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Offline stevusmagnus

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Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
« on: December 20, 2010, 12:41:17 PM »
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  • http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2010/12/only-truth-saves.html

    In the vision of Saint Hildegard, the face of the Church is stained with dust, and this is how we have seen it. Her garment is torn – by the sins of priests. The way she saw and expressed it is the way we have experienced it this year. We must accept this humiliation as an exhortation to truth and a call to renewal. Only the truth saves. We must ask ourselves what we can do to repair as much as possible the injustice that has occurred. We must ask ourselves what was wrong in our proclamation, in our whole way of living the Christian life, to allow such a thing to happen. We must discover a new resoluteness in faith and in doing good. We must be capable of doing penance. We must be determined to make every possible effort in priestly formation to prevent anything of the kind from happening again. This is also the moment to offer heartfelt thanks to all those who work to help victims and to restore their trust in the Church, their capacity to believe her message. In my meetings with victims of this sin, I have also always found people who, with great dedication, stand alongside those who suffer and have been damaged. This is also the occasion to thank the many good priests who act as channels of the Lord’s goodness in humility and fidelity and, amid the devastations, bear witness to the unforfeited beauty of the priesthood.


    We are well aware of the particular gravity of this sin committed by priests and of our corresponding responsibility. But neither can we remain silent regarding the context of these times in which these events have come to light. There is a market in child pornography that seems in some way to be considered more and more normal by society. The psychological destruction of children, in which human persons are reduced to articles of merchandise, is a terrifying sign of the times. From Bishops of developing countries I hear again and again how sexual tourism threatens an entire generation and damages its freedom and its human dignity. The Book of Revelation includes among the great sins of Babylon – the symbol of the world’s great irreligious cities – the fact that it trades with bodies and souls and treats them as commodities (cf. Rev 18:13). In this context, the problem of drugs also rears its head, and with increasing force extends its octopus tentacles around the entire world – an eloquent expression of the tyranny of mammon which perverts mankind. No pleasure is ever enough, and the excess of deceiving intoxication becomes a violence that tears whole regions apart – and all this in the name of a fatal misunderstanding of freedom which actually undermines man’s freedom and ultimately destroys it.


    In order to resist these forces, we must turn our attention to their ideological foundations. In the 1970s, paedophilia was theorized as something fully in conformity with man and even with children. This, however, was part of a fundamental perversion of the concept of ethos. It was maintained – even within the realm of Catholic theology – that there is no such thing as evil in itself or good in itself. There is only a “better than” and a “worse than”. Nothing is good or bad in itself. Everything depends on the circumstances and on the end in view. Anything can be good or also bad, depending upon purposes and circumstances. Morality is replaced by a calculus of consequences, and in the process it ceases to exist. The effects of such theories are evident today. Against them, Pope John Paul II, in his 1993 Encyclical Letter Veritatis Splendor, indicated with prophetic force in the great rational tradition of Christian ethos the essential and permanent foundations of moral action. Today, attention must be focussed anew on this text as a path in the formation of conscience. It is our responsibility to make these criteria audible and intelligible once more for people today as paths of true humanity, in the context of our paramount concern for mankind.


    Benedict XVI
    Address by the Holy Father
    on the occasion of Christmas greetings to the Roman Curia
    20 December 2010

    Offline Belloc

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #1 on: December 20, 2010, 01:07:38 PM »
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  • may he then fully find the truth, not cling to his liberalism.... :pray: :incense:
    Proud "European American" and prouder, still, Catholic


    Offline LM

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #2 on: December 20, 2010, 01:15:53 PM »
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  • When Creed and the Church are in destruction, moral fiber (among other things) will also disintegrate.

    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #3 on: December 21, 2010, 09:02:47 AM »
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  • Rorate Blog proudly titles the piece "Only Truth Saves" as if the Pope said something bravely Traditional. I suppose they have to savor every apparent crumb they are thrown.

    What is left UNsaid is the following:

    Truth saves.
    Jesus is the Truth.
    Everyone is saved through the Incarnation as we all share Jesus' human nature.
    Therefore everyone is saved through Jesus whether they know it or not.

