Author Topic: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home  (Read 1085 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline klasG4e

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 704
  • Reputation: +461/-48
  • Gender: Male
Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
« on: November 07, 2017, 07:16:22 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I know a trad who keeps the Holy Eucharist in his home made chapel down in his basement.  He doesn't have a problem with this, although I certainly do.  That said, I would be open to changing my mind if I heard a convincing argument for same.  Any takers?

    Offline Neil Obstat

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 14758
    • Reputation: +7494/-292
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #1 on: November 07, 2017, 10:06:17 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I know a trad who keeps the Holy Eucharist in his home made chapel down in his basement.  He doesn't have a problem with this, although I certainly do.  That said, I would be open to changing my mind if I heard a convincing argument for same.  Any takers?
    .
    I think it's an enormous responsibility.
    .
    Speaking from personal experience, I was a volunteer at a local Juvenile Hall detention center where the archdiocese had a Wednesday evening meeting of volunteers whereby we would go out to assigned locations to visit the detainees, children under 18 yrs old. 
    .
    There were some changes made from time to time, and one of them was when the office was moved to a new location, down the hallway, basically, still inside the security area of the center. The new office was going to have a tabernacle! Everyone was positive and looking forward to the development. I was a bit unsure of how that was going to pan out. So about the third week there, the tabernacle showed up along with the attendant red candle burning next to it. Everyone suddenly had to get used to the new practice of genuflecting when they entered or left the office.  Everyone had to speak in hushed tones. When someone made an innocent joke and someone else laughed, they suddenly stopped and looked askance toward the tabernacle, then covered their mouth. My suspicions were starting to pan out.
    .
    After a few weeks of this, gradually more and more often someone passing through the doorway would forget to genuflect. 
    .
    In time, genuflections became the exception. 
    .
    Something had to be done, so they moved the tabernacle to a closet.
    .
    Etc.

    It seems to me the lesson to be learned is that having a dedicated location for the Blessed Sacrament is not necessarily a bad thing, so long as the attendant dedication is present. What if the caretaker dies? What if there is a fire or a flood? What about vandalism? Are you prepared to remain devoted to the proper reverence and care that is associated? You ought to have the cooperation of a priest, for one. The priest is going to ask you questions I haven't thought of here, and you should be prepared to give the honest answers.
    .
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.


    Offline klasG4e

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 704
    • Reputation: +461/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #2 on: November 07, 2017, 10:19:57 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Any arguments justifying the reservation of the Blessed Sacrament in a layman's private home based in canon law and or tradition?  Any well known precedents for same that received the Church's blessing?

    Offline poche

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 12520
    • Reputation: +370/-561
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #3 on: November 08, 2017, 02:49:55 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • From the Code of Canon Law;

    Can.  934 §1. The Most Holy Eucharist:
    1/ must be reserved in the cathedral church or its equivalent, in every parish church, and in a church or oratory connected to the house of a religious institute or society of apostolic life;
    2/ can be reserved in the chapel of the bishop and, with the permission of the local ordinary, in other churches, oratories, and chapels.
    §2. In sacred places where the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved, there must always be someone responsible for it and, insofar as possible, a priest is to celebrate Mass there at least twice a month.
    Can.  935 No one is permitted to keep the Eucharist on one’s person or to carry it around, unless pastoral necessity urges it and the prescripts of the diocesan bishop are observed.
    Can.  936 In the house of a religious institute or some other pious house, the Most Holy Eucharist is to be reserved only in the church or principal oratory attached to the house. For a just cause, however, the ordinary can also permit it to be reserved in another oratory of the same house.
    Can.  937 Unless there is a grave reason to the contrary, the church in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved is to be open to the faithful for at least some hours every day so that they can pray before the Most Blessed Sacrament.

