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Author Topic: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"  (Read 10308 times)

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Offline Stubborn

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Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
« Reply #15 on: December 26, 2025, 06:00:51 AM »
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    • Quote from: Freind on December 26, 2025, 05:03:34 AM
    You're free to try to prove that simply by demonstration. Go ahead. How do you think the following question will turn out?

    "Give me quotes from St. Thomas Aquinas that “baptism of desire” is a doctrinal error."

    Ask it if the popes since Vatican 2 are heretics. 
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    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse

    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #16 on: December 26, 2025, 08:39:09 AM »
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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #17 on: December 26, 2025, 11:29:52 AM »
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    Offline Seraphina

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #18 on: December 26, 2025, 12:19:28 PM »
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    • I don’t like this whole AI business. Stupid people and malicious people are already 1) mistaking AI for reality, 2) using AI to push Satan’s agenda. 
    I’ll be keeping it real in my life as much as possible.
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    Offline St Giles

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #19 on: December 26, 2025, 12:32:59 PM »
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    • As they say: you have to be smarter than the tool. Most people think they are smarter than tools since tools are inanimate objects, but if they don't understand the limitations, abilities, and how the tool works, then they will misuse it or not use it to its full potential.

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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #20 on: December 26, 2025, 01:11:19 PM »
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    • Quote from: Seraphina on December 26, 2025, 12:19:28 PM
    I don’t like this whole AI business. Stupid people and malicious people are already 1) mistaking AI for reality, 2) using AI to push Satan’s agenda.
    I’ll be keeping it real in my life as much as possible.

    In other words, "I don't like the conclusion in this discussion!"
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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #21 on: December 26, 2025, 05:41:55 PM »
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    • Quote from: SkidRowCatholic on December 26, 2025, 04:50:53 PM
    There is nothing in your chat with the A.I. that was not already covered many times over in my post.

    The whole intrinsic/extrinsic (your terms) - could be better understood as simply material vs. formal adhesion to a false pope.

    None of this applies to our current situation. Everyone either knows these "popes" are heretics, or they don't.

    If you know they are heretics - it is not morally permissible to put their name in the Canon no matter your intention. One who does so without moral certainty of their heresy would not be guilty of that sin, but it is still objectively wrong.

    It is the simple principle of not sharing sacred things with "dogs" - it is not just the principle of a falsified sacramental sign (though it is that as well).

    This is where most people err. They only think in strictly technical terms, without discerning the underlying spiritual principles.

    One cannot claim to be one in faith with someone they are morally convicted is a heretic - they know that is a lie.

    So if R&R think of the post-concilars as heretics and go ahead and name them in the Canon anyway they are wrong. If a sede goes to those Masses knowing these principles - he is wrong.

    This is all answered already here on the A.I. Una cuм thread. No one has disproved it, no one has even issued a single valid objection yet that has not already been answered.

    Please paste the text of what you are giving the A.I. and it's responses so that others can verify for themselves - through copy and paste - not just screen shots of the chat. Thanks.

    I can see you really didn't follow the whole discussion.
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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #22 on: December 26, 2025, 05:48:29 PM »
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    • Quote from: SkidRowCatholic on December 26, 2025, 05:45:02 PM
    Everything you asked him, is already in my post - why would I?

    I read the relevant portions/questions.

    Feed it my text and give the link - So I can verify.

    Get to some particular point. You overload and logically that's not a practical choice.
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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #23 on: December 26, 2025, 05:52:43 PM »
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    • Quote from: SkidRowCatholic on December 26, 2025, 05:51:16 PM
    Give it the full text and give the link and I will make my point. It will only take you a moment.

    In fact just give the link to the chat and I will do it myself.

    Link please. Or, I will just create my own conversation with him if you like and post that.

    Just recently I posted a quote from Mortalium Animos and then from St. Francis de Sales to AI. This is MUCH simpler to get the point about a false pope.
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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #24 on: December 26, 2025, 06:01:47 PM »
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    • Quote from: SkidRowCatholic on December 26, 2025, 05:56:45 PM
    OK.

