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Traditional Catholic Faith => Crisis in the Church => Topic started by: Mr G on August 28, 2018, 12:28:31 PM

Title: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Mr G on August 28, 2018, 12:28:31 PM
http://radtradthomist.chojnowski.me/2018/08/original-photo-of-meeting-between-paul.html

The Amazing Appearance of "Sister Lucy" 
 
 

Dr. Chojnowski: Due to the diligent work of a co-worker in the Sister Lucy Truth project, we have come up with the original picture of the first appearance of Sister Lucy II. As you can see by examining the two pictures, the TV camera still appears in the background of the superimposed "Sister Lucy". This was the faked picture that the plastic surgeon immediately recognized was "photoshopped." Sister Lucy II's face is slightly turned from the source photo, so as to make the eyes point in the proper direction. One of the strange things that can be noticed about Paul VI's arm is that in the faked picture, the fingers of his right hand are much farther away from his left sleeve than they are in the original photo. When you look at Sister Lucy II in this photo for a while the faked nature of the photo becomes perfectly clear. 
 
Below are the source photos from which the picture of Sister Lucy II was clearly taken. To prove that this is not simply some internet photoshopping, we present the official publication (Blue Army) in which one instance of the photo appears. 

Also, Supporters of Sister Lucy Truth: I have been away for the last couple of weeks at a location in which the internet is very sketchy. As I have mentioned at the beginning of this month, we are now busy putting together the professional reports from private investigators, facial recognition experts, plastic surgeons, a prosthodontist, and a ophthalmologist. 

When I started this effort I did not realize how much time it would take to produce these reports and collect them into a single file. I am dependent on their schedules --- which are tight. The working is being done. I will publish the results about this case as soon as I am able --- I realize it is late August. Please be generous in your support of Sister Lucy Truth. The bills are coming in. Nothing in this work, except the work of myself and some generous associates, is for free, unfortunately. In a way that is a good thing, since we know that we are getting professional analysis. 

I will publish the source pictures tomorrow, so that I can get this posting up without problems today.




 
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Struthio on August 28, 2018, 01:07:59 PM
I found such photomontages some months ago without using software. Here another example:


(https://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/Article_pictures/fakelucia_withP6.jpg)

(https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-v1uUEUXXfaI/WmSIInw35_I/AAAAAAAACDg/vf6w3HPdNmw2MQN_oYg1Z5RiL67MuhDXACLcBGAs/s1600/paul.jpg)

Also, I did a research to find out who first published these compositions. The Hemeroteca Municipal de Lisboa (a library not for books but for journals) has a special page with roughly 20 publications of the 1967 visit of Paul VI in Fátima:

hemerotecadigital.cm-lisboa.pt/EFEMERIDES/fatima/fatima.htm (http://hemerotecadigital.cm-lisboa.pt/EFEMERIDES/fatima/fatima.htm)


The journal Stella ("revista católica de cultura feminina") is a publication of the Congregação das Irmãs Reparadoras de Nossa Senhora de Fátima (http://www.reparadorasfatima.pt). The issues of May 1967 and June 1967 can be found here (http://hemerotecadigital.cm-lisboa.pt/Periodicos/Stella/Stella.htm).


The titlepage of May 1967 shows the following photomontage:

(http://hemerotecadigital.cm-lisboa.pt/Periodicos/Stella/N357_Mai1967/N357_Mai1967_master/JPG/Stella_Mai1967_0000a_capa.jpg)

This issue contains a total of three such photomontages (see link above) including the one Chonowski shows.

Then there is the monthly periodical Fátima 50 ("revista mensal de actualidades docuмental e ilustrada") published by the "Santuário de Nossa Senhora de Fátima", which a few weeks after the event republished two of the same photomontages.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Struthio on August 28, 2018, 01:25:53 PM
I suspect that the true sister Lúcia was "on stage" together with Paul VI., and can be seen in the RTP video of the event. But then, the false sister Lúcia is inserted into some photos already in 1967.


Paulo VI – Peregrino de Fátima, Video on rtp.pt, 45'00" (https://arquivos.rtp.pt/conteudos/paulo-vi-peregrino-de-fatima/)


RTP = Rádio e Televisão de Portugal
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: SeanJohnson on August 28, 2018, 01:33:36 PM
I suspect that the true sister Lúcia was "on stage" together with Paul VI., and can be seen in the RTP video of the event. But then, the false sister Lúcia is inserted into some photos already in 1967.


