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Author Topic: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's  (Read 6076 times)

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Offline Mirari Vos

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Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
« Reply #45 on: February 02, 2021, 03:14:49 PM »
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    • Quote from: clement21 on February 02, 2021, 02:39:02 PM
    God is not the Author of confusion to His children. God is clear and open to His children. No secrets, no confusion, nothing esoteric that causes misunderstanding in His children. Only the wicked and pagans are bewildered and confounded by God's word.

    The whole "secrets" thing of Fatima makes the account dubious. The confusion of "Portugal the dogma of the faith will be preserved ..." makes it more dubious. Adding the "Fatima prayer" is a novelty because why wouldn't God already include it into the Rosary from day one, if it was so necessary? This makes Fatima even more dubious.

    Tell me, where does St. John the Revelator mention that Russia needs to be consecrated? Catholics act like the salvation of the world and world peace hinges on Russia being consecrated. If that is true, why isn't it mentioned in the last Book of the Bible?  

    Now, the argument can be made that the last Book is "confusing" and "esoteric" but it's not. It's written that way because it was the only language in St. John's day that could be used to describe the future (which is now) modern world and events, and understanding of the text would be be made manifest to God's children as they approach those days.
    Some good points here. I never felt comfortable with the absolute necessity of all the bishops consecrating Russia. BTW: I’m fairly certain that Pope Pius XII did the consecration.
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    Offline Tallinn Trad

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #46 on: February 02, 2021, 03:40:03 PM »
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    • Realistically speaking, at what point in history would any Pope get all the Bishops of the world to play ball and do anything?

    Must be a very rare Pope that has every bishop obedient to his demands. 
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #47 on: February 02, 2021, 03:54:23 PM »
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    • Quote from: Tallinn Trad on February 02, 2021, 12:30:54 PM
    Then why use the word always?

    :facepalm:

    I JUST finished explaining to you the nuances of the word in the Romance languages, that it doesn't mean always in the English sense but merely a persistent activity, i.e. could be translated as "Portugal will continue to keep the faith ... [until]".
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #48 on: February 02, 2021, 03:56:14 PM »
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    • Quote from: 2Vermont on February 02, 2021, 12:56:02 PM
    I didn't think Church approval of a private revelation/apparition meant it was free from error.

    Not directly, but if the Church holds the apparition to genuine, then it would be problematic to attribute error to Our Lady, since God's Providence would not allow it.

    And, of course, there's no strict obligation of faith to believe in it, but this TT is hell-bent on discrediting Sister Lucia.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #49 on: February 02, 2021, 03:58:02 PM »
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    • Quote from: clement21 on February 02, 2021, 02:39:02 PM
    The whole "secrets" thing of Fatima makes the account dubious. 

    Says who?  You, Croix?  You're pulling stuff out of your posterior.  The nature of the Secret was as a test for the Pope, making a direct link between whether the Pope would heed her request or else the contents of the Secret would unfold as planned.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #50 on: February 02, 2021, 04:00:26 PM »
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    • Quote from: Tallinn Trad on February 02, 2021, 12:30:54 PM
    Then why use the word always?

    Why give the world the misleading first part of a conditional prophecy that Heaven knows will not pan out?

    That is indistinguishable from a false prophecy.

    All Heaven needs to do is avoid mentioning Portugal altogether.  Or include the word if or unless.  Then there would be no room for doubt.

    We are told to test prophecy but how is that possible if some is held back which entirely changes the meaning?  Any false prophecy could be true if we add a fanciful unless blah blah blah to it.

    Germany will win World War 2, unless...

    The world will end on December 21, 2012, unless.

    Are you the one who was spreading that discredited/debunked nonsense from non-Catholics (spiritualists) that Our Lady appeared at Fatima in a short skirt?

    And are you the guy who questioned the Miracle of the Sun because ... how could the sun get that close without incinerating everything?
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    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #51 on: February 02, 2021, 04:24:57 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on February 02, 2021, 03:56:14 PM
    Not directly, but if the Church holds the apparition to genuine, then it would be problematic to attribute error to Our Lady, since God's Providence would not allow it.

    And, of course, there's no strict obligation of faith to believe in it, but this TT is hell-bent on discrediting Sister Lucia.
    I don't think it needs to mean error is being attributed to Our Lady.  It could be that Sister Lucia was in error in repeating Our Lady's words given she was just human.
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    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #52 on: February 02, 2021, 07:55:43 PM »
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    • I’ve only noticed sedes debunking Fatima.

