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Author Topic: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon  (Read 57679 times)

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Offline epiphany

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Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
« Reply #210 on: January 07, 2022, 12:02:11 AM »
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  • OLHC is a chapel; it is not a "parish" (which would mean that it would be under a Bishop).
    sppx does the same thing, but they are not parishes, either.  

    parish, parishoner, and pastor imply jurisdictional authority.  

    Offline JesusMaryJoseph

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #211 on: January 07, 2022, 12:06:55 AM »
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  • I go to the parish and I'm confirming that Fr. Starbuck did in fact refuse to hear someone's confession directly and has stated that he is 'too busy for confessions'.  I'm not out to talk about his faults and shortcomings but am simply confirming that what Mr. Yoder has said. 
    I was also a parishioner and father will refuse confession if it is not during the times reserved for confession. People have tried come up to them after the designated confession period is over to ask for an impromptu confession. Even Wiest had a whole sermon about this during his first few weeks at the chapel. He talked about decorum - there being a time and place for such things as blessings and confessions. He complained about being stalked by parishioners to bless items and hear confessions out of the normal times reserved for those things.

    Maybe you are stating things out of context?


    Offline trento

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #212 on: January 07, 2022, 12:36:02 AM »
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  • I was also a parishioner and father will refuse confession if it is not during the times reserved for confession. People have tried come up to them after the designated confession period is over to ask for an impromptu confession. Even Wiest had a whole sermon about this during his first few weeks at the chapel. He talked about decorum - there being a time and place for such things as blessings and confessions. He complained about being stalked by parishioners to bless items and hear confessions out of the normal times reserved for those things.

    Maybe you are stating things out of context?
    I'm surprised this is even an issue as indeed I have seen people asking the priest for confession *AFTER Mass* when the priest has appointments after that like giving extreme unction to the sick, leaving for another mass circuit, etc.

    Offline JesusMaryJoseph

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #213 on: January 07, 2022, 12:54:15 AM »
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  • Again you are misinformed---Fr. Starbuck has been with the parish for 15 years and there have been numerous instances of him not doing his job.  While you are correct that we are not under a Bishop, you are mistaken in your comment about a chapel.  A church is any place of worship that has a permanent congregation and is run by a pastor or priest. Unlike a church, a chapel is a place of worship that has no pastor or priest and no permanent congregation; it's all about the physical space.  So----we are a church then.  Are you a parishoner?
    There are numerous instances when ALL of the priests have not done their “job” at one time or another. Nobody is perfect and they are human just like us and have demands placed upon them, make mistakes, get stressed out, suffer from diabolical attacks etc. We need to pray for our priests. 

    Offline epiphany

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #214 on: January 07, 2022, 06:34:20 AM »
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  • I go to the parish and I'm confirming that Fr. Starbuck did in fact refuse to hear someone's confession directly and has stated that he is 'too busy for confessions'.  I'm not out to talk about his faults and shortcomings but am simply confirming that what Mr. Yoder has said. 
    Is this unusual?
    EVERY time I have asked an SSPX priest to hear my confession when it is not "confession time"  I have been refused.  Didn't matter which priest.  They all refused.  Same thing about blessing articles.  If they're not "on the table" so the priest can do many items at one time at his leisure, you're out of luck.

    It seems to me that Fr. Starbuck, doing the work of 3 priests when Fr. Perez had just died, was blessed by God with fortitude and perseverance for the faithful.  It seems he was blessed with humility, too.


    Offline Cera

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #215 on: January 07, 2022, 10:51:04 AM »
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  • Is this unusual?
    EVERY time I have asked an SSPX priest to hear my confession when it is not "confession time"  I have been refused.  Didn't matter which priest.  They all refused.  Same thing about blessing articles.  If they're not "on the table" so the priest can do many items at one time at his leisure, you're out of luck.

    It seems to me that Fr. Starbuck, doing the work of 3 priests when Fr. Perez had just died, was blessed by God with fortitude and perseverance for the faithful.  It seems he was blessed with humility, too.
    Amen. Thank you Epiphany.