    The phrase "only the Truth saves" is orthodox to Trads who ascribe to it a Traditional interpretation. And it is ok with libs who ascribe a heretical interpretation.

    Once again more VCII double speak, using undefined vague ambiguous terminology to say all things to all people while truly saying nothing.

    Offline Roman Catholic

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #4 on: December 21, 2010, 09:25:32 AM »
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  • Quote from: stevusmagnus


    Once again more VCII double speak, using undefined vague ambiguous terminology to say all things to all people while truly saying nothing.



    The protagonists are very accomplished at their craft.


    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #5 on: December 21, 2010, 09:42:35 AM »
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  • Ambiguous phrases in Pope's address...

    Quote
    We must accept this humiliation as an exhortation to truth and a call to renewal. Only the truth saves.


    Quote
    We must discover a new resoluteness in faith and in doing good.


     
    Quote
    Against them, Pope John Paul II, in his 1993 Encyclical Letter Veritatis Splendor, indicated with prophetic force in the great rational tradition of Christian ethos the essential and permanent foundations of moral action. Today, attention must be focussed anew on this text as a path in the formation of conscience. It is our responsibility to make these criteria audible and intelligible once more for people today as paths of true humanity, in the context of our paramount concern for mankind.


    Huh??

    Offline hollingsworth

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #6 on: December 21, 2010, 11:42:46 AM »
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  • Benedict is exactly what Abp. Lefebvre said he and the rest of them are, viz. "anti-Christs"  That was more than 20 years ago.  Now, it appears, the order has gone out from Menzingen:  Don't say anything bad about the pope.  We have moved from the Archbishop's all but total rejection of the Romans to Fellay's almost complete acceptance of them.

    Offline Telesphorus

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #7 on: December 21, 2010, 11:46:18 AM »
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  • Quote from: hollingsworth
    Benedict is exactly what Abp. Lefebvre said he and the rest of them are, viz. "anti-Christs"  That was more than 20 years ago.  Now, it appears, the order has gone out from Menzingen:  Don't say anything bad about the pope.  We have moved from the Archbishop's all but total rejection of the Romans to Fellay's almost complete acceptance of them.


    Yes, the society leadership has betrayed Archbishop Lefebvre's mission.


    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #8 on: December 21, 2010, 12:16:13 PM »
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  • Quote from: hollingsworth
    Benedict is exactly what Abp. Lefebvre said he and the rest of them are, viz. "anti-Christs"  That was more than 20 years ago.  Now, it appears, the order has gone out from Menzingen:  Don't say anything bad about the pope.  We have moved from the Archbishop's all but total rejection of the Romans to Fellay's almost complete acceptance of them.


    Not true. ABL was always open to talking to Rome and always pledged allegiance to the office of the Papacy. The rhetoric ebbs and flows from time to time. The Society is still critical of many things in the Church and just criticized the Pope's own statements.

    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #9 on: December 21, 2010, 01:55:20 PM »
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  • Quote from: Telesphorus
    Quote from: hollingsworth
    Benedict is exactly what Abp. Lefebvre said he and the rest of them are, viz. "anti-Christs"  That was more than 20 years ago.  Now, it appears, the order has gone out from Menzingen:  Don't say anything bad about the pope.  We have moved from the Archbishop's all but total rejection of the Romans to Fellay's almost complete acceptance of them.


    Yes, the society leadership has betrayed Archbishop Lefebvre's mission.


    Not exactly. If anything, it is Fellay who has betrayed LeFebvre's mission and is trying to get the rest of the Society to as well. Unless of course, Fellay is just putting on some act so he won't get in trouble like Bishop Williamson did.

    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #10 on: December 21, 2010, 02:16:53 PM »
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  • Bishop Fellay is not betraying anything. He has common sense and prudence which is why he was chosen to be Superior General. Any idiot knows you don't go unneccessarily irritating a party you are in discussions with by spouting polemical rhetoric. The Society has made principled stands against the post-conciliar revolution even after the negotiations started, including comments critical of the Pope's new book on their website. Just because the Society is not shouting insults towards the Pope doesn't mean they are sell-outs who have lost the Faith.

