Fr Feeney.


    Letter was signed off by Ottiviani......why did Feeney not writea letter t ohis superior or if superior fails to help, Pope,etc?

    Do we beleive then Ottiviani acted alone and the priest who wrote the letter? Why when things reached critical mass, Pius XII did not intervene in his own hand and words?

    Please clarify....
    Please post the docuмent because I forgot where it is. Unless I am mistaken, the doc signed by Card Ottaviani is a different piece of paper than the actual alleged ex-communication of Fr Feeney.
    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'