    I will start my own chat with "St Francis"  and report back...

    I kinda doubt it will be successful. How about answering this:

    If a layman today who believes Leo is not a true pope, attends a Mass of an SSPX priest who mistakenly still think Leo is a true pope, assists at his mass, does that layman sin, and why?
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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #25 on: December 26, 2025, 06:11:08 PM »
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    • Quote from: SkidRowCatholic on December 26, 2025, 06:09:29 PM
    Really? Why is that?

    I just asked the question, look above.
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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #26 on: December 26, 2025, 06:14:18 PM »
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    • Quote from: SkidRowCatholic on December 26, 2025, 06:13:35 PM
    Nope, nothing there about me not being "successful" about making my own chat with "St. Francis"...

    How about answer my restated question?
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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #27 on: December 27, 2025, 04:11:15 PM »
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    • Skid, that is not for my personal benefit. I have always known and agreed the priest cannot knowingly put a false pope in the canon. 

    My thing is about whether it is intrinsically evil for a sedevacantist to assist at a mass where the priest unknowingly puts a false pope in the canon but believes he is a true pope.


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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #28 on: December 27, 2025, 04:51:47 PM »
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    • Quote from: SkidRowCatholic on December 27, 2025, 04:49:55 PM
    🌿 A Pastoral Letter in the Spirit of St. Francis de Sales

    My dear child in Our Lord,
    Peace be in your heart. When questions arise that touch the holy altar and the worship we owe to God, they must be approached with both firmness in truth and great gentleness of spirit. For nothing so honors God as a conscience kept in simplicity and peace.

    You ask whether you may assist at a Mass where the priest, in good faith, names in the Canon one whom you judge with moral certainty to be separated from the Church by manifest heresy. Let us consider this with calmness and clarity.

    First, remember that God does not condemn the priest who acts in ignorance. He intends to honor the Church as he understands her, and the Lord receives the good will of His servants. But your own conscience is another matter. If you see clearly that the commemoration signifies a unity that is not truly present, then for you the act becomes a false sign. And the heart that knows a thing to be false must not join itself to it, for Our Lord desires that we worship Him “in spirit and in truth.”

    The Church teaches that no one may act against a certain conscience, for to do so is to choose what one judges to be evil. Even if the act is not evil in itself, it becomes evil for the one who knowingly embraces what his conscience condemns. Thus, if you believe with firm and prudent certainty that the Canon is falsified, you must refrain from assisting at such a Mass, not out of harshness toward the priest, but out of fidelity to the truth God has shown you.

    Do not be troubled by this. God does not bind you to what your conscience judges to be sinful. The obligation to hear Mass does not oblige when its fulfillment would require you to cooperate in what you believe to be a sacrilege. The Lord is a gentle Master; He asks for obedience, but never at the cost of the soul’s integrity.

    Walk, then, in peace. Avoid bitterness, avoid judgment of persons, avoid all harsh speech. Hold fast to the truth as God gives you to see it, but hold it with charity, humility, and patience. If you must refrain from a particular Mass, do so quietly, without reproach, and with a heart full of prayer for the priest and for the whole Church.

    May the Savior, who is meek and humble of heart, guide your conscience, strengthen your resolve, and keep you always in His peace.
    Yours in the gentle Heart of Jesus,

    Francis

    This proves positive that you didn't read all of the OP.
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    Offline Freind

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    Re: My AI discussion with "Francis de Sales"
    « Reply #29 on: December 27, 2025, 04:57:52 PM »
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    • Quote from: SkidRowCatholic on December 27, 2025, 04:55:46 PM
    I asked it your question - this was "his" answer, what problem do you have?

    You didn't read the OP is the problem.
    With AI you need to feed it facts for it to consider. It doesn't naturally consider everything in the world.
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