Author Topic: Pope Pius IX - Mason (Read 29073 times)

Roman Catholic · « **Reply #150 on:** September 04, 2010, 01:31:14 AM »

Quote from: DecemRationis

Roman Catholic,

Quote
Quote
Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, Session 6, ex cathedra said:
But the souls of those who depart this life in actual mortal sin, or in original sin alone, go down straightaway to hell to be punished, but with unequal pains.

And people here are calling me heretical?

As for Pope Pius VI, he did not call the rejection of Limbo heretical though. Nevertheless I do believe in Limbo, the least part of hell, but that the fire there is mildest. This position has been shared by saints and doctors also.

And of course, an unbaptized infant is living outside the Church, undeniably. Enter Pope Eugene once more:

Quote
Session 11 of the Council of Florence, ex cathedra said:
It firmly believes, professes and preaches that all those who are outside the catholic church, not only pagans but also Jews or heretics and schismatics, cannot share in eternal life and will go into the everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels

This is Catholicism folks, out of the mouth of the pope. Don't believe me? Go look it up.

Oh yeah, one last thing - unbaptized infants, who do they belong to, God or the devil, and are they truly innocent (I can't believe I'm having this discussion - ever heard of the Council of Trent's Decree on Original Sin)?

Quote
Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, Session 11, ex cathedra said:
With regard to children, since the danger of death is often present and the only remedy available to them is the sacrament of baptism by which they are snatched away from the dominion of the devil and adopted as children of God, it admonishes that sacred baptism is not to be deferred ...

So don't argue with me. Argue with the pope (and good luck with that).

DecemRationis,

Thanks. I had only glanced at the discussion that led to that post and still have not read most of it.
Clearly, CM had some things right; he was not in error or in heresy over everything that he held.

OHCA · « **Reply #151 on:** September 04, 2010, 07:27:36 PM »

I don't feel Classiccom has responded to my questions about inferences that can be drawn from his post to which I replied and the post in which he replied to me. Perhaps if I searched all of his posts I could find the answer. But I've only been on here a few days. I've read many interesting older posts, but it's information overload and time better spent reading other sources (such as the Bible, Saints' lives, etc.--no offense to this valuable forum) than to read all of the old posts.

Thus, I would appreciate if Classicom would answer the following:

1. I can only see 2 possible meanings in your post regarding did our Lord tell us to pray to Mary. a). Because our Lord did not tell us to do so, it is wrong that we do so; b). Though our lord did not tell us to do so, it is right that we do so anyway, thus demonstrating that Catholicism is not sola Scriptura. Please explain which of these you meant, or you meant something else that I'm missing about your position regarding prayer to the Blessed Virgin Mary. If you meant b), I suppose you meant that some source other than Scripture supports some point you were trying to make. If so, what specific source do point to and to support what point?

2. Please answer whether you believe the Apostolic chain is in peril of ceasing; and whether you believe it is possible or impossible for the Apostolic chain to cease.

Classiccom · « **Reply #152 on:** September 04, 2010, 08:55:57 PM »

Quote from: OHCA

I don't feel Classiccom has responded to my questions about inferences that can be drawn from his post to which I replied and the post in which he replied to me. Perhaps if I searched all of his posts I could find the answer. But I've only been on here a few days. I've read many interesting older posts, but it's information overload and time better spent reading other sources (such as the Bible, Saints' lives, etc.--no offense to this valuable forum) than to read all of the old posts.

Thus, I would appreciate if Classicom would answer the following:

1. I can only see 2 possible meanings in your post regarding did our Lord tell us to pray to Mary. a). Because our Lord did not tell us to do so, it is wrong that we do so; b). Though our lord did not tell us to do so, it is right that we do so anyway, thus demonstrating that Catholicism is not sola Scriptura. Please explain which of these you meant, or you meant something else that I'm missing about your position regarding prayer to the Blessed Virgin Mary. If you meant b), I suppose you meant that some source other than Scripture supports some point you were trying to make. If so, what specific source do point to and to support what point?

2. Please answer whether you believe the Apostolic chain is in peril of ceasing; and whether you believe it is possible or impossible for the Apostolic chain to cease.

