Author Topic: New Rite of Ordination (Read 7803 times)

TKGS · « **Reply #25 on:** May 30, 2010, 05:32:41 PM »

Quote from: Alexandria

I know what book you may be talking about because the parts of it that I have read say what you just wrote, TK - The Sacraments and Their Celebration by Nicholas Halligan, O.P. It's a hard book to get, and it's way too expensive for me too. Maybe someday.....

It would not have been this particular book, as I've not a copy nor have I seen it, though I may just see if my local library can't obtain it through an inter-library loan. (The Notre Dame University Library might just have a copy and I've borrowed books through this method from them before.)

On the other hand, the author's name seem familiar, so it may have been an excerpt from this book that I read in another book. (Yes. I'm one of those strange people who read the footnotes.)

On another point, if I am reading Ladislaus correctly, I believe his points are very well stated on the subject.

Alexandria · « **Reply #26 on:** May 31, 2010, 11:42:33 AM »

TKGS

Meet your female counterpart! I love footnotes. Sometimes they are better than the main text!!

Caminus · « **Reply #27 on:** May 31, 2010, 12:03:11 PM »

Catharinus' opinion has been condemned by theologians and by the magisterium of the Church.

Ladislaus · « **Reply #28 on:** June 01, 2010, 05:52:03 AM »

Quote from: Caminus

Catharinus' opinion has been condemned by theologians and by the magisterium of the Church.

No, it hasn't. Read the relevant passages in the book for which I supplied the link.

SJB · « **Reply #29 on:** June 01, 2010, 07:27:28 AM »

Quote from: Ladislaus

Quote from: SJB
Quote from: Ladislaus
I don't think of it as exterior vs. interior, however.

This is critical, however. We can NEVER know somebody's INTERNAL disposition unless it is EXTERNALLY manifest. The Church (and everybody else, excepting what goes on in the confessional), is concerned with the EXTERNAL.

Yes, but I don't think that's exactly the distinction these theologians were getting at. When they said "external intention", they meant intention to perform the external rite. I wouldn't have referred to it as "external intention" however because that implies exactly what you're saying. That's exactly why I said that I wouldn't think of it as external vs. internal. Of course that could be the way this particular writer (on the link I posted) characterized it rather than what Catharinus and followers thought.

I'm only trying to make clear that if a valid minister uses the proper rite and that is all that happens, then there is an unquestionably valid sacrament. The fact that the minister used the proper rite is all that matters as that fact (if it is a fact), means the intention is there. The purely internal does not matter at all.