    Please join us in a 54-day Novena Rosary to Our Lady of the Rosary for Father Starbuck's protection and guidance and for the rot to be rooted out at the chapel. We officially began on the Feast of the Circuмcision. 27 days of petition and 27 days of thanksgiving.
    Pray for the consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary

    Offline DustyActual

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #216 on: January 07, 2022, 11:23:54 AM »
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  • Is this unusual?
    EVERY time I have asked an SSPX priest to hear my confession when it is not "confession time"  I have been refused.  Didn't matter which priest.  They all refused.  Same thing about blessing articles.  If they're not "on the table" so the priest can do many items at one time at his leisure, you're out of luck.
    If you only have venial sins to confess then the confession can wait. However if you are in mortal sin and the priest refuses to hear your confession, he will answer to God for that. You don't have to say to the priest "Father I am in mortal sin can you hear my confession?" if there are other people around; You can just say "Father can you hear my confession? It's an emergency."
    Go to Jesus through Our Lady.

    Offline epiphany

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #217 on: January 07, 2022, 01:10:15 PM »
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  • Amen. Thank you Epiphany.

    Please join us in a 54-day Novena Rosary to Our Lady of the Rosary for Father Starbuck's protection and guidance and for the rot to be rooted out at the chapel. We officially began on the Feast of the Circuмcision. 27 days of petition and 27 days of thanksgiving.

    Novena is a good idea.
    St. Joseph is a better idea.  He hits the nail on the head every time.


    Offline epiphany

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #218 on: January 07, 2022, 01:10:34 PM »
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  • If you only have venial sins to confess then the confession can wait. 
    not necessarily....

    Offline SupportFrStarbuck

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #219 on: January 07, 2022, 02:37:20 PM »
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  • Hey! "Dusty"

    You obviously are a newbie here and perhaps even as a Catholic.  You wrote:

    "If you only have venial sins to confess then the confession can wait. However if you are in mortal sin and the priest refuses to hear your confession, he will answer to God for that. You don't have to say to the priest "Father I am in mortal sin can you hear my confession?" if there are other people around; You can just say "Father can you hear my confession? It's an emergency."

    Where have you been here?  Haven't you read all the posts here stating all the reasons a priest is not able to hear "impromptu" confessions!?

    First of all if you have mortal sin to confess it is YOUR responsibility to get to confession at the scheduled time and not ambush a priest who probably has other things to do like getting ready for Mass, etc.  UNLESS, you are about to die...  were you about to die when you've ambushed these priests for confession?

    As far as "he (the priest) will answer to God for that" God is very aware of the pressures and myriad of responsibilities that need to be taken care of by a priest.... OBVIOUSLY NOT YOU!

    Offline Anne Evergreen

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #220 on: January 07, 2022, 08:55:35 PM »
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  • sppx does the same thing, but they are not parishes, either. 

    parish, parishoner, and pastor imply jurisdictional authority. 
    Yes. If there is a private chapel in a private home or the rectory, etc., it is called a chapel, and NOT a church. Word will be quietly passed on regarding Mass, etc.

    Otherwise, if Mass is for everyone, it will specify Church, in the bulletin or notifications, and an event will be called "Parish picnic, or Church picnic," Parish potluck, Church potluck," etc.

    The only other time I have seen chapel listed is if it is an actual chapel within a church where Mass is being said. Larger churches and cathedrals and basilicas, etc., come readily to mind, and those are not necessarily SSPX or FSSP Mass centres, either, but merely referring to the physical churches that are built with one or more chapels in them. Europe is filled with such places. (Then you get into things like crypt churches, too).

    Smaller chapels that I have come across in both Diocesan Parishes and SSPX or FSSP Mass Centres or Churches/Parishes are usually dedicated Adoration Chapels, but Mass is sometimes said there, also. 

    If people want to call their parish or church a chapel, I don't really care. I know what they mean. They are going to a physical building for Mass or the Sacraments. :-)


    Offline Anne Evergreen

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #221 on: January 07, 2022, 09:33:32 PM »
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  • Is this unusual?
    EVERY time I have asked an SSPX priest to hear my confession when it is not "confession time"  I have been refused.  Didn't matter which priest.  They all refused.  Same thing about blessing articles.  If they're not "on the table" so the priest can do many items at one time at his leisure, you're out of luck.

    It seems to me that Fr. Starbuck, doing the work of 3 priests when Fr. Perez had just died, was blessed by God with fortitude and perseverance for the faithful.  It seems he was blessed with humility, too.