=======================

I had exposure to Bayside NY so that turned me off to the whole rosary. FYI the Dimond bros. also were sucked into Bayside. My experience has been that Rosary people are much more superstitious and much less logical.

What good is the Apostolic chain when the last 10 links are probably in deep apostasy. If the Catholic clergy don't do their job, you are supposed to defend the true faith. Catholics today have abandoned Christ's words in the Gospel and are content to just roll along with the great apostasy.

Good news, I just found out that an Old Catholic Church is supposed to be opened in my area this year. Thanks for all the recent hard knocks that made me search for that information.

http://www.holyredeemerocc.org/

I just recently heard someone named CJ that gave a testimony her spiritual journey. I was impressed that it sounded Catholic in many ways, but without the turmoil and mumbo jumbo.

Nathan interviews - C. J. - a Sister in Christ
who gives a testimony of her real conversion.
She also saw Heaven and Hell !

http://www.watchmanscry.com/audio/broadcast_156.mp3

Roman Catholic · « **Reply #153 on:** September 04, 2010, 09:31:38 PM »

Quote from: Classiccom

I had exposure to Bayside NY so that turned me off to the whole rosary. FYI the Dimond bros. also were sucked into Bayside. My experience has been that Rosary people are much more superstitious and much less logical.

Why would someone who is intelligent, logical and of goodwill be turned off to the whole rosary, just because of exposure to Bayside NY?

That would be like someone claiming he is intelligent, logical and of goodwill, but turned off to the whole Roman Catholic Church because he ran afoul of some kooks in Bayside who claim to be Roman Catholics.

OHCA · « **Reply #154 on:** September 04, 2010, 10:49:45 PM »

Classicom,

Thanks for responding. I'm not familiar with Bayside NY. Could you please point me somewhere to see what you are talking about. It seems to me that prayers to the Blessed Virgin Mary and the saints is consistent with the concept of communion of saints as we are not praying to them as we do God, but rather it's for their intercession. At a very basic level, from my perspective it's nothing wrong with it just as there's nothing wrong with asking your priest or others in your parish to pray for you.

The Apostolic chain is important to me. So important that I feel compelled to suffer the chaos, watered-down, relaxed culture and customs to remain where I believe the Apostolic chain to be. I am attending the T.L.M. and praying for the discipline to attend it exclusively. If we are ever denied the "Motu," I will make effort to attend SSPX if their position remains as I perceive it to currently be. The reason it's important to me is it's a sign of the Church and is necessary to perpetuate Holy Orders and ultimately the other sacraments.

So I take it you either believe the true Church need not have the Apostolic chain, or that the true Church is dead or soon will be dead. I don't mean to be putting words in your mouth--I'm simply providing feedback for what I'm understanding you to be saying so you can confirm or straighten out my misunderstanding.

Roman Catholic,

You attend SSPX, right? You believe in the communion of saints, right?

OHCA · « **Reply #155 on:** September 05, 2010, 01:06:29 AM »

Roman Catholic,

Would you please PM me so perhaps I can PM you back. I can't be the initial PMer yet as I'm not an established member yet. Hopefully, I may be able to respond, though.

Thanks

Classiccom · « **Reply #156 on:** September 05, 2010, 11:09:34 AM »

Quote OCHA

"I'm not familiar with Bayside NY. Could you please point me somewhere to see what you are talking about. It seems to me that prayers to the Blessed Virgin Mary and the saints is consistent with the concept of communion of saints as we are not praying to them as we do God, but rather it's for their intercession. At a very basic level, from my perspective it's nothing wrong with it just as there's nothing wrong with asking your priest or others in your parish to pray for you."
=====================

I have experienced first hand how a "voicebox of the Devil" and the the traditional Catholic elect can work together. They have a lot in common with the typical Cathinfo member. If there were a few honest Catholics in the world, it could be acknowleged that a spirit can influence people to support apostasy in the Church, namely JPII and his 1986 paganfest at Assisi. This is swept under the rug and ignored because of the following implication : Fatima is a stamp of approval of Pius IX 's spiritual dictatorship of 1870.
(cινιℓ ωαr & vatican council 1870 - concentration of human power to achieve godlike status)

Christ warns us about signs and wonders , and doctines of demons. Funny you should talk about apostolic links. The links of the rosaries at Bayside would sometimes turn gold. If Catholics would only go back to Chist's words in the gospel as priority number one, then you would not have all the modernist confusion and diabolic alchemy.

