Author Topic: Proof that JPII was a Public, Manifest, Notorious and PERTINACIOUS heretic (Read 16956 times)

Gregory I · « **on:** August 13, 2011, 07:20:04 PM »

JPII taugh the heresy of Jovinian, who said married life and virginity were equal states: first the heretic:

Jovinian was a heretical priest and monk of the fourth century. St. Ambrose, St. Augustine and, above all, St. Jerome, fought his heresies:
"From Jovinian, a certain monk, comes this heresy which has arisen in our age, while we were still young men. "
Among others, he maintained these heresies:

1. Virginity and matrimony are of equal value and are equally meritorious in the sight of God:

"Virgins, widows and married people, once they have been regenerated in Christ, if they do not differ in their other works, have equal merit".

St. Augustine reports that Jovinian

"attributed to conjugal chastity the same rank as that of virgins consecrated to the Lord".

Jovinian he says urged nuns to enter matrimony with this argument:
"Are you, virgin, greater than Sara and than Susanna and than Anna?"

And if the Christians exalted virginity above matrimony, Jovinian used to accuse them of Manichaeism:
"Jovinian, who has endeavoured for several years to establish a new heresy, affirmed that the Catholics were supporting the Manichees because, against his opinion, like them, they put holy virginity before matrimony."3

Note that to accuse Catholic morality of Manichaeism is nothing new: it is a myth invented by Jovinian in the fourth century.' Cf. in this regard footnote 32 and the corresponding text.

I.    Jovinian, "the first Protestant" (Harnack):-
i. equated matrimony with virginity: "That is the heresy of Jovinian." (St. Thomas)
ii. 'maintained that Catholics favoured the Manichees, because (...) they preferred holy virginity to matrimony." (St. Augustine)
iii.   his doctrine was qualified as "a horrifying docuмent" and condemned as "a new and blasphemous heresy" in 390 by Pope St. Siricius.

II.    Virginity - Superior to Matrimony...

i. "Matrimony and virginity are undoubtedly two good things, of which the second is greater." (St. Augustine)
ii. Without any doubt virginity must be preferred to conjugal continence." (St. Thomas)
iii. Virginity (...) is, as it were, an angelic state of life. It is a state which, by its excellence, is superior to matrimony." (Pope Pius XII)
iv.   "Matrimony is good, but virginity is better; the state of matrimony is honourable, but more exalted is - as the Gospel itself bears witness - the state of virginity." (Pope Pius XII)

III. It is a Dogma of Divine Faith.

"This doctrine, which affirms the advantages and excellencies of virginity and of celibacy over matrimony":-

i. is "a traditional doctrine of the Church".
ii. it was revealed by Our Divine Redeemer and by the Apostle of the Gentiles ("the Church has received the principal points of her doctrine concerning virginity from the very lips of her divine spouse "
iii. it was always declared, with unanimous agreement, by the Holy Fathers and Doctors of the Church.
iv. "in the holy Council of Trent it was solemnly defined as a dogma of divine faith." (Pope Pius XII)

"If anyone should say that the married state should be preferred to the state of virginity or of celibacy and that it is not better and more blessed to remain in virginity or celibate than to be united in matrimony, let him be anathema." (Council of Trent; Denzinger 980.)

Now JPII:

Catechesis in the General Audience of Wednesday 14th April 1982.

"Let us now continue our reflections of recent weeks on the words about continence 'for the sake of the Kingdom of Heaven' which, according to the Gospel of Matthew (Matthew 19:10-12), Christ addressed to his disciples.

"Let us say once more that these words, concise though they be, are admirably rich and precise; rich with a number of implications both of a doctrinal and a pastoral nature. At the same time they establish a proper limit on the subject. Therefore, any kind of Manichaean interpretation32 decidedly goes beyond that limit, just as the lustful desire 'in the heart' referred to by Christ in the Sermon on the Mount (Mt. 5:27-28) also goes beyond it.