    If you only have venial sins to confess then the confession can wait. However if you are in mortal sin and the priest refuses to hear your confession, he will answer to God for that. You don't have to say to the priest "Father I am in mortal sin can you hear my confession?" if there are other people around; You can just say "Father can you hear my confession? It's an emergency."
    The onus is on the person to get to confession, and not the Priest to hear it. That's right. Read it again. It does not matter the circuмstances of whether or not it is venial versus mortal sins, it is a matter of arranging your time and priorities so that you arrive in time to have your confession heard before Mass, arrange a time with the Priest *before Mass* to have your confession after Mass if it a case of you living at a great distance, you are leaving for a trip right after Mass, some young children are ill at home and this is your only opportunity at the moment, etc.

    Bugging a Priest to have your confession heard on your whim and timeframe can be a sign of pride. YOU want YOUR schedule or imprudence to be catered to, instead of humbly submitting to the Priest's schedule, NEED TO PRAY, etc.

    If people REGULARLY attend a certain place for Mass, then they usually "know the drill" about Mass times and times for confession, etc. It is very unfair of regular attendees to ask a Priest for confession at a whim, (mortal sins or not), when you KNOW BETTER to make a better effort to get there at the appointed times.

    You cannot judge or fault a Priest for having and enforcing HIS schedule. If you are in mortal sin and there is no blood coming out of every orifice in your body upon getting to Mass, then you can probably abstain from Communion and ask Father AFTER MASS to hear your confession IF he has time. Some people might habitually rush into confession 10 minutes before Mass time and then wonder why Priests get upset! 

    If you are in mortal sin and you HONESTLY tried to get to confession in plenty of time, but you were delayed because of traffic or something outside of your control, then yes, quietly ask the Priest if he has time to hear your confession because it's very important. Explain that you would have been there in ample time if it were not an unavoidable delay, etc. He will give you a time to help you.

    If you are in a place with HUNDREDS of people and/or multiple Masses in one day and/or the Priest has to travel "on circuit" or to "missions?" YOU HAD BETTER SCHEDULE YOUR TIME BETTER, PERIOD, and allow extra time for traffic delays on top of getting there in the first place.

    Once again, the Priest bashing and lay-people being critical of Priests and playing Priest needs to STOP! The excuses that people make here are crazy.

    Same with religious articles blessing mentioned elsewhere:

    ***If your Priest wants religious articles blessed on a certain day, then BRING THEM ON THAT DAY, and in PLENTY of time to set them up! There ARE DIFFERENT blessings for DIFFERENT types of things! There is a different blessing for a Saint Benedict Medal versus a Rosary, versus a car, versus a horse, versus Easter baskets, versus x,y,z.

    Of course a Priest will wonder why he has to bless one Rosary and one medal on Monday when you then bring him a Saint Benedict Medal and Holy Water font and want to be enrolled in the scapular on Tuesday! Then repeat this scenario ad nauseum with dozens of other people adding to their collection.

    A Priest will announce blessing times, etc. to alert newcomers to such things and also for His Priorities before God's, NOT YOURS!

    Bottom line? Quit being lazy and whiny Catholics! Sorry, but not sorry, but some Americans down there have NO CLUE what sacrifices and hardships MANY Canadians have to make in comparison to have Mass and the Sacraments, get Holy Water, have things Blessed, etc. I live in the second largest country in the world. MANY of our Mass Centres are not accessible at the moment by many people! You figure things out.

    Bunch of pansies.




    Offline JesusMaryJoseph

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #222 on: January 08, 2022, 12:30:16 PM »
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  • The onus is on the person to get to confession, and not the Priest to hear it. That's right. Read it again. It does not matter the circuмstances of whether or not it is venial versus mortal sins, it is a matter of arranging your time and priorities so that you arrive in time to have your confession heard before Mass, arrange a time with the Priest *before Mass* to have your confession after Mass if it a case of you living at a great distance, you are leaving for a trip right after Mass, some young children are ill at home and this is your only opportunity at the moment, etc.

    Bugging a Priest to have your confession heard on your whim and timeframe can be a sign of pride. YOU want YOUR schedule or imprudence to be catered to, instead of humbly submitting to the Priest's schedule, NEED TO PRAY, etc.