The False Apparitions at Bayside, New York

http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/bayside_false_apparitions.html

=======================

Myrna brought up an interesting link

"The MOST Theological Collection: Vatican II vs Pius IX? A Study in Lefebvrism"

Any students of modern politics would recognize that TPTB always give us two false choices to choose from. What ever happened to Jesus Christ being the cornerstone of our Faith ?

innocenza · « **Reply #157 on:** September 05, 2010, 11:44:34 AM »

S.S., R.C. -

I'm surmising that Classicom knows how to spell the name of the Catholic Bible with no problem (if you noticed, R.C., he made a point of correcting your old-fashioned spelling of the past participle of the verb 'to spell').

I think Classicom was actually making a play on the phonetic similarity between 'Douay', and "Dewey" -- as in John Dewey, the notorious liberal philosopher whose theories had such a deleterious effect on American public school education, among other things. He was being a wit, in other words.

FWIW,
Janet C.

Classiccom · « **Reply #158 on:** September 05, 2010, 12:47:05 PM »

Quote from: innocenza

S.S., R.C. -

I'm surmising that Classicom knows how to spell the name of the Catholic Bible with no problem (if you noticed, R.C., he made a point of correcting your old-fashioned spelling of the past participle of the verb 'to spell').

I think Classicom was actually making a play on the phonetic similarity between 'Douay', and "Dewey" -- as in John Dewey, the notorious liberal philosopher whose theories had such a deleterious effect on American public school education, among other things. He was being a wit, in other words.

FWIW,
Janet C.

Hard to believe a spelling mistake would arouse this much rancor. It is Satanic to strain a gnat and totally ignore the original subject matter. That is the way the Devil operates - any time the truth is uttered, shut it down. With recent hate crime legislation, I think the bibles will soon be outlawed.

Recently I found that many Protestants like the Douay Rheims translation, even the hard core anti-Catholic Bible thumpers. I guess it blows their mind how the Church in apostasy can have such a good bible.

Douay-Rheims Bible Amos 8:11

Behold the days come, saith the Lord, and I will send forth a famine into the land: not a famine of bread, nor a thirst of water, but of hearing the word of the Lord.

Is that why the Pope sent 33 Rosaries to the Chile miners instead of one Bible ?

ServusSpiritusSancti · « **Reply #159 on:** September 05, 2010, 05:46:43 PM »

Quote from: Classiccom

Quote from: OHCA
I don't feel Classiccom has responded to my questions about inferences that can be drawn from his post to which I replied and the post in which he replied to me. Perhaps if I searched all of his posts I could find the answer. But I've only been on here a few days. I've read many interesting older posts, but it's information overload and time better spent reading other sources (such as the Bible, Saints' lives, etc.--no offense to this valuable forum) than to read all of the old posts.

Thus, I would appreciate if Classicom would answer the following:

1. I can only see 2 possible meanings in your post regarding did our Lord tell us to pray to Mary. a). Because our Lord did not tell us to do so, it is wrong that we do so; b). Though our lord did not tell us to do so, it is right that we do so anyway, thus demonstrating that Catholicism is not sola Scriptura. Please explain which of these you meant, or you meant something else that I'm missing about your position regarding prayer to the Blessed Virgin Mary. If you meant b), I suppose you meant that some source other than Scripture supports some point you were trying to make. If so, what specific source do point to and to support what point?

2. Please answer whether you believe the Apostolic chain is in peril of ceasing; and whether you believe it is possible or impossible for the Apostolic chain to cease.

=======================

I had exposure to Bayside NY so that turned me off to the whole rosary. FYI the Dimond bros. also were sucked into Bayside. My experience has been that Rosary people are much more superstitious and much less logical.

What good is the Apostolic chain when the last 10 links are probably in deep apostasy. If the Catholic clergy don't do their job, you are supposed to defend the true faith. Catholics today have abandoned Christ's words in the Gospel and are content to just roll along with the great apostasy.