    When ABL was talking and meeting with Rome, was the Society at the same time callling the Pope names publicly? I highly doubt it. It would be stupid. Rome has done the same and is not "calling out" the Society as the talks ensue. Both sides toned down the rhetoric to build an atmosphere where both sides could talk without unneccessary polemics, tensions, and animosity.


    Offline hollingsworth

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #11 on: December 21, 2010, 03:18:07 PM »
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  • Quote
    Bishop Fellay is not betraying anything. He has common sense and prudence which is why he was chosen to be Superior General.


    You're sure that's why +F was chosen SG?  I will agree, he's got good political sense.  He has been described in recent months as a "master politician."

    Quote
    Any idiot knows you don't go unneccessarily irritating a party you are in discussions with by spouting polemical rhetoric.


    I think the "polemical rhetoric" was carried on a number of years ago, publicly, by the Abp. himself  "They have left the Faith."  "The New Mass is a bastard rite, the new sacraments are bastard sacraments." They're turning out from the seminaries  "bastard priests," who "do not know who they are."  "The Conciliar Church is a schismatic church."  You mean that kind of "polemical rhetoric?" Are you implying that after saying such things, the Archbishop would then, intermittantly, trot off to Rome and treat the Romans as if they were brothers in arms, and as if he had really never said the things he did?  Poppycock!

    Quote
    Both sides toned down the rhetoric to build an atmosphere where both sides could talk without unneccessary polemics, tensions, and animosity.


    Agreed.  +F can make it appear in these days that his old boss really never took the positions which he did.  It's almost as if the slate had been wiped clean and the earlier "tensions" and "amimosity" suddenly disappear in this 'new springtime' of negotiations.

    I'll tell you all quite frankly and openly, Fellay has lost me.



    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #12 on: December 21, 2010, 04:22:44 PM »
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  • Hollingsworth,

    You are selectively quoting ABL. Please show me where, during the 1988 negotiations with Rome, ABL was spouting off publicly as to how terrible Rome was.

    Of course ABL criticized Rome and events after VCII as they transpired. BF has done the same and so has the Society. After the '88 consecrations the rhetoric stepped up again. The same problems and differences remained, but the attitudes on both sides became hardened and thus the tone of the language became harsher.

    No matter if BF is screaming that the Pope has lost his mind or if he is subtely pointing out differences, the exact same differences remain. The tone, type, and amount of rhetoric naturally ebbs and flows depending on the attitudes of the two parties. This is not the Rome of 1988 and this is not JPII. This Pope has ceded to ALL THREE "pre-conditions" Bishop Fellay placed on them. Amazing when you consider Rome is obeying the conditions of a small group of Traditionalists.

    The Pope freed the Mass, remitted the "excommunications", and has set up a group of theologians to discuss doctrine with the Society. The Pope gave BF everything he wanted and the Society gave NOTHING in return! Is that not pretty damn good leadership and effectiveness?

    Now that they were victorious on all three counts and discussions are ongoing, does it make ANY sense to start raving publicly about Rome? To do so would play EXACTLY into the hands of the liberals who are looking for ANY excuse to point fingers and yell why the Society should remain "outside". The German Bishops freaking out was a great victory for the Society as they had the opportunity to back the Pope in rebuking them, thereby marginalizing the liberals.

    The Modernists did not take over by shouting their disdain for Tradition from the rooftops. They took over by being smart and using prudence.

    Don't mistake Bishop Fellay's practicality and craftiness for weakness. He knows exactly what he is doing.

    Offline hollingsworth

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #13 on: December 21, 2010, 05:44:35 PM »
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  • stevus:
    Quote
    You are selectively quoting ABL.


    This is an opportunity for you to select other quotes from the Archbishop which soften or mitigate the blows of those quotes I have provided above, or, for that matter,  contradict them in any way.  Good hunting.

    Offline Roman Catholic

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    Pope BXVI: "Only the Truth Saves"
    « Reply #14 on: December 21, 2010, 06:47:36 PM »
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  • Quote from: stevusmagnus


    The Modernists did not take over by shouting their disdain for Tradition from the rooftops. They took over by being smart and using prudence.



    Prudence is a virtue. The Modernists are crafty, sneaky, deceptive, and cunning. Yes they are intelligent too. Diabollically clever.

     

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