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Author Topic: New St. Alphonsus Quotes on Implicit BOD  (Read 9982 times)

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Offline Ladislaus

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Re: New St. Alphonsus Quotes on Implicit BOD
« Reply #85 on: March 19, 2021, 08:27:28 AM »
I hold that your opinion that adults in your New Covenant go to a perpetual limbo-like state to be objectively heretical. St. Augustine never held that. He taught BOD in at least 5 places, and he never retracted BOD itself. He never for e.g. retracted that Cornelius received Baptism of Desire. He only held, in the case of the Good Thief, that the Thief may have received Baptism in an extraordinary manner. Thus St. Augustine said, someone predestined to eternal life, would not be allowed to end this life, without the Sacrament of the mєdιαtor.

So the true XavierSem comes out, despising again the necessity of Baptism for salvation.  Ironically, Xavier, it is you who are embracing and endorsing heresy.

Dummy, the corollary to the St. Augustine position is obviously that if someone did not receive the Sacrament of Baptism, then it follows that they were not predestined for eternal life.  Your bad will causes even your logical faculties to fail.  Ergo, if Fr. Hermann's mother died without the Sacrament of Baptism, then she was not predestined for eternal life, i.e. she was not saved.  Duh.  As I pointed out, NOWHERE in this story, if it's even real, does it claim that she went to Heaven, just that she didn't perish ... which is consistent with justification vs. salvation.

Both Karl Rahner and the theologian cited in that Catholicism.org article on St. Augustine both conclude that St. Augustine retracted his belief in BoD as being salvific.  Like St. Ambrose, he likely believed that a baptism of votum, of sorts, could wash the soul to certain extent but could not obtain crowning in the Kingdom.

You make absurd attempts to explain away Pope St. Simplicius as well.

All this proves that you've already made up your mind and are begging the question, and then using confirmation bias to filter out anything that doesn't agree with you.

Offline Ladislaus

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Re: New St. Alphonsus Quotes on Implicit BOD
« Reply #86 on: March 19, 2021, 08:36:19 AM »
Your interpretation of Pope St. Siricius is ridiculous and absurd.

You absolutely bad-willed imbecile, you.  I'm not interpreting St. Siricius, merely quoting him that "each and every one" of those who did not receive the Sacrament, even desiring it, would be lost.  It is you who pulled some ridiculous definition of "natural desire" out of your posterior without any proof whatsoever.  YOUR interpretation of St. Siricius is absurd and ridiculous.  Mine was no interpretation but a mere quotation of what he said.

In the meantime, you keep promoting the blasphemous Valtorta filth.

I have lost all respect for you.


Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: New St. Alphonsus Quotes on Implicit BOD
« Reply #87 on: March 19, 2021, 08:40:10 AM »

Quote
I hold that your opinion that adults in your New Covenant go to a perpetual limbo-like state to be objectively heretical.

Ha ha.  Based on what?  You've just become the very people you hate - you interpret things like the Diamonds.

Offline Ladislaus

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Re: New St. Alphonsus Quotes on Implicit BOD
« Reply #88 on: March 19, 2021, 08:40:30 AM »
No, that's your Jansenist opinion that you're promoting. I said faith in Him together with love for Him, contrition for past sins, and desire for Baptism, just like St. Thomas and St. Alphonsus do. If you accuse them of heresy, you sin mortally yourself. You who have imbibed even just ever so little of the Dimondite poison seem to struggle greatly in coming out of it. For myself, I follow the Doctors completely.

And in your sinister depravity, you again calumniate me by implying that I accuse St. Alphonsus and St. Thomas of heresy, when I have repeatedly asserted the opposite.

Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: New St. Alphonsus Quotes on Implicit BOD
« Reply #89 on: March 19, 2021, 08:41:38 AM »
Xavier interprets things, or not, depending on his feelings and bias.  Emotional theology and sentimentality.