Good news, I just found out that an Old Catholic Church is supposed to be opened in my area this year. Thanks for all the recent hard knocks that made me search for that information.

http://www.holyredeemerocc.org/

I just recently heard someone named CJ that gave a testimony her spiritual journey. I was impressed that it sounded Catholic in many ways, but without the turmoil and mumbo jumbo.

Nathan interviews - C. J. - a Sister in Christ
who gives a testimony of her real conversion.
She also saw Heaven and Hell !

http://www.watchmanscry.com/audio/broadcast_156.mp3

This post shows you are a CINO Catholic, Catholic In-Name only. Just like CM you reject nearly every teaching of the Catholic Church and make up your own. People who say The Rosary are more superstitious? I can prove that statement incredibly wrong since I do not practice any kind of superstition.

ServusSpiritusSancti · « **Reply #160 on:** September 05, 2010, 05:48:53 PM »

Quote from: Classiccom

Quote from: innocenza
S.S., R.C. -

I'm surmising that Classicom knows how to spell the name of the Catholic Bible with no problem (if you noticed, R.C., he made a point of correcting your old-fashioned spelling of the past participle of the verb 'to spell').

I think Classicom was actually making a play on the phonetic similarity between 'Douay', and "Dewey" -- as in John Dewey, the notorious liberal philosopher whose theories had such a deleterious effect on American public school education, among other things. He was being a wit, in other words.

FWIW,
Janet C.

Hard to believe a spelling mistake would arouse this much rancor. It is Satanic to strain a gnat and totally ignore the original subject matter. That is the way the Devil operates - any time the truth is uttered, shut it down. With recent hate crime legislation, I think the bibles will soon be outlawed.

Recently I found that many Protestants like the Douay Rheims translation, even the hard core anti-Catholic Bible thumpers. I guess it blows their mind how the Church in apostasy can have such a good bible.

Douay-Rheims Bible Amos 8:11

Behold the days come, saith the Lord, and I will send forth a famine into the land: not a famine of bread, nor a thirst of water, but of hearing the word of the Lord.

Is that why the Pope sent 33 Rosaries to the Chile miners instead of one Bible ?

If it is Satanic to ignore the original subject matter, then you are also at fault. I've seen you ignore many people's questions here.

OHCA · « **Reply #161 on:** September 05, 2010, 08:16:15 PM »

I perceive Classiccom to have little concern about, or to have completely despaired of any hope for, traditional Catholicism and the Apostolic chain. His posts are more about why such concerns are evil (the Rosary), no longer important (the Apostolic chain), etc. I wish a Sede who is very upset about his perception of the state of the Apostolic chain and has hope that the chain will again be clarified, and who holds true to traditional Catholic principles would discredit Classiccom.

Classiccom's position on the Apostolic chain (uncaring or despair), the Rosary, reference to "false church" (with apparent callous boastfulness rather than worry), appear nothing short of blasphemous!

Rather than traditional Catholicism being restored, Classiccom, at least implicitly, is telling us that ship has sank and we should do something else. This is most definitely something other than a Catholic perspective!

Classiccom, I pray for your return or converision to the true Faith, the true Church established by our Lord, with which He shall be until the end of the world, and against which the fires of hell shall not prevail!

Roman Catholic · « **Reply #162 on:** September 06, 2010, 05:31:29 AM »

Quote from: OHCA

Roman Catholic,

Would you please PM me so perhaps I can PM you back. I can't be the initial PMer yet as I'm not an established member yet. Hopefully, I may be able to respond, though.

Thanks

I sent you a PM.

OHCA · « **Reply #163 on:** September 06, 2010, 09:38:49 AM »

Thanks Roman Catholic. I can see that I have 2 PMs now, but when I try to access the messenger bar I get the same "established member" thing I was getting in trying to send out. Hopefully I'll be able to use it soon.

Thanks

MyrnaM · « **Reply #164 on:** September 06, 2010, 10:07:55 AM »

Quote from: OHCA

Thanks Roman Catholic. I can see that I have 2 PMs now, but when I try to access the messenger bar I get the same "established member" thing I was getting in trying to send out. Hopefully I'll be able to use it soon.

Thanks

That happens to all of us, when we are new. Very soon now, you will be considered one of us. Not sure if that is good or bad. :confused1:

You can always put classicom on hide!