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Author Topic: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro  (Read 2515 times)

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Offline MichaelFullerSSPX

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New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
« on: August 30, 2021, 12:06:53 PM »
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  • Bishop Dolan has decided to consecrate Fr. Ribeiro (formerly of the resistance) a bishop for Brazil. The news was posted in SGG bulletin. 


    Offline unacum

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #1 on: September 01, 2021, 12:31:34 AM »
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  • One should consider this recent move of Bp. Daniel Dolan in the light of the recent disagreement / split between Dolan and Sanborn. For this reason Dolan recalled all his seminarians from MHTs.


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #2 on: September 01, 2021, 05:03:37 AM »
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  • One should consider this recent move of Bp. Daniel Dolan in the light of the recent disagreement / split between Dolan and Sanborn. For this reason Dolan recalled all his seminarians from MHTs.

    So, what happened between the two of them recently?

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #3 on: September 01, 2021, 11:02:47 AM »
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  • Plenty of chaos, strife, division, confusion, and scandals/evils in the Sedevacantist quarters of the Trad world. It's not the shangri-la of clarity and simplicity that some make it out to be.

    It's quite dishonest for Bp. Sanborn and others to point to the recent "problems" in the SSPX in 2012 (which occasioned the start of the Resistance), and beat their chest about how it proves the shakiness of Recognize and Resist, and why sedevacantism is so much better.

    History would strongly disagree with that assessment. If split-offs, divisions, etc. proved your position wrong, then Sedevacantism was proven wrong decades ago, within weeks after it started. They can't even agree on whether or not to elect a new Pope. "It's been 60 years, but yeah, we probably can just do without one. The Orthodox are just fine, right?"

    Strike the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock will be dispersed. That goes for sedevacantism as well as other quarters of the Trad movement.
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    Offline MichaelFullerSSPX

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #4 on: September 01, 2021, 12:12:22 PM »
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  • Plenty of chaos, strife, division, confusion, and scandals/evils in the Sedevacantist quarters of the Trad world. It's not the shangri-la of clarity and simplicity that some make it out to be.

    It's quite dishonest for Bp. Sanborn and others to point to the recent "problems" in the SSPX in 2012 (which occasioned the start of the Resistance), and beat their chest about how it proves the shakiness of Recognize and Resist, and why sedevacantism is so much better.

    History would strongly disagree with that assessment. If split-offs, divisions, etc. proved your position wrong, then Sedevacantism was proven wrong decades ago, within weeks after it started. They can't even agree on whether or not to elect a new Pope. "It's been 60 years, but yeah, we probably can just do without one. The Orthodox are just fine, right?"

    Strike the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock will be dispersed. That goes for sedevacantism as well as other quarters of the Trad movement.

    None of that has any bearing on objective truth, especially when talking about the human element. It’s when one group attempts to dogmatize their position and make it a requirement to be Catholic, that I see cultish attitudes and red flags. Fr. Hesse, Bishop De Castro Mayer et al, while being pioneers of Tradition and in the r and r camp, didn’t hesitate to admit the possibility of a sede vacante. Many assert Abp Lefevre shared the same sentiment and it seems he did.
     Rah rah rah my team.  What an embarrassing thing. It would be hard to say I am biased on the matter since my family attends an SSPX chapel as our primary chapel for more than 35 years. My opinion is that sede vacante is the future of the Church before a Catholic pope comes back. I’m curious to see the level of cognitive dissonance and how far some will hold out. Would it be a homo pope, a woman pope or a Mohammedan pope? I suspect a great number in the R and R camp presently would argue the papacy of a woman pope as valid. Or transgender or whatever? However, the generation will probably be different when or if any of those things happen (which seems certain that 80 years or less will see one of those possibilities). 


    Offline obediens

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #5 on: September 01, 2021, 12:19:09 PM »
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  • On a more practical level, this consecration could very well prove to be disastrous. Besides switching from R&R to sedevacantism shortly after ordination, he is only 30 years old and a priest for not even four years. 

    In 2012, a mainline Thuc bishop consecrated a 30 year old two years after ordaining him. The young man left the priesthood and episcopacy a year and a few months later. 

    In 1987, a priest (ordained by Archbishop Lefebvre in 1982) was consecrated a bishop by a mainline Thuc bishop. He left the priesthood and episcopacy fairly shortly after as well. 

