Author Topic: Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves" (Read 3173 times)

stevusmagnus · « **Reply #10 on:** December 21, 2010, 02:16:53 PM »

Bishop Fellay is not betraying anything. He has common sense and prudence which is why he was chosen to be Superior General. Any idiot knows you don't go unneccessarily irritating a party you are in discussions with by spouting polemical rhetoric. The Society has made principled stands against the post-conciliar revolution even after the negotiations started, including comments critical of the Pope's new book on their website. Just because the Society is not shouting insults towards the Pope doesn't mean they are sell-outs who have lost the Faith.

When ABL was talking and meeting with Rome, was the Society at the same time callling the Pope names publicly? I highly doubt it. It would be stupid. Rome has done the same and is not "calling out" the Society as the talks ensue. Both sides toned down the rhetoric to build an atmosphere where both sides could talk without unneccessary polemics, tensions, and animosity.

hollingsworth · « **Reply #11 on:** December 21, 2010, 03:18:07 PM »

Quote

Bishop Fellay is not betraying anything. He has common sense and prudence which is why he was chosen to be Superior General.

You're sure that's why +F was chosen SG? I will agree, he's got good political sense. He has been described in recent months as a "master politician."

Quote

Any idiot knows you don't go unneccessarily irritating a party you are in discussions with by spouting polemical rhetoric.

I think the "polemical rhetoric" was carried on a number of years ago, publicly, by the Abp. himself "They have left the Faith." "The New Mass is a bastard rite, the new sacraments are bastard sacraments." They're turning out from the seminaries "bastard priests," who "do not know who they are." "The Conciliar Church is a schismatic church." You mean that kind of "polemical rhetoric?" Are you implying that after saying such things, the Archbishop would then, intermittantly, trot off to Rome and treat the Romans as if they were brothers in arms, and as if he had really never said the things he did? Poppycock!

Quote

Both sides toned down the rhetoric to build an atmosphere where both sides could talk without unneccessary polemics, tensions, and animosity.

Agreed. +F can make it appear in these days that his old boss really never took the positions which he did. It's almost as if the slate had been wiped clean and the earlier "tensions" and "amimosity" suddenly disappear in this 'new springtime' of negotiations.

I'll tell you all quite frankly and openly, Fellay has lost me.

stevusmagnus · « **Reply #12 on:** December 21, 2010, 04:22:44 PM »

Hollingsworth,

You are selectively quoting ABL. Please show me where, during the 1988 negotiations with Rome, ABL was spouting off publicly as to how terrible Rome was.

Of course ABL criticized Rome and events after VCII as they transpired. BF has done the same and so has the Society. After the '88 consecrations the rhetoric stepped up again. The same problems and differences remained, but the attitudes on both sides became hardened and thus the tone of the language became harsher.

No matter if BF is screaming that the Pope has lost his mind or if he is subtely pointing out differences, the exact same differences remain. The tone, type, and amount of rhetoric naturally ebbs and flows depending on the attitudes of the two parties. This is not the Rome of 1988 and this is not JPII. This Pope has ceded to ALL THREE "pre-conditions" Bishop Fellay placed on them. Amazing when you consider Rome is obeying the conditions of a small group of Traditionalists.

The Pope freed the Mass, remitted the "excommunications", and has set up a group of theologians to discuss doctrine with the Society. The Pope gave BF everything he wanted and the Society gave NOTHING in return! Is that not pretty damn good leadership and effectiveness?

Now that they were victorious on all three counts and discussions are ongoing, does it make ANY sense to start raving publicly about Rome? To do so would play EXACTLY into the hands of the liberals who are looking for ANY excuse to point fingers and yell why the Society should remain "outside". The German Bishops freaking out was a great victory for the Society as they had the opportunity to back the Pope in rebuking them, thereby marginalizing the liberals.

The Modernists did not take over by shouting their disdain for Tradition from the rooftops. They took over by being smart and using prudence.

Don't mistake Bishop Fellay's practicality and craftiness for weakness. He knows exactly what he is doing.

hollingsworth · « **Reply #13 on:** December 21, 2010, 05:44:35 PM »

stevus:

Quote

You are selectively quoting ABL.

This is an opportunity for you to select other quotes from the Archbishop which soften or mitigate the blows of those quotes I have provided above, or, for that matter, contradict them in any way. Good hunting.

Roman Catholic · « **Reply #14 on:** December 21, 2010, 06:47:36 PM »

Quote from: stevusmagnus

The Modernists did not take over by shouting their disdain for Tradition from the rooftops. They took over by being smart and using prudence.

Prudence is a virtue. The Modernists are crafty, sneaky, deceptive, and cunning. Yes they are intelligent too. Diabollically clever.