"IN CHRIST'S WORDS ON CONTINENCE 'FOR THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN' THERE IS NO REFERENCE TO THE 'INFERIORITY' OF MARRIAGE with regard to the 'body', or in other words, with regard to the essence of marriage, consisting in the fact that man and woman join together in marriage, thus becoming 'one flesh' (Genesis 2:24: 'The two will become one flesh'). CHRIST'S WORDS RECORDED IN MATTHEW 19: 11-12 (AS ALSO THE WORDS OF PAUL IN HIS FIRST LETTER TO THE CORINTHIANS, CHAPTER 7) GIVE NO REASON TO ASSERT THE 'INFERIORITY' OF MARRIAGE, NOR THE 'SUPERIORITY' OF VIRGINITY OR CELIBACY inasmuch as by their nature virginity and celibacy consist in abstinence from the conjugal 'union in the body'. Christ's words on this point are quite clear. He proposes to his disciples the ideal of continence and the call to it, not by reason of inferiority nor with prejudice against conjugal 'union of the body' but only 'for the sake of the Kingdom of Heaven;".

JPII Is guilty of at LEAST the manifest and notorious Heresy of Jovinianism: Holding Virginity and Marriage as equally pleasing to God. Here is the blatant denial of dogma. His use of the SAME TERMINOLOGY as the heretic Jovinian shows his familiarity with the claims of Jovinian. Therefore, he must have had knowledge of the heretical nature of Jovinian's teaching: Yet he taught it anyway.

Therefore, by publicly teaching heretical matter which he KNEW to be heretical, he publicly defected from the faith. According to the 1917 code of canon law then in place (1982) in Canon 188, Section 4, JPII Tacitly resigned his pontificate and all the rights associated with it (assuming he was even a valid pope to begin with).

Do we need more examples?

Daegus · « **Reply #1 on:** August 13, 2011, 07:28:37 PM »

Not necessarily, but some are not aware that John Paul II taught that every man is Christ in his very first homily.

Gregory I · « **Reply #2 on:** August 13, 2011, 07:33:14 PM »

Daegus, do you consider this argument weighty? The heresy of Jovinian?

Daegus · « **Reply #3 on:** August 13, 2011, 07:38:13 PM »

Quote from: Gregory I

Daegus, do you consider this argument weighty? The heresy of Jovinian?

I'm not sure what you mean by that. Are you asking me if I believe your argument is a strong one, or if Jovinian's argument is a strong one?

Gregory I · « **Reply #4 on:** August 13, 2011, 07:39:40 PM »

Do you believe that the argument presented against JPII is cogent and effective?

Daegus · « **Reply #5 on:** August 13, 2011, 07:44:24 PM »

Quote from: Gregory I

Do you believe that the argument presented against JPII is cogent and effective?

Yes, although your arguments against the many heresies of John Paul II will not be heard, or even considered, by most people. To be honest, given the sheer volume of errors John Paul II has made, I'm curious as to how he could have made it to the papacy and not know of his errors. For this reason I am suspicious of his obstinacy.

PartyIsOver221 · « **Reply #6 on:** August 13, 2011, 07:50:28 PM »

Greg, thanks for posting this, but I was already sold JP2 was a heretic.

Nothing like more gravy on my mashed potatoes though... appreciate it.

Daegus · « **Reply #7 on:** August 13, 2011, 08:02:00 PM »

Quote from: PartyIsOver221

Greg, thanks for posting this, but I was already sold JP2 was a heretic.

Nothing like more gravy on my mashed potatoes though... appreciate it.

If you appreciate that, I'm sure you'll appreciate this. John Paul II's first homily, in case people don't believe that he has taught that each man is Christ.

Quote

1. “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God” (Mt. 16:16)

Simon son of Jona pronounced these words in the territory of Caesarea Philippi. It is true that he expressed them with his own language, with a deep, lively and heartfelt conviction; but those words do not have their fountain, their source, in him: “because neither flesh or blood have revealed it to you, but my Father who is in heaven” (Mt. 16:17). These were words of Faith.

They mark the beginning of the mission of Peter in the history of salvation, in the history of the People of God. From that moment, from such a confession of Faith, the sacred history of the salvation of the People of God was to acquire a new dimension: to express itself in the historic dimension of the Church. This church-dimension of the history of the People of God has its beginnings, its birth, precisely in these words of Faith. This church-dimension of the history of the People of God is tied to the man who pronounced these words of Faith: “You are Peter—rock—and upon you, as upon a rock, I shall build my Church.”

2. This very day and in this place, the same words need to be again pronounced and listened to: “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

Yes, Brother and Sisters, Sons and Daughters, those words above all!

What they contain opens to our eyes the mystery of the living God, the mystery that the Son knows and has brought close to us. No one, in fact, has brought the living God close to men, no one has revealed Him as He himself alone has done. In our knowledge of God, in our journey towards God we are totally bound to the power of these words: “Whoever sees me, sees indeed the Father.” He who is Infinite, inscrutable, ineffable has brought himself close to us in Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son, born of the Virgin Mary in the stable of Bethlehem.