    The traditional requirements (1917 Code) for Episcopal Consecration:

    Canon 378 

    §1. In regard to the suitability of a candidate for the episcopacy, it is required that he is:

    1. outstanding in solid faith, good morals, piety, zeal for souls, wisdom, prudence, and human virtues, and endowed with other qualities which make him suitable to fulfill the office in question;
    2. of good reputation;
    3. at least thirty-five years old;
    4. ordained to the presbyterate for at least five years;
    5. in possession of a doctorate or at least a licentiate in sacred scripture, theology, or canon law from an institute of higher studies approved by the Apostolic See, or at least truly expert in the same disciplines.

    §2. The definitive judgment concerning the suitability of the one to be promoted pertains to the Apostolic See. 

    Offline Meg

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #6 on: September 01, 2021, 02:05:38 PM »
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  • I suspect a great number in the R and R camp presently would argue the papacy of a woman pope as valid. Or transgender or whatever?

    How little you know about the Resistance. But...being a sede, you think you know everything. Arrogance goes along with Sedeism. 
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline MichaelFullerSSPX

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #7 on: September 01, 2021, 02:14:51 PM »
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  • How little you know about the Resistance. But...being a sede, you think you know everything. Arrogance goes along with Sedeism.
    Dear Meg,
    I was present at two of the three episcopal consecrations of the resistance, married by a resistance bishop, interpreted for the interview of Bishop Faure to the guardian after his consecration and translated more than a dozen articles for both the Dominicans if Avrille and Non Possumus. 
    If a came off as arrogant to you, I apologize. The position I maintain that Bergoglio is not a valid pope is mere opinion. If you hold to all the truths of the Catholic Faith, I have no animosity towards you. We may even attend each others chapel one day. 


    Offline Meg

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #8 on: September 01, 2021, 02:20:11 PM »
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  • Dear Meg,
    I was present at two of the three episcopal consecrations of the resistance, married by a resistance bishop, interpreted for the interview of Bishop Faure to the guardian after his consecration and translated more than a dozen articles for both the Dominicans if Avrille and Non Possumus.
    If a came off as arrogant to you, I apologize. The position I maintain that Bergoglio is not a valid pope is mere opinion. If you hold to all the truths of the Catholic Faith, I have no animosity towards you. We may even attend each others chapel one day.

    If you know the Resistance so well, then why do you believe that they would accept a woman or transgender pope? Please explain.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline MichaelFullerSSPX

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #9 on: September 01, 2021, 02:32:34 PM »
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  • On a more practical level, this consecration could very well prove to be disastrous. Besides switching from R&R to sedevacantism shortly after ordination, he is only 30 years old and a priest for not even four years.

    In 2012, a mainline Thuc bishop consecrated a 30 year old two years after ordaining him. The young man left the priesthood and episcopacy a year and a few months later.

    In 1987, a priest (ordained by Archbishop Lefebvre in 1982) was consecrated a bishop by a mainline Thuc bishop. He left the priesthood and episcopacy fairly shortly after as well.

    The traditional requirements (1917 Code) for Episcopal Consecration:

    Canon 378

    §1. In regard to the suitability of a candidate for the episcopacy, it is required that he is:

    1. outstanding in solid faith, good morals, piety, zeal for souls, wisdom, prudence, and human virtues, and endowed with other qualities which make him suitable to fulfill the office in question;
    2. of good reputation;
    3. at least thirty-five years old;
    4. ordained to the presbyterate for at least five years;
    5. in possession of a doctorate or at least a licentiate in sacred scripture, theology, or canon law from an institute of higher studies approved by the Apostolic See, or at least truly expert in the same disciplines.

    §2. The definitive judgment concerning the suitability of the one to be promoted pertains to the Apostolic See.
    Bishop Fellay was 30 years old when he was consecrated by Abp Lefebvre. 
    If the crisis in the faith allows for a disregard of the canonical requirement of papal approval, the present state of quarantines and boarder closures also allows for some circuмstances. Look at present France! Will the resistance seminarians be required to get the vaxx? Are people not talking about this? The future of the priesthood in Brazil definitely affects me on a personal level. Perhaps if this were the same for you, you would see it differently. For bishops to not be able to enter Brazil would be disastrous for the faithful that depend on sacraments.  
    Suddenly, people who oppose this consecration have become legalists, but in  previous situations this is not the case. Good for me, but not for thee. 

    Offline Marion

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #10 on: September 01, 2021, 02:57:09 PM »
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  • The traditional requirements (1917 Code) for Episcopal Consecration:

    Canon 378

    §1. In regard to the suitability of a candidate for the episcopacy, it is required that he is:

    1. outstanding in solid faith, good morals, piety, zeal for souls, wisdom, prudence, and human virtues, and endowed with other qualities which make him suitable to fulfill the office in question;
    2. of good reputation;
    3. at least thirty-five years old;
    4. ordained to the presbyterate for at least five years;
    5. in possession of a doctorate or at least a licentiate in sacred scripture, theology, or canon law from an institute of higher studies approved by the Apostolic See, or at least truly expert in the same disciplines.