Paulo VI – Peregrino de Fátima, Video on rtp.pt, 45'00" (https://arquivos.rtp.pt/conteudos/paulo-vi-peregrino-de-fatima/)


RTP = Rádio e Televisão de Portugal

Lol, would that be the “real” Paul VI, or the doppelgänger with the misplaced earlobes?

:popcorn:
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Struthio on August 28, 2018, 02:54:29 PM
Lol, would that be the “real” Paul VI, or the doppelgänger with the misplaced earlobes?

:popcorn:

Good question! Paul VI. or Faul VI.?

:laugh1:
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Neil Obstat on August 28, 2018, 05:19:24 PM
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Not to change the topic, but I couldn't help but notice this one comment under the OP article on the source page:
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August 15, 2018 at 6:17 AM (http://radtradthomist.chojnowski.me/2018/08/fraud-facial-recognition-technology.html?showComment=1534339051435#c7027808750062521034)
Our Lady would never say "the survivors woujld [would] envy the dead". That is a false apparition from the Novus Ordo and in front of the Novus Ordo empty tabernacle during a Novus Ordo "Eucharistic prayer" from Vatican II Bishop. Like many false apparitions and Novus Ordo carry'ons it is promoted by Bishop Williamson to good folk, perhaps good folk like you. Don't fall for it. It might sound real but the Novus Ordo Church is not the Catholic Church and if they approve an apparition is [it] holds no more water than their approval of the New Mass and various heresies. Stay with Fatima, La Salette, Rue de Bac and all pre-Vatican II approved apparitions and stay away from Bishop Williamson the deceiver and ?Rosicrucian poetry-teller.
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Somebody has some pretty powerful animosity toward +RW. Almost as if they're ready to blame him for all these problems -- who knows what he's going to be accused of next! Perhaps it's a crypto-Zionist creeping in to do damage by subterfuge, getting even for the unforgivable sin of "anti-Semitism!"

Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: SeanJohnson on August 28, 2018, 05:34:09 PM
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Not to change the topic, but I couldn't help but notice this one comment under the OP article on the source page:
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August 15, 2018 at 6:17 AM (http://radtradthomist.chojnowski.me/2018/08/fraud-facial-recognition-technology.html?showComment=1534339051435#c7027808750062521034)
Our Lady would never say "the survivors woujld [would] envy the dead". That is a false apparition from the Novus Ordo and in front of the Novus Ordo empty tabernacle during a Novus Ordo "Eucharistic prayer" from Vatican II Bishop. Like many false apparitions and Novus Ordo carry'ons it is promoted by Bishop Williamson to good folk, perhaps good folk like you. Don't fall for it. It might sound real but the Novus Ordo Church is not the Catholic Church and if they approve an apparition is [it] holds no more water than their approval of the New Mass and various heresies. Stay with Fatima, La Salette, Rue de Bac and all pre-Vatican II approved apparitions and stay away from Bishop Williamson the deceiver and ?Rosicrucian poetry-teller.
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Somebody has some pretty powerful animosity toward +RW. Almost as if they're ready to blame him for all these problems -- who knows what he's going to be accused of next! Perhaps it's a crypto-Zionist creeping in to do damage by subterfuge, getting even for the unforgivable sin of "anti-Semitism!"

This recurring accusation of +BW being a Rosicrucian Freemason is addressed in Dr. White's biography of the bishop.

Explaining the heraldic symbolism of Bishop Williamson's episcopal coat of arms, Dr. White says:

"Beneath the lion is a cross with an English rose, the flower of England...His Excellency neglected to recall that the Rosicrucians, early ancestors of the Freemasons, also place a rose on the cross, leading in later years to the accusation that he is an infiltrator from that secret society.  He is used to such accusations, as his friendship with Malcolm Mugeridge has been used as proof of his Fabian socialist allegiances and his connection with certain priests and his ordaining of certain seminarians has been taken as proof that he is 'light in the loafers.' His response to such allegations is a simple one: 'Let the dogs bark.'" (p. 147)
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Ladislaus on August 28, 2018, 07:55:24 PM
St. Therese is also usually depicted as holding a crucifix with roses on/around it.  Maybe she was a Rosicrucian too?
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Jovita on August 29, 2018, 08:41:07 PM
(https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-xsgEO8sZ3ho/W4Qtt_mENEI/AAAAAAAABB4/buN7CZAbZcAxJGnv--vz772RBq39D50XQCLcBGAs/s1600/Tampered%2BPhoto%2B-%2BPaul%2BVI%2Band%2BLucy.jpg)
Above 'Lucy's' head I see the mysterious Babuska Lady from the grassy knoll. In the photo of the Pope alone, she is by his nose. She must nose the truth.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Neil Obstat on August 29, 2018, 09:35:30 PM
(https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-xsgEO8sZ3ho/W4Qtt_mENEI/AAAAAAAABB4/buN7CZAbZcAxJGnv--vz772RBq39D50XQCLcBGAs/s1600/Tampered%2BPhoto%2B-%2BPaul%2BVI%2Band%2BLucy.jpg)
Above 'Lucy's' head I see the mysterious Babuska Lady ... In the photo of the Pope alone, she is by his nose.
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Good eye! In the second photo her face is overexposed and looking whiter, like the rest of the photo. She appears to have moved a bit upwards, and to the right around 5 feet, using the TV camera's position as a benchmark. In the second photo you can only see the top left corner of the TV camera, since the fake Lucy was overdubbed to cover most of the TV camera's frontal aspect.
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If you look carefully you can see several identical faces in the crowd in the two photos.
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All considered, either Paul VI was moving forward, either walking or on a moving platform, or else the camera was moving to the left, or perhaps BOTH, because the position of the TV camera to his left and the columns of the building behind it are things that would not have been moving, yet they are in two different positions.
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The image on top (without so-called Lucy) might have occurred first, then the camera would have moved to the right and upward a few feet, then the second photo would have been taken. The TV camera in the background having remained still, appears to have moved 6" to the right and 3" up compared to Paul VI. That means the camera taking these pictures would have moved to the right a foot or two (being a further distance away from Paul VI than the TV camera is behind him) and upwards about one foot. Notice how the angle of view in the second photo is slightly more looking downward than the first one was (first one is at eye level of Paul VI). This also explains why the crowd in the background appears to be higher in the second photo, because Paul VI is lower, and the camera has been angled downward to keep Paul VI in the center of the frame.
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There are several people to notice. A balding man with glasses to the right of the TV camera is clapping with his hands in two different phases of a clap in the first and second photo, plus, and because of this you might not recognize him, in the first photo his mouth is closed but in the second photo, it is open, so he would have been saying something out loud, pronouncing a "p" or "b" or "m" which require the closed lip position. The second photo is more overexposed than the first so this man appears to be in brighter light with whiter highlights on his nose, forehead, cheeks, chin and fingers. Notice too, to his left, another man looking downward is seen, the front of his face only, but in the second photo his nose is covered by the back of the head of the next man with dark hair.
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The dark-haired man in black jacket in the first photo turning to his left side directly behind Paul VI's left hand is also in the second photo, but all you can see is the back of his right shoulder, as his head is cropped off the photo on the right.
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In the event the source site deletes this set of photos, I've put them into the archives here for future reference.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Neil Obstat on August 29, 2018, 09:58:59 PM
St. Therese is also usually depicted as holding a crucifix with roses on/around it.  Maybe she was a Rosicrucian too?
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Aren't the Rosicrucians supposed to be mysterious? 
Then what about the Mysteries of the Rosary and Mystical Rose?
(...Vessel of honor, Singular vessel of devotion, Mystical rose, Tower of David, Tower of ivory, House of Gold, Ark of the Covenant, etc.)
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Struthio on August 30, 2018, 01:35:46 AM
All considered, either Paul VI was moving forward, either walking or on a moving platform, or else the camera was moving to the left, or perhaps BOTH