—All of you who already have the immense fortune to believe,

—all of you who are still searching for God,

—and even you who are tormented by doubt:

come and welcome one more time—today in this sacred place—the words pronounced by Simon Peter. In those words is the faith of the Church. In those same words is the new truth—in fact the last and definitive truth about man: the Son of the living God. “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God!”

3. Today the new Bishop of Rome solemnly begins his ministry and the mission of Peter. In this City, in fact, Peter unfolded and fulfilled the mission the Lord entrusted to him.

The Lord confronted him and said: “when you were younger you girded yourself and you went where you chose; but when you are old you will hold out your hands, and someone else will gird you and take you where you do not wish” (Jn. 21:18).

Peter came to Rome!

What guided and led him to this City, heart of the Roman Empire, if not obedience to the inspiration that came from the Lord? Perhaps this fisherman of Galilee would not have wanted to come all the way here. Perhaps he would have preferred to stay there, on the banks of the lake of Gennesaret, with his boat, with his nets. However, guided by the Lord, obedient to his inspiration, he came here!

According to an ancient tradition (which has also found magnificent literary expression in a novel by Henryk Sienkiewicz), during the persecution by Nero, Peter wanted to abandon Rome. However, the Lord intervened: he went to meet Peter. Peter turned to him and asked: “Quo vadis, Domine?” (Where are you going, Lord?). The Lord immediately answered him: “I go to Rome to be crucified for the second time.” Peter turned back to Rome and he stayed here until his own crucifixion.

Yes, Brothers and Sisters, Sons and Daughters, Rome is the See of Peter. Through the centuries new Bishops have always succeeded Peter in this See. Today a new Bishop ascends to the Roman Chair of Peter, a Bishop full of anxiety, knowing his unworthiness[/u]. How could anyone not be anxious when facing the greatness of such a calling, and when facing the universal mission of this Roman See?!

Today in Rome a Bishop who is not a Roman ascends to the See of Peter. A Bishop who is a son of Poland. However, from this moment on, even he becomes a Roman. Yes, a Roman! Furthermore, he is a son of a nation whose history, from its first awakenings, and whose thousand-year traditions are marked by a lively, strong, never-interrupted, heartfelt and living link with the See of Peter, a nation that has always remained faithful to the See of Rome. How inscrutable the plan of divine Providence!

4. In past centuries, when the Successor of Peter took possession of his See, the triple crown, the tiara, was placed on his head. The last man so crowned was Pope Paul VI in 1963. However, after the solemn rite of coronation he never again used the triple crown, and left to his Successors the freedom to decide about it.

Pope John Paul the First, whose memory is so alive in our hearts, did not wish the triple crown, and today his Successor does not want it. It is not the time, in fact, to return to a rite that, perhaps unjustly, was considered a symbol of the temporal power of the Popes.

Our time invites us, pushes us, obligates us to look to the Lord, and to plunge into a humble and devout meditation on the mystery of the supreme power of Christ himself.

He who was born of the Virgin Mary, the so-called son of the carpenter, the Son of the living God, as Peter confessed, came to make all of us “a kingdom of priests.”

The Second Vatican Council has reminded us of the mystery of this power, and of the fact that the mission of Christ—Priest, Teaching Prophet, King—continues in the Church. Everyone, the whole people of God has a part in this threefold mission. Perhaps in the past, we put the triple crown on the head of the Pope to express by such a symbol that the whole hierarchical order of the Church of Christ, all of Christ’s “sacred power” exercised in the Church, is nothing else but service, service that has one goal alone: that the whole People of God take part in this threefold mission of Christ, and remain always under the Lord’s power. His power comes not from the powers of this world, but from the heavenly Father and from the mystery of the Cross and of the Resurrection.

The absolute power of the Lord is even sweet and gentle. So, it answers all the depths of man; it answers his highest aspirations of intellect, of will, of heart. His power does not speak with a language of force, but it expresses itself in charity and in truth.

The new Successor of Peter in the See of Rome raises up today a fervent, humble, trusting prayer: “O Christ! Make me able to become and to be a servant of your unique power! A servant of your gentle power! A servant of your power that has no sundown! Make me able to be a servant! In fact, a servant of your servants!”