    Can.  938 §1. The Most Holy Eucharist is to be reserved habitually in only one tabernacle of a church or oratory.
    §2. The tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved is to be situated in some part of the church or oratory which is distinguished, conspicuous, beautifully decorated, and suitable for prayer.
    §3. The tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved habitually is to be immovable, made of solid and opaque material, and locked in such a way that the danger of profanation is avoided as much as possible.
    §4. For a grave cause, it is permitted to reserve the Most Holy Eucharist in some other fit-ting and more secure place, especially at night.
    §5. The person responsible for the church or oratory is to take care that the key of the tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved is safeguarded most diligently.
    Can.  939 Consecrated hosts in a quantity sufficient for the needs of the faithful are to be kept in a pyx or small vessel; they are to be renewed frequently and the older hosts consumed properly.
    Can.  940 A special lamp which indicates and honors the presence of Christ is to shine continuously before a tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved.
    Can.  941 §1. In churches or oratories where it is permitted to reserve the Most Holy Eucharist, there can be expositions with the pyx or the monstrance; the norms prescribed in the liturgical books are to be observed.
    §2. Exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament is not to be held in the same area of the church or oratory during the celebration of Mass.
    Can.  942 It is recommended that in these churches and oratories an annual solemn exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament be held for an appropriate period of time, even if not continuous, so that the local community more profoundly meditates on and adores the eucharistic mystery. Such an exposition is to be held, however, only if a suitable gathering of the faithful is foreseen and the established norms are observed.
    Can.  943 The minister of exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament and of eucharistic benediction is a priest or deacon; in special circumstances, the minister of exposition and reposition alone without benediction is the acolyte, extraordinary minister of holy communion, or someone else designated by the local ordinary; the prescripts of the diocesan bishop are to be observed.
    Can.  944 §1. When it can be done in the judgment of the diocesan bishop, a procession through the public streets is to be held as a public witness of veneration toward the Most Holy Eucharist, especially on the solemnity of the Body and Blood of Christ.
    §2. It is for the diocesan bishop to establish regulations which provide for the participation in and the dignity of processions.
    http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P3C.HTM

    A few questions for your friend:
    Does he have at least the implied consent of the bishop?
    Does a Catholic priest celebrate mass there at least twice a month?
    Is this person a reasonably responsible person?
    Is this person's chapel open to the the faithful at least some hours every day so that they can pray before the Blessed Sacrament?
    Is the Blessed Sacrament reserved in a tabernacle that which is distinguished, conspicuous, beautifully decorated, and suitable for prayer?
    Are the consecrated hosts renewed frequently and the older hosts consumed properly?
    Is there a special lamp which indicates and honors the presence of Christ which shines continuously before the tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved?
    Is there an annual solemn exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament?

    Offline klasG4e

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 704
    • Reputation: +461/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #4 on: November 08, 2017, 10:34:46 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • From the Code of Canon Law;

    Can.  934 §1. The Most Holy Eucharist:
    1/ must be reserved in the cathedral church or its equivalent, in every parish church, and in a church or oratory connected to the house of a religious institute or society of apostolic life;
    2/ can be reserved in the chapel of the bishop and, with the permission of the local ordinary, in other churches, oratories, and chapels.
    §2. In sacred places where the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved, there must always be someone responsible for it and, insofar as possible, a priest is to celebrate Mass there at least twice a month.
    Can.  935 No one is permitted to keep the Eucharist on one’s person or to carry it around, unless pastoral necessity urges it and the prescripts of the diocesan bishop are observed.
    Can.  936 In the house of a religious institute or some other pious house, the Most Holy Eucharist is to be reserved only in the church or principal oratory attached to the house. For a just cause, however, the ordinary can also permit it to be reserved in another oratory of the same house.
    Can.  937 Unless there is a grave reason to the contrary, the church in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved is to be open to the faithful for at least some hours every day so that they can pray before the Most Blessed Sacrament.

    Can.  938 §1. The Most Holy Eucharist is to be reserved habitually in only one tabernacle of a church or oratory.
    §2. The tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved is to be situated in some part of the church or oratory which is distinguished, conspicuous, beautifully decorated, and suitable for prayer.
    §3. The tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved habitually is to be immovable, made of solid and opaque material, and locked in such a way that the danger of profanation is avoided as much as possible.
    §4. For a grave cause, it is permitted to reserve the Most Holy Eucharist in some other fit-ting and more secure place, especially at night.
    §5. The person responsible for the church or oratory is to take care that the key of the tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved is safeguarded most diligently.
    Can.  939 Consecrated hosts in a quantity sufficient for the needs of the faithful are to be kept in a pyx or small vessel; they are to be renewed frequently and the older hosts consumed properly.
    Can.  940 A special lamp which indicates and honors the presence of Christ is to shine continuously before a tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved.
    Can.  941 §1. In churches or oratories where it is permitted to reserve the Most Holy Eucharist, there can be expositions with the pyx or the monstrance; the norms prescribed in the liturgical books are to be observed.
    §2. Exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament is not to be held in the same area of the church or oratory during the celebration of Mass.
    Can.  942 It is recommended that in these churches and oratories an annual solemn exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament be held for an appropriate period of time, even if not continuous, so that the local community more profoundly meditates on and adores the eucharistic mystery. Such an exposition is to be held, however, only if a suitable gathering of the faithful is foreseen and the established norms are observed.
    Can.  943 The minister of exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament and of eucharistic benediction is a priest or deacon; in special circumstances, the minister of exposition and reposition alone without benediction is the acolyte, extraordinary minister of holy communion, or someone else designated by the local ordinary; the prescripts of the diocesan bishop are to be observed.
    Can.  944 §1. When it can be done in the judgment of the diocesan bishop, a procession through the public streets is to be held as a public witness of veneration toward the Most Holy Eucharist, especially on the solemnity of the Body and Blood of Christ.
    §2. It is for the diocesan bishop to establish regulations which provide for the participation in and the dignity of processions.
    http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P3C.HTM