The image without Lucia was "shot" with  a TV camera by an RTP TV cameraman. The other image is a photography shot by a photographer from a slightly different angle.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Neil Obstat on August 30, 2018, 06:15:10 AM
The image without Lucia was "shot" with  a TV camera by an RTP TV cameraman. The other image is a photography shot by a photographer from a slightly different angle.
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I was going to say it looks like a different camera took it. At first glance the crowd seems to be two different crowds but looking closely you can see some of the same faces, only re-positioned because of two different camera angles. 
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The press often has a booth with a whole fleet of cameramen and cameras taking pictures at various papal events. So somebody found a way to insert the figure of a person (the fake Lucy) into the photo before the time of Photoshop, that is, at least before it went public.
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There is a copy of the so-called Third Secret that seems to have been altered before the advent of Xerox or computers. It's on the TIA website. Atila Sinke-Guimaraes does an excellent job of unpacking the thing using subtle clues and his superior knowledge of Portuguese. (The letter is handwritten in that language.) But he makes no pretense of looking into the question of HOW the letter could have been faked. So there is no reason to wonder if anyone had a motive for using cutting-edge technology to deceive Catholics regarding the whereabouts or writings of Sister Lucia of Fatima. One thing's for sure, the Vatican did NOT WANT HER AROUND to answer any questions about this stuff.

Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Struthio on August 30, 2018, 09:18:00 AM
The press often has a booth with a whole fleet of cameramen and cameras taking pictures at various papal events.

Above I posted a link to a page on the site of RTP TV with a 45 minute video of the event. Paul VI. arrives in a car at 18'50". It shows the whole situation with multiple TV cameras, photographers on the stage and in the crowd as well as a special scaffold with dozens of photographers.


So somebody found a way to insert the figure of a person (the fake Lucy) into the photo before the time of Photoshop, that is, at least before it went public.

Paul VI. visited Fátima on May 13, 1967. The photomontages appeared in the periodical "Stella" in the issue N.º 357, Maio de 1967.


There is a copy of the so-called Third Secret that seems to have been altered before the advent of Xerox or computers. It's on the TIA website. Atila Sinke-Guimaraes does an excellent job of unpacking the thing using subtle clues and his superior knowledge of Portuguese. (The letter is handwritten in that language.) But he makes no pretense of looking into the question of HOW the letter could have been faked.

Interesting. Could you please provide a link or pertinent keywords for a search on the TIA website?
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Neil Obstat on August 30, 2018, 02:25:18 PM

Interesting. Could you please provide a link or pertinent keywords for a search on the TIA website?

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https://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/g33ht_Decipher.htm
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Trying to Decipher a Scrambled Message
Atila S. Guimarães
Encouraged by the verdict (https://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/g32ht_Analyst.htm) of a famed Spanish graphologist affirming the authenticity of the Sister Lucy’s handwriting in the “Third Secret’ of Fatima we posted in April 2010 (https://www.traditioninaction.org/Questions/B352_Secret.html) on our website, I have returned to analyze it more carefully.

Note: To follow this analysis in an easier way, print the larger text here (https://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/HTimages_g-k/G033_Secret_2lg.jpg)

I always had suspicions regarding the date April 1, 1944 (line 1), April Fools’ Day, which most probably should have been January 4, 1944, and by the ill-sounding expression “the Cathedral of Rome” (line 21), which to make sense should be “Cathedra or Chair of Rome” signifying the Holy See. Some days ago I started to scrutinize that “Third Secret” looking for more traces of a possible falsification.


[St. Peter's in Rome is a Basilica, and Sr. Lucia would not have referred to it as a "Cathedral."]

I found some and worked with them. It is the fruit of this labor that I pass on to my readers in this article.

Before starting, let me say that the analysis that follows has four presuppositions:

....
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What follows is an amazing exercise in detective work by Atlia Sinke-Guimaraes -- the likes of which is frankly hard to believe exists online. I have read it and re-read it several times, and while I don't know Portuguese, I have no doubts in the ability of this scholar and warrior of the Church to fully analyze this docuмent. You should find it worth your time.
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In point 3 of 4 that follows "presuppositions," he has this disclaimer, ...
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If a falsifier is present, he used a non-electronic photographic system of cutting and pasting pieces of her writings in a different order from the original. The goal of his alterations would be to maintain the same handwriting but scramble the meanings of some parts. I have no idea about the tools or the method he would have employed. I will just be analyzing the fruit of his work.
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...which I always have thought leaves open the door for some future article exploring whatever "tools or method" was employed to accomplish this deception. I don't know whose project that will be, but it seems closely related to the recent study undertaken by Dr. Peter Chojnowski regarding the two sets of Sr. Lucia photographs and fake Sr. Lucy.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Neil Obstat on August 30, 2018, 02:39:21 PM
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It begins with a strange inconsistency that is a bit more obvious than the added "l" at the end of the word Cathedra which has the effect of turning a chair into a Church building.
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Here it is:
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(https://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/HTimages_g-k/G032_Secret3.jpg)
A strange inconsistency: no indentation on the 3rd paragraph
[I would say 3rd and 4th paragraphs - but I'm not reading Portuguese.]
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I recall this missing indentation being an annoyance to me before I had seen this analysis, and it's the kind of thing that bothers me but whenever I mention it to someone they don't share my concern, and when I mention this kind of thing on CI for example, there is usually another member who cries foul as if nobody has any right to notice mistakes that could potentially be much more significant than they appear at first glance. Sometimes it's an innocent misspelling or wrong punctuation, but other times it's the tip of the iceberg.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Croixalist on August 30, 2018, 03:55:28 PM
In this photo on the upper right you can see a photographer on a crane of some sort, which would help explain why the background changes and if a rapid series of photos were taken as the photog was being lifted or lowered slightly, it would also account for the difference in Paul VI's arm positioning:

(http://hemerotecadigital.cm-lisboa.pt/EFEMERIDES/fatima/banner.jpg)

Clearly Lucy II was present at some point during this pilgrimage. If the footage below is chronological from start to finish, it appears she came up to meet him just before he left the stage. (3:25-3:42)

https://youtu.be/rKtONtLvwvo

Seeing as they were swarmed on all sides by various prelates, the cameras on either side wouldn't have had a clear shot of just the two of them. Also notice that Lucy II was much shorter next to the Pope here. I think it's safe to say this was merely an attempt to piece together an image to better represent to the public what really took place. Kind of like a movie poster... or a circus advertisement...

At this point, I'd like to see Chojnowski return to the facial analysis. This was an interesting diversion, but it's not a real conspiracy.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Pax Vobis on August 30, 2018, 05:26:32 PM
Good point 
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Struthio on August 30, 2018, 05:40:47 PM
Thank you very much, Neil Obstat!
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Neil Obstat on August 30, 2018, 07:54:06 PM
Thank you very much, Neil Obstat!
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You're welcome, Struthio, enjoy! 
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Prayerful on August 31, 2018, 12:03:39 PM
Exposing this piece of authority for V2 and a Pope who turned the General Council from a bad idea to an utter disaster, is worthwhile work.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Struthio on September 02, 2018, 08:20:57 AM
http://radtradthomist.chojnowski.me/2018/08/original-photo-of-meeting-between-paul.html

More from Dr. Chojnowski:

http://radtradthomist.chojnowski.me/2018/08/faked-photo-of-paul-vi-and-sister-lucy.html
http://radtradthomist.chojnowski.me/2018/09/another-twilight-zone-photo-of-sister.html
http://radtradthomist.chojnowski.me/2018/09/kevin-symonds-admits-that-previously.html
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: AlbertP on September 02, 2018, 11:09:20 PM

In researching the Sister Lucy controversy, I stumbled across this picture of her real sister, and interestingly, she looks a lot like Sister Lucy 2 - especially the mouth, jaw and chin.  I find this interesting, since it's the mouth, jaw and chin of Sr. Lucy 2 that has always looked the most different from Sr. Lucy 1 to me.



(https://thecalltofatima.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/the-call-to-fatima-lucias-sister-maria-dos-santos.jpg)
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: AlbertP on September 02, 2018, 11:43:21 PM
Now here's a picture of Sister Lucy dated 1949, and this clearly looks like a young Sister Lucy 2.



(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-MAi3Huqr9xM/UdVGOBf1gII/AAAAAAAADuY/tBxUTIvbbgA/s1600/lucia-impostor-1949.jpg)
 

Here's a link to a video showing this picture on the wall at her convent, at 1:10:  

http://videos.sapo.pt/K1NFc4fptg5NE5dkLT7k (http://videos.sapo.pt/K1NFc4fptg5NE5dkLT7k)




Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: AlbertP on September 03, 2018, 12:19:04 AM
I can definitely see a future Sister Lucy 2 in this picture, and if you compare it to the previous one from 1949, it looks like it could easily be the same person.  