5. Brothers and Sisters! Do not be afraid to welcome Christ, and to accept his power!

Help the Pope and all who want to serve Christ and, with the power of Christ, to serve the human person and all of humanity!

Do not be afraid! Open, in fact, break down the doors for Christ!

To his saving power, open the borders of the Nations, the economic systems, the political systems, the vast fields of culture, of civilization, of development. Do not be afraid! Christ knows “what is in the heart of man.” He alone knows it!

So often today, man does not know what he carries inside himself, in the depth of his soul, of his heart. So often he is uncertain of the meaning of his life on earth. He is invaded by doubt that shifts into desperation. So then, allow—I beg you, I implore with humility and confidence—allow Christ to speak to man. Christ alone has words of life, yes, of eternal life.

Exactly today the entire Church celebrates “World Mission Sunday.” The Church prays, meditates and acts so that Christ’s words of life may reach all men and be received by them as a message of hope, of salvation, of total freedom.

6. I thank all those here who have chosen to take part in this solemn inauguration of the ministry of the new Successor of Peter.

I heartily thank the Heads of States, the Representatives of Authorities and the Government Delegations for their presence that so honors me.

Thank you, Most Eminent Cardinals of the Holy Roman Church!

I thank you, beloved Brother Bishops.

Thank you, Priests!

To you Sisters and Brothers, members of the Religious Orders and Congregations! Thank!

Thank you, Romans!

Thank you to the pilgrims gathered from all the world!

Thank you to all who are joined to this Sacred Rite through the Radio and the Television!

7. [The Holy Father begins to speak in Polish, and then briefly explains, as follows, what he said in Polish.]

This was an appeal and an invitation to prayer for the new Pope, an appeal expressed in the Polish language. Making the same appeal I turn to all the sons and daughters of the Catholic Church. Remember me today and always in your prayer.

[The Holy Father begins to speak in French. Afterwards, he says the following in English.]

To all of you who speak English I offer in the name of Christ a cordial greeting. I count on the support of your prayers and your good will in carrying out my mission of service to the Church and mankind. May Christ give you his grace and his peace, overturning the barriers of division and making all things one in him.

[Then, the Holy Father speaks in several other languages before concluding as follows.]

I open my heart to all the Brothers and Sisters of the Churches and Christian Communities, greeting, in particular, you who are present here, even as I look forward to our next personal meeting; but for now I express to you sincere appreciation for your choosing to attend this solemn rite.

Once again, I turn to all men, to each man (and with what veneration the apostle of Christ must pronounce this word: man!).

Pray for me!

Help me so that I can serve you! Amen.

This is per Catholic Culture.

John Paul II has managed to very cleverly word his denial of the most basic dogma of the Catholic faith: That Jesus Christ alone is God, along with the 2 other persons of the Trinity. Notice how he doesn't outright say that man is God, but he words his statement in an odd way, as if he was trying to hide his denial of Catholic dogma. What is key in understanding that he IS in fact denying the Catholic faith is his use of the phrase "new truth". Saying that Christ is God is not a "new truth", so why would he say such a thing, unless that wasn't really the point he was trying to make?

PartyIsOver221 · « **Reply #8 on:** August 13, 2011, 08:02:25 PM »

And Daegus, awesome signature. I was fist-pumping in the air as I read it.

Thanks for having that on.

PartyIsOver221 · « **Reply #9 on:** August 13, 2011, 08:06:53 PM »

Quote from: Daegus

Quote from: PartyIsOver221
Greg, thanks for posting this, but I was already sold JP2 was a heretic.

Nothing like more gravy on my mashed potatoes though... appreciate it.

If you appreciate that, I'm sure you'll appreciate this. John Paul II's first homily, in case people don't believe that he has taught that each man is Christ.

Quote
1. “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God” (Mt. 16:16)

Simon son of Jona pronounced these words in the territory of Caesarea Philippi. It is true that he expressed them with his own language, with a deep, lively and heartfelt conviction; but those words do not have their fountain, their source, in him: “because neither flesh or blood have revealed it to you, but my Father who is in heaven” (Mt. 16:17). These were words of Faith.

They mark the beginning of the mission of Peter in the history of salvation, in the history of the People of God. From that moment, from such a confession of Faith, the sacred history of the salvation of the People of God was to acquire a new dimension: to express itself in the historic dimension of the Church. This church-dimension of the history of the People of God has its beginnings, its birth, precisely in these words of Faith. This church-dimension of the history of the People of God is tied to the man who pronounced these words of Faith: “You are Peter—rock—and upon you, as upon a rock, I shall build my Church.”

