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Author Topic: Neo-Cath Apologist Attributes 60's Church decline to H. Vitae, not VCII  (Read 549 times)

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Offline stevusmagnus

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Offline Telesphorus

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Neo-Cath Apologist Attributes 60's Church decline to H. Vitae, not VCII
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2009, 08:20:54 PM »
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  • This person doesn't to be a neo-Cath as much as a straight liberal. (especially when he praises Greely).

    I see he takes the Catholic pose momentarily to to say he supports Humanae Vitae.  He certainly seems much more comfortable arguing like a liberal.

    Using the term "canard" sounds like something out of the ADL playbook.

    Vatican II led to the expectation that the birth control teaching would change, as they say on fisheaters, the consensus of theologians at the time meant birth control wasn't a sin at that time!  So it's not surprising that people suddenly told it was a sin again would defect.  One can therefore see that Vatican II cannot at all escape blame for the negative reaction to Humanae Vitae, since there would be no need for Humanae Vitae if Vatican II had not created the need.

    Essentially his argument boils down to agreement with the liberals: saying the Church is declining because it hasn't conformed sufficiently to the world.

    Well, the laity have conformed to the world, that's why there are so few children in the pews in the NO.

    As small as the numbers of traditional Catholics are, it's seen as a threat, because of the large families.  This seems to fly right over the head of the neo-Cath essayist.

    The Church has always lost people, but the Catholic family is fundamental to preserving the Faith.  The NO has betrayed the Catholic family, sometimes in doctrine, but nearly always in practice.

    The real problem the Church has is not attendance.  As bad as the rate of defection from the Church has been, and it has been terrible, there are still large numbers of people in the pews.  The problem is that the people in the pews no longer have the Catholic Faith in most cases.

    You're a glutton for punishment stevus, reading this stuff.




    Offline gladius_veritatis

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    Neo-Cath Apologist Attributes 60's Church decline to H. Vitae, not VCII
    « Reply #2 on: October 02, 2009, 09:54:11 PM »
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  • People wanted to get it on sans consequences - which did NOT start with HV.  V2 played a HUGE role in feeding that fire pre-1968.
    "Fear God, and keep His commandments: for this is all man."

    Offline Caraffa

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    Neo-Cath Apologist Attributes 60's Church decline to H. Vitae, not VCII
    « Reply #3 on: October 03, 2009, 11:03:36 PM »
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  • Quote from: Telesphorus

    The real problem the Church has is not attendance.  As bad as the rate of defection from the Church has been, and it has been terrible, there are still large numbers of people in the pews.  The problem is that the people in the pews no longer have the Catholic Faith in most cases.


    Good point Tele. It seems to be an American thing and a sign of false human respect to be overly focused on Church attendance/number. What matters is not the numbers in the pews or even the percentage of those who attend mass weakly, rather what matters is the faith of those numbers.
    Pray for me, always.