(http://crc-internet.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2017/05/Lucia02.jpg)

Here's a link to the source of the image: http://crc-internet.org/our-doctrine/catholic-counter-reformation/the-whole-truth-about-fatima-volume-2/1-5-lucy-jesus-wishes-to-use-you/



Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Incredulous on September 03, 2018, 09:15:26 AM
Now here's a picture of Sister Lucy dated 1949, and this clearly looks like a young Sister Lucy 2.



(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-MAi3Huqr9xM/UdVGOBf1gII/AAAAAAAADuY/tBxUTIvbbgA/s1600/lucia-impostor-1949.jpg)
 

Here's a link to a video showing this picture on the wall at her convent, at 1:10:  

http://videos.sapo.pt/K1NFc4fptg5NE5dkLT7k (http://videos.sapo.pt/K1NFc4fptg5NE5dkLT7k)
Where did you get these photos?
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: AlbertP on September 03, 2018, 11:59:35 AM
I found the picture of the young Sister Lucy (around age 15) in an online version of Frere Michele's The Whole Truth About Fatima.  The picture from 1949 is on a number of foreign websites.  Several of them provide a link to what I believes was Sister Lucy's convent, which is where they found the picture. Unfortunately, the link no longer works, but they also include the video I linked to above, which shows the picture hanging on the wall at the convent.  Here's another picture of what appears to be Sister Lucy 2. This one is dated 1951, and was also supposedly posted on the convent website, in the link that no longer works.

(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-gsQjbM5FPwU/UcLuY2OQviI/AAAAAAAAgαy/p-fiwfFl9K8/s512/impostora1951.jpg)
Something else I've been noticing is that the chins may not be as different as I once thought.  I'm beginning to think the difference is due to the angle and the added weight.  In the picture below, you can see that Sister Lucy 1 has a long chin that protrudes at the bottom.   If you add 50 lbs, and take another picture with her head tilted slightly upward, the chin may well look like that of Sister Lucy 2.

(https://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/HTimages_g-k/G012_A03_Smiling_2photos.jpg)
The smiles are different, but compare the mouth of Sister Lucy 2 to that of the biological sister I posted yesterday.  They look the same.  That makes me wonder if there could be another explanation.   Notice how flat and short the teeth are in Sister Lucy 2.  It looks like they have been filed.  Also notice that the gums in both pictures above are larger on the right side (from our view), and extend further down the front right teeth.  If Sister Lucy I had her front teeth shaved, the teeth and gums might look very similar to those of Sister Lucy 2.  Could this also have something to do with the difference in the smile?  I don't know. 
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Maria Regina on September 03, 2018, 01:43:38 PM

Something else I've been noticing is that the chins may not be as different as I once thought.  I'm beginning to think the difference is due to the angle and the added weight.  In the picture below, you can see that Sister Lucy 1 has a long chin that protrudes at the bottom.   If you add 50 lbs, and take another picture with her head tilted slightly upward, the chin may well look like that of Sister Lucy 2.

(https://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/HTimages_g-k/G012_A03_Smiling_2photos.jpg)
The smiles are different, but compare the mouth of Sister Lucy 2 to that of the biological sister I posted yesterday.  They look the same.  That makes me wonder if there could be another explanation.   Notice how flat and short the teeth are in Sister Lucy 2.  It looks like they have been filed.  Also notice that the gums in both pictures above are larger on the right side (from our view), and extend further down the front right teeth.  If Sister Lucy I had her front teeth shaved, the teeth and gums might look very similar to those of Sister Lucy 2.  Could this also have something to do with the difference in the smile?  I don't know.
It is not just a matter of teeth being shaved.
Look at how the teeth in Lucy 1 are deformed and not coming in straight.
All her teeth most likely needed to be pulled and replaced with dentures to match the picture in Lucy 2.
Convents usually do not have the financial resources to spend on dental bills.