2. This very day and in this place, the same words need to be again pronounced and listened to: “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

Yes, Brother and Sisters, Sons and Daughters, those words above all!

What they contain opens to our eyes the mystery of the living God, the mystery that the Son knows and has brought close to us. No one, in fact, has brought the living God close to men, no one has revealed Him as He himself alone has done. In our knowledge of God, in our journey towards God we are totally bound to the power of these words: “Whoever sees me, sees indeed the Father.” He who is Infinite, inscrutable, ineffable has brought himself close to us in Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son, born of the Virgin Mary in the stable of Bethlehem.

—All of you who already have the immense fortune to believe,

—all of you who are still searching for God,

—and even you who are tormented by doubt:

come and welcome one more time—today in this sacred place—the words pronounced by Simon Peter. In those words is the faith of the Church. In those same words is the new truth—in fact the last and definitive truth about man: the Son of the living God. “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God!”

3. Today the new Bishop of Rome solemnly begins his ministry and the mission of Peter. In this City, in fact, Peter unfolded and fulfilled the mission the Lord entrusted to him.

The Lord confronted him and said: “when you were younger you girded yourself and you went where you chose; but when you are old you will hold out your hands, and someone else will gird you and take you where you do not wish” (Jn. 21:18).

Peter came to Rome!

What guided and led him to this City, heart of the Roman Empire, if not obedience to the inspiration that came from the Lord? Perhaps this fisherman of Galilee would not have wanted to come all the way here. Perhaps he would have preferred to stay there, on the banks of the lake of Gennesaret, with his boat, with his nets. However, guided by the Lord, obedient to his inspiration, he came here!

According to an ancient tradition (which has also found magnificent literary expression in a novel by Henryk Sienkiewicz), during the persecution by Nero, Peter wanted to abandon Rome. However, the Lord intervened: he went to meet Peter. Peter turned to him and asked: “Quo vadis, Domine?” (Where are you going, Lord?). The Lord immediately answered him: “I go to Rome to be crucified for the second time.” Peter turned back to Rome and he stayed here until his own crucifixion.

Yes, Brothers and Sisters, Sons and Daughters, Rome is the See of Peter. Through the centuries new Bishops have always succeeded Peter in this See. Today a new Bishop ascends to the Roman Chair of Peter, a Bishop full of anxiety, knowing his unworthiness[/u]. How could anyone not be anxious when facing the greatness of such a calling, and when facing the universal mission of this Roman See?!

Today in Rome a Bishop who is not a Roman ascends to the See of Peter. A Bishop who is a son of Poland. However, from this moment on, even he becomes a Roman. Yes, a Roman! Furthermore, he is a son of a nation whose history, from its first awakenings, and whose thousand-year traditions are marked by a lively, strong, never-interrupted, heartfelt and living link with the See of Peter, a nation that has always remained faithful to the See of Rome. How inscrutable the plan of divine Providence!

4. In past centuries, when the Successor of Peter took possession of his See, the triple crown, the tiara, was placed on his head. The last man so crowned was Pope Paul VI in 1963. However, after the solemn rite of coronation he never again used the triple crown, and left to his Successors the freedom to decide about it.

Pope John Paul the First, whose memory is so alive in our hearts, did not wish the triple crown, and today his Successor does not want it. It is not the time, in fact, to return to a rite that, perhaps unjustly, was considered a symbol of the temporal power of the Popes.

Our time invites us, pushes us, obligates us to look to the Lord, and to plunge into a humble and devout meditation on the mystery of the supreme power of Christ himself.

He who was born of the Virgin Mary, the so-called son of the carpenter, the Son of the living God, as Peter confessed, came to make all of us “a kingdom of priests.”

The Second Vatican Council has reminded us of the mystery of this power, and of the fact that the mission of Christ—Priest, Teaching Prophet, King—continues in the Church. Everyone, the whole people of God has a part in this threefold mission. Perhaps in the past, we put the triple crown on the head of the Pope to express by such a symbol that the whole hierarchical order of the Church of Christ, all of Christ’s “sacred power” exercised in the Church, is nothing else but service, service that has one goal alone: that the whole People of God take part in this threefold mission of Christ, and remain always under the Lord’s power. His power comes not from the powers of this world, but from the heavenly Father and from the mystery of the Cross and of the Resurrection.