    If people REGULARLY attend a certain place for Mass, then they usually "know the drill" about Mass times and times for confession, etc. It is very unfair of regular attendees to ask a Priest for confession at a whim, (mortal sins or not), when you KNOW BETTER to make a better effort to get there at the appointed times.

    You cannot judge or fault a Priest for having and enforcing HIS schedule. If you are in mortal sin and there is no blood coming out of every orifice in your body upon getting to Mass, then you can probably abstain from Communion and ask Father AFTER MASS to hear your confession IF he has time. Some people might habitually rush into confession 10 minutes before Mass time and then wonder why Priests get upset!

    If you are in mortal sin and you HONESTLY tried to get to confession in plenty of time, but you were delayed because of traffic or something outside of your control, then yes, quietly ask the Priest if he has time to hear your confession because it's very important. Explain that you would have been there in ample time if it were not an unavoidable delay, etc. He will give you a time to help you.

    If you are in a place with HUNDREDS of people and/or multiple Masses in one day and/or the Priest has to travel "on circuit" or to "missions?" YOU HAD BETTER SCHEDULE YOUR TIME BETTER, PERIOD, and allow extra time for traffic delays on top of getting there in the first place.

    Once again, the Priest bashing and lay-people being critical of Priests and playing Priest needs to STOP! The excuses that people make here are crazy.

    Same with religious articles blessing mentioned elsewhere:

    ***If your Priest wants religious articles blessed on a certain day, then BRING THEM ON THAT DAY, and in PLENTY of time to set them up! There ARE DIFFERENT blessings for DIFFERENT types of things! There is a different blessing for a Saint Benedict Medal versus a Rosary, versus a car, versus a horse, versus Easter baskets, versus x,y,z.

    Of course a Priest will wonder why he has to bless one Rosary and one medal on Monday when you then bring him a Saint Benedict Medal and Holy Water font and want to be enrolled in the scapular on Tuesday! Then repeat this scenario ad nauseum with dozens of other people adding to their collection.

    A Priest will announce blessing times, etc. to alert newcomers to such things and also for His Priorities before God's, NOT YOURS!

    Bottom line? Quit being lazy and whiny Catholics! Sorry, but not sorry, but some Americans down there have NO CLUE what sacrifices and hardships MANY Canadians have to make in comparison to have Mass and the Sacraments, get Holy Water, have things Blessed, etc. I live in the second largest country in the world. MANY of our Mass Centres are not accessible at the moment by many people! You figure things out.

    Bunch of pansies.

    Thank you!

    Offline Yeti

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #223 on: January 08, 2022, 12:51:32 PM »
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  • Is this unusual?
    EVERY time I have asked an SSPX priest to hear my confession when it is not "confession time"  I have been refused.  Didn't matter which priest.  They all refused.  Same thing about blessing articles.  If they're not "on the table" so the priest can do many items at one time at his leisure, you're out of luck.


    I would expect a priest to hear a person's confession by special request on a one-time or occasional basis, but if you're asking for that all the time then I can see it being a problem.

    As far as your complaint about blessing of articles goes, most churches have one Sunday a month when they bless articles, usually after Mass. If someone doesn't put their article on the communion rail or whatever to be blessed, it doesn't get blessed. The priest can't bless something he doesn't know is even there. So if someone is too negligent to put their stuff on the communion rail before the blessing, and then comes up to the priest as soon as he is done blessing everything and asks him to bless their item because they didn't have it out when he did the blessing, then I think it is reasonable for the priest to say no.

    Same goes for people who think they can buy a statue in the church goods store for grandma who lives in Keokuk, Iowa, and then take it to the priest so he can bless it and then they can go straight to the post office, because they don't want to wait until the next time articles are blessed at the church before they mail it out. That sort of request is unreasonable, and if priests had to stop what they are doing and bless an article every time someone bought something as a gift in the bookstore, they would have to sacrifice more important duties to do that, and most priests rightly don't do that. That is why there is an assigned time for people to have their articles blessed.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: OLHC laypersons attempting to take over chapel CENSOR Fr. Starbuck's sermon
    « Reply #224 on: January 08, 2022, 12:59:47 PM »
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  • This thread still going on? Ugh.

    Of course the topic has changed probably about a half-dozen times. Currently the topic seems to be getting to confession on time, and blessing of religious articles.
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