On the other hand, look at the busy eyebrows of Lucy 1 and the barely visible brows on Lucy 2.
This indicates that the two pictures are from two different nuns.
Busy eyebrows usually remain such even in older age.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: 1st Mansion Tenant on September 03, 2018, 02:13:36 PM
It is not just a matter of teeth being shaved.
Look at how the teeth in Lucy 1 are deformed and not coming in straight.
All her teeth most likely needed to be pulled and replaced with dentures to match the picture in Lucy 2.
Convents usually do not have the financial resources to spend on dental bills.

On the other hand, look at the busy eyebrows of Lucy 1 and the barely visible brows on Lucy 2.
This indicates that the two pictures are from two different nuns.
Busy eyebrows usually remain such even in older age.
In my opinion, the second photo shows obvious dentures. Lucia's bad teeth were probably extracted and replaced with full dentures as she aged. It's not true that all convents couldn't afford dentures for nuns, many had them. And I think it's extremely likely that they would have popped for dentures for a high-profile nun like Sister Lucy. If the convent couldn't afford them, then I bet it wouldn't have been hard to find a generous devotee of Fatima to donate their cost. I see nothing wrong with that. Also, eyebrows often become paler and sparser as women age. Wild, bushy eyebrows are more common in older men than in women. ETA I also noticed the shiny spot on the gums in the second photo. I have noticed in people who wear dentures that there is a tendency towards reflective spots like that on the imitation gums that don't happen on natural gums.
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: King Wenceslas on September 04, 2018, 07:26:51 PM
Worse dang dentures I have ever seen.

Also why are the dentures essentially perfect in 1967 while they really suck in 2000?

Also the picture above in 1951 she is quite homely while she is much better looking in 1967? Makeup?

Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Neil Obstat on September 14, 2018, 08:56:35 PM
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RadTradThomist links the following video in one of his blog posts.
Imagine the training and brainwashing not to mention years of cooperation this Lucy II must have had. 
These are your childhood friends, this is your childhood village, here is your childhood bedroom............
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQf2IaPF9V4
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Cera on September 15, 2018, 04:40:07 PM
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Not to change the topic, but I couldn't help but notice this one comment under the OP article on the source page:
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August 15, 2018 at 6:17 AM (http://radtradthomist.chojnowski.me/2018/08/fraud-facial-recognition-technology.html?showComment=1534339051435#c7027808750062521034)
Our Lady would never say "the survivors woujld [would] envy the dead". That is a false apparition from the Novus Ordo and in front of the Novus Ordo empty tabernacle during a Novus Ordo "Eucharistic prayer" from Vatican II Bishop. Like many false apparitions and Novus Ordo carry'ons it is promoted by Bishop Williamson to good folk, perhaps good folk like you. Don't fall for it. It might sound real but the Novus Ordo Church is not the Catholic Church and if they approve an apparition is [it] holds no more water than their approval of the New Mass and various heresies. Stay with Fatima, La Salette, Rue de Bac and all pre-Vatican II approved apparitions and stay away from Bishop Williamson the deceiver and ?Rosicrucian poetry-teller.
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Somebody has some pretty powerful animosity toward +RW. Almost as if they're ready to blame him for all these problems -- who knows what he's going to be accused of next! Perhaps it's a crypto-Zionist creeping in to do damage by subterfuge, getting even for the unforgivable sin of "anti-Semitism!"
Rev. 9:6
6] (http://drbo.org/x/d?b=drb&bk=73&ch=9&l=6-#x) And in those days men shall seek death, and shall not find it: and they shall desire to die, and death shall fly from them.
So yes, Our Lady might quote that part of the Bible which says "the survivors would envy the dead," as it is in other translations. The above is DRBO.
Is that the only basis of your attack on Bishop Williamson? (Other than his taste in poetry?)
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Struthio on September 16, 2018, 08:49:45 PM
Imagine the training and brainwashing not to mention years of cooperation this Lucy II must have had.

Imagine the training and brainwashing not to mention years of cooperation more than 2400 bishops must have had to teach religious liberty (i.e. the state has the duty to protect the 'human right' to hate God and his commandments) or that the Church of Christ is not the same thing as the Catholic Church etc.

Impossible?
Title: Re: Original Photo of "the Meeting" between Paul VI and "Sister Lucy" found!
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 23, 2018, 11:58:55 AM
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This topic needs its own subforum to keep all the scattered threads together.