The absolute power of the Lord is even sweet and gentle. So, it answers all the depths of man; it answers his highest aspirations of intellect, of will, of heart. His power does not speak with a language of force, but it expresses itself in charity and in truth.

The new Successor of Peter in the See of Rome raises up today a fervent, humble, trusting prayer: “O Christ! Make me able to become and to be a servant of your unique power! A servant of your gentle power! A servant of your power that has no sundown! Make me able to be a servant! In fact, a servant of your servants!”

5. Brothers and Sisters! Do not be afraid to welcome Christ, and to accept his power!

Help the Pope and all who want to serve Christ and, with the power of Christ, to serve the human person and all of humanity!

Do not be afraid! Open, in fact, break down the doors for Christ!

To his saving power, open the borders of the Nations, the economic systems, the political systems, the vast fields of culture, of civilization, of development. Do not be afraid! Christ knows “what is in the heart of man.” He alone knows it!

So often today, man does not know what he carries inside himself, in the depth of his soul, of his heart. So often he is uncertain of the meaning of his life on earth. He is invaded by doubt that shifts into desperation. So then, allow—I beg you, I implore with humility and confidence—allow Christ to speak to man. Christ alone has words of life, yes, of eternal life.

Exactly today the entire Church celebrates “World Mission Sunday.” The Church prays, meditates and acts so that Christ’s words of life may reach all men and be received by them as a message of hope, of salvation, of total freedom.

6. I thank all those here who have chosen to take part in this solemn inauguration of the ministry of the new Successor of Peter.

I heartily thank the Heads of States, the Representatives of Authorities and the Government Delegations for their presence that so honors me.

Thank you, Most Eminent Cardinals of the Holy Roman Church!

I thank you, beloved Brother Bishops.

Thank you, Priests!

To you Sisters and Brothers, members of the Religious Orders and Congregations! Thank!

Thank you, Romans!

Thank you to the pilgrims gathered from all the world!

Thank you to all who are joined to this Sacred Rite through the Radio and the Television!

7. [The Holy Father begins to speak in Polish, and then briefly explains, as follows, what he said in Polish.]

This was an appeal and an invitation to prayer for the new Pope, an appeal expressed in the Polish language. Making the same appeal I turn to all the sons and daughters of the Catholic Church. Remember me today and always in your prayer.

[The Holy Father begins to speak in French. Afterwards, he says the following in English.]

To all of you who speak English I offer in the name of Christ a cordial greeting. I count on the support of your prayers and your good will in carrying out my mission of service to the Church and mankind. May Christ give you his grace and his peace, overturning the barriers of division and making all things one in him.

[Then, the Holy Father speaks in several other languages before concluding as follows.]

I open my heart to all the Brothers and Sisters of the Churches and Christian Communities, greeting, in particular, you who are present here, even as I look forward to our next personal meeting; but for now I express to you sincere appreciation for your choosing to attend this solemn rite.

Once again, I turn to all men, to each man (and with what veneration the apostle of Christ must pronounce this word: man!).

Pray for me!

Help me so that I can serve you! Amen.

This is per Catholic Culture.

To make it clear, in my previous post when I said I was sold, I meant that I agree and am already acknowledging the evidence that has been around for ages now.. not that I have already been sold this "load of crap" and thanks sarcastically for this extra one, Greg lol..

Daegus,

I am thankful for you posting this, haven't read it but I will when I get some free time. In the past few years I've already seen some many heresies from JP2 and Benedict that I feel punch-drunk and as if the world is in a trance with no hope of recovering, that is, on their own intellect and volition. It will require a massive transformation initiated from God, through force, through spiritual trials, through something, to get all the worldlings and false "Catholics" to change.

Oh I pray for the time to come...

Praise Jesus and all His Saints, His Kingdom, and the Blessed Virgin Mary forever and ever. Amen.

Gregory I · « **Reply #10 on:** August 13, 2011, 09:17:06 PM »

are you all familiar with the prophecy :

Here is the full prophecy.