    If the Virgin Mary said the Consecration of Russia is needed,
    You can go to the bank on that.

    Our Lady was dead right about the start of WWII.

    I would think by now, Traditional Catholics would understand the worldly dominance of ʝʊdɛօ-masonry... and the need for a Catholic Russia to root it out?

    It is going to be a glorious when the Judea-masons are hunted down like rats.

    I wonder where all their money will be found ?
    :popcorn:
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    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline donkath

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #53 on: February 02, 2021, 08:43:03 PM »
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    • Quote from: Tallinn Trad on February 02, 2021, 03:40:03 PM
    Realistically speaking, at what point in history would any Pope get all the Bishops of the world to play ball and do anything?

    Must be a very rare Pope that has every bishop obedient to his demands.


    So Our Lady would tell the Pope (via the chilren) something she knew 'realistically' could not be done?
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    "In His wisdom," says St. Gregory, "almighty God preferred rather to bring good out of evil than never allow evil to occur."

    Offline Tallinn Trad

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #54 on: February 02, 2021, 10:56:08 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on February 02, 2021, 03:54:23 PM
    :facepalm:

    I JUST finished explaining to you the nuances of the word in the Romance languages, that it doesn't mean always in the English sense but merely a persistent activity, i.e. could be translated as "Portugal will continue to keep the faith ... [until]".


    It didn't continue to keep the faith.  It took a downward trajectory like all other European nations.  So why single it out compared to Spain or Italy or France?
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    Offline Tallinn Trad

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #55 on: February 02, 2021, 11:04:47 PM »
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    • Quote from: Incredulous on February 02, 2021, 07:55:43 PM
    If the Virgin Mary said the Consecration of Russia is needed,
    You can go to the bank on that.

    Our Lady was dead right about the start of WWII.
    That prophecy was not very difficult as it was only published after the start of World War 2.
    Before World War 2 started nobody had ever mentioned it. 
    Any of us can predict things after they happen.  That's easy. 
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    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #56 on: February 03, 2021, 06:10:40 AM »
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    • Quote from: Incredulous on February 02, 2021, 07:55:43 PM
    I’ve only noticed sedes debunking Fatima.
    See?  TT was right.  There it is again.  Are you sure that TT is even sede this time?  

    I have noticed that Fatima divides Catholics which I find troubling.

    Like Mirari Vos, I believe that Pius XII did the consecration, but not with all the bishops.  Our Lady said that if her request (consecration with all bishops) wasn't heeded Russia would spread its errors (ie. ƈσmmυɳιsm) throughout the world.  Aren't we seeing ƈσmmυɳιsm coming even to the US now? As a result, I believe the time for the consecration has passed.  That particular ship sailed.  
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    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #57 on: February 03, 2021, 08:23:07 AM »
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    • Quote from: 2Vermont on February 03, 2021, 06:10:40 AM
    See?  TT was right.  There it is again.  Are you sure that TT is even sede this time?  

    I have noticed that Fatima divides Catholics which I find troubling.

    Like Mirari Vos, I believe that Pius XII did the consecration, but not with all the bishops.  Our Lady said that if her request (consecration with all bishops) wasn't heeded Russia would spread its errors (ie. ƈσmmυɳιsm) throughout the world.  Aren't we seeing ƈσmmυɳιsm coming even to the US now? As a result, I believe the time for the consecration has passed.  That particular ship sailed.  

    My friend, check the record.

    The promulgation of the Pius XII 1952 “consecration” was from the biggest sede source in Jєω-mєdια, Bro. Dimond.

    He and his jew script writer team produced that piece of brilliant propaganda around 2007.  

    In that doc, he claimed, the world had it’s era of peace already, cause the “consecration” was done.

    Do you believe that?

    You believe we’ve had the era of peace Our Lady spoke of?

    If so, you’ve been disoriented by the sedes, which is the express mission of Bro. Dimond and jew-boys like Jerry Matatics.
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    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline clement21

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #58 on: February 03, 2021, 09:42:58 AM »
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    • That cognitive dissonance that is felt when the truth rocks their world, and causes people to give thumbs down. LOL
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    Offline clement21

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    Re: More Evidence on the two Sister Lucy's
    « Reply #59 on: February 03, 2021, 09:50:25 AM »
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    • However important or edifying a private revelation (Fatima) may be, it is not a “locus theologicus”, meaning it's not valid knowledge for a theological argument.
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