    §2. The definitive judgment concerning the suitability of the one to be promoted pertains to the Apostolic See.

    That's CIC/1983. In the 1917 Codex, Canon 378 is about a different topic. I'd guess though, that the requirements are at least similar.
    That meaning of the sacred dogmas is ever to be maintained which has once been declared by holy mother church. (Dei Filius)


    Offline bodeens

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #11 on: September 01, 2021, 03:00:36 PM »
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  • One should consider this recent move of Bp. Daniel Dolan in the light of the recent disagreement / split between Dolan and Sanborn. For this reason Dolan recalled all his seminarians from MHTs.
    What's going on here?
    Regard all of my posts as unfounded slander, heresy, theologically specious etc
    I accept Church teaching on Implicit Baptism of Desire.
    Francis is Pope.
    NO is a good Mass.
    Not an ironic sig.

    Offline TKGS

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #12 on: September 01, 2021, 03:34:32 PM »
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  • Plenty of chaos, strife, division, confusion, and scandals/evils in the Sedevacantist quarters of the Trad world. It's not the shangri-la of clarity and simplicity that some make it out to be.
    Unlike the peace and tranquility throughout the R&R quarters of the Trad world, of course.   ::)

    Offline Quo vadis Domine

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #13 on: September 01, 2021, 04:46:56 PM »
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  • Dear Meg,
    I was present at two of the three episcopal consecrations of the resistance, married by a resistance bishop, interpreted for the interview of Bishop Faure to the guardian after his consecration and translated more than a dozen articles for both the Dominicans if Avrille and Non Possumus.
    If a came off as arrogant to you, I apologize. The position I maintain that Bergoglio is not a valid pope is mere opinion. If you hold to all the truths of the Catholic Faith, I have no animosity towards you. We may even attend each others chapel one day.

    I wouldn’t waste your time, she’s a dogmatic R&R who has never reflected for 3 seconds on the possibility that she could wrong.
    For what doth it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his own soul? Or what exchange shall a man give for his soul?

    Offline obediens

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    Re: New Bishop to be consecrated. Fr. Ribeiro
    « Reply #14 on: September 01, 2021, 06:04:43 PM »
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  • That's CIC/1983. In the 1917 Codex, Canon 378 is about a different topic. I'd guess though, that the requirements are at least similar.
    I apologize, you are correct. Here is the Canon from the 1917 Code. Of course he still does not meet the number of years in the priesthood, and is just 30. The point is, it most likely is very imprudent. A candidate for the episcopacy needs to prove himself. 
    TITULUS VIII:  De potestate episcopali deque iis qui de eadem participant

    CAPUT I:  De Episcopis

    Can 329 §1. Episcopi sunt Apostolorum successores atque ex divina institutione peculiaribus ecclesiis praeficiuntur quas cuм potestate ordinaria regunt sub auctoritate Romani Pontificis.
     §2. Eos libere nominat Romanus Pontifex.
     §3. Si cui collegio concessum sit ius eligendi Episcopum, servetur praescriptum can. 321.

    Can 330. Antequam quis in Episcopum assumatur, constare debet, secundum modum a Sede Apostolica determinatum, eum esse idoneum.

    Can 331 §1. Ut quis idoneus habeatur, debet esse:
     1º Natus ex legitimo matrimonio, non autem legitimatus etiam per subsequens matrimonium;
     2º Annos natus saltem triginta;
     3º A quinquennio saltem in sacro presbyteratus ordine constitutus;
     4º Bonis moribus, pietate, animarum zelo, prudentia, ceterisque dotibus, praeditus, quae ipsum aptum efficiant ad gubernandam dioecesim de qua agitur;
     5º Laurea doctoris vel saltem licentia in sacra theologia aut iure canonico potitus in athenaeo aliquo vel in Instituto studiorum a Sancta Sede probatis, vel saltem earundem disciplinarum vere peritus; quod si ad religionem aliquam pertineat, a suis Superioribus maioribus vel similem titulum vel saltem verae peritiae testimonium habeat.
     §2. Etiam electus, praesentatus vel quoquo modo ab illis designatus, qui privilegio a Sancta Sede concesso praesentandi seu designandi gaudent, debet memoratis qualitatibus pollere.
     §3. Iudicare num quis idoneus sit, ad Apostolicam Sedem unice pertinet.