"One from beyond the mountains shall become the Vicar Of God. Religious and clerics shall take part in this change.
Outside the true path, there will be only disreputable men; I shrug my shoulders when the Bark of Peter is in danger and there is no one to lend it help…The schismatic shall fall into the scorn of the Italian faithful…" By about twelve years shall the millennium have passed [2012 A.D.] when the resplendent mantle of legitimate power shall emerge from the shadows where it was being kept by the schism. And beyond harm from the one [the usurper antipope] who is blocking the door of salvation, for his deceitful schism shall have come to an end. And the mass of the faithful shall attach itself to the worthy Shepherd, who shall extricate each one from error and restore to the Church its beauty. He shall renew it."
(Prophecy of *Blessed Tomasuccio de Foligno, Profezie, 14th Century)

Santo Subito · « **Reply #11 on:** August 14, 2011, 01:30:52 AM »

Pope John Paul II , Vita Consecrata, no. 32: “As a way of showing forth the Church's holiness, it is to be recognized that the consecrated life, which mirrors Christ's own way of life, has an objective superiority. Precisely for this reason, it is an especially rich manifestation of Gospel values and a more complete expression of the Church's purpose, which is the sanctification of humanity. The consecrated life proclaims and in a certain way anticipates the future age, when the fullness of the Kingdom of Heaven, already present in its first fruits and in mystery,[62] will be achieved and when the children of the resurrection will take neither wife nor husband, but will be like the angels of God (cf. Mt. 22:30)”

Santo Subito · « **Reply #12 on:** August 14, 2011, 01:55:46 AM »

http://www.2012hoax.org/forum/t-259611/blessed-tomasuccio-prophecy

Quote

This relates to the Western Schism of the Catholic Church, which began in 1378 and lasted until 1411. Tomasuccio supported Urban VI, who was a reformer, trying to halt what he felt was corruption and influence peddling in the Catholic Church, which was a perceived problem during the time that the Papacy was seated in Avignon, France. Urban attempted to return the seat of the Catholic Church to Rome, which really irritated the Cardinals who had elected him (presumably because they were perfectly happy to be taking money from the French nobility in exchange for favors). The cardinals declared the election invalid, elected a new pope (Clement VII), and excommunicated Urban VI, all of which started the schism.

The schism itself was resolved in the early 15th century. However, the Tomasuccio writings were resurrected after 1958 and are being applied to another, nearly unknown schism in the Cathloic church. The site http://www.papalrestoration.com/ claims that Cardinal Siri of Genoa was the hand-picked successor to Pope Pius XII, and that a gathering of cardinals in opposition ( who were "most certainly all Masons" the site opines ) were ready to block Siri. The site also claims that Siri was elected as pope Gregory XVII, but was taken hostage by the cardinals, and that a false, apostate, pope was elected in his place.

It's all very twisted, with accusations of satanic plots by Masons, and claims that the current lineage of popes is invalid, etc.

But… that's why this particular writing is being pulled out of history. It is being used by this group to make their claim.

PartyIsOver221 · « **Reply #13 on:** August 14, 2011, 07:17:36 AM »

Quote from: Santo Subito

Pope John Paul II , Vita Consecrata, no. 32: “As a way of showing forth the Church's holiness, it is to be recognized that the consecrated life, which mirrors Christ's own way of life, has an objective superiority. Precisely for this reason, it is an especially rich manifestation of Gospel values and a more complete expression of the Church's purpose, which is the sanctification of humanity. The consecrated life proclaims and in a certain way anticipates the future age, when the fullness of the Kingdom of Heaven, already present in its first fruits and in mystery,[62] will be achieved and when the children of the resurrection will take neither wife nor husband, but will be like the angels of God (cf. Mt. 22:30)”

Typical hogwash , and two-faceness, from JP2. Not to mention the very wordy and Vatican-esque gobbledegook textual syntax that pervades all modernist writing.

Why can't he just say something matter of factly? Why does everything have to be worded in such a way it can be construed as something else? "Objective superiority"??? What about the "subjective equality" he may be hinting at?? See my point , SSubito?

This post isn't made in anger at you, but at your failure to see what most other traditional Catholics see, which is the contradiction in all these modern anti-popes.

Gregory I · « **Reply #14 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:30:20 AM »

It doesn't matter SUb, JPII said what he said. And the specific question is not whether consecrated life is greater than matrimony, but whether VIRGINITY as a natural stte is more pleasing to God than Matrimony as a natural state. JPII sid No. THat makes his teaching heretical prima facia. And when he uses the same terminology and objections of a heretic, we can only assume his familiarity, and thus pertinacity. He was no true pope, for he publicly defected from his office by publicly falling away from the catholic faith.