    A few questions for your friend:
    Does he have at least the implied consent of the bishop?
    Does a Catholic priest celebrate mass there at least twice a month?
    Is this person a reasonably responsible person?
    Is this person's chapel open to the the faithful at least some hours every day so that they can pray before the Blessed Sacrament?
    Is the Blessed Sacrament reserved in a tabernacle that which is distinguished, conspicuous, beautifully decorated, and suitable for prayer?
    Are the consecrated hosts renewed frequently and the older hosts consumed properly?
    Is there a special lamp which indicates and honors the presence of Christ which shines continuously before the tabernacle in which the Most Holy Eucharist is reserved?
    Is there an annual solemn exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament?

    Thanks for the copy from Canon Law!  It would seem that the permission of the local ordinary is a threshold requirement according to the Code.  I don't imagine the 1917 Code is different in this regard.  I don't see how an appeal to emergency jurisdiction could justify getting around the permission of the local ordinary requirement, but am certainly open to changing my mind on this if I see that I'm missing something in this regard.
    I wonder if any of the resistance bishops have expressed a view on the issue of a layman keeping the Blessed Sacrament reserved in their home.  If anyone reading this knows I hope you can let me/us know.


    Offline Neil Obstat

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 14758
    • Reputation: +7494/-292
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #5 on: November 08, 2017, 01:28:11 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • .
    Notice the glaring omission in the Code:  
    .
    A faithful Catholic might request permission from a bishop (perhaps a Resistance bishop or a validly consecrated but otherwise independent bishop) to have the Blessed Sacrament reserved in his home so he can have holy hours of adoration for himself and others because there is reasonable doubt of the validity of the hosts in all churches and oratories within reasonable distance from his home.
    .
    This could be a question under "jurisdiction" to ask of an independent priest.
    .
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.

    Offline Fanny

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 241
    • Reputation: +78/-130
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #6 on: November 08, 2017, 10:19:24 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Thanks for the copy from Canon Law!  It would seem that the permission of the local ordinary is a threshold requirement according to the Code.  I don't imagine the 1917 Code is different in this regard.  I don't see how an appeal to emergency jurisdiction could justify getting around the permission of the local ordinary requirement, but am certainly open to changing my mind on this if I see that I'm missing something in this regard.
    I wonder if any of the resistance bishops have expressed a view on the issue of a layman keeping the Blessed Sacrament reserved in their home.  If anyone reading this knows I hope you can let me/us know.
    Yes.
    Only as long as there is an immovable, locked, tabernacle, and only for maximum one month, with the presiding priest/bishop holding the key to the tabernacle.

    Offline Pax Vobis

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1711
    • Reputation: +1022/-353
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #7 on: November 09, 2017, 08:31:17 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I would think it's a bad idea for a laymen to do this, or for a priest to allow it.  There are so many rules and duties a priest/sacristan has related to the tabernacle.  I've heard the following grave responsibilities:  1) if the votive light goes out and is not lit within an hour, that's a mortal sin.  2) if the tabernacle key is not kept safe, that's a mortal sin.  3) only certain people are allowed to change the altar veil, tabernacle veil, etc.

    This does not even mention the rubrics and safeguards needed for a secure tabernacle AND access to the tabernacle.

    Unless a laymen's home is operating as an emergency chapel, with regular weekly masses, I don't see how this idea is good or advisable.


    Offline RoughAshlar

    • Newbie
    • *
    • Posts: 134
    • Reputation: +94/-30
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #8 on: November 09, 2017, 09:35:29 AM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!0
  • In years past, we have had priests come to our home and say Mass, and on another occasion give Last Rights and Communion.  Never once did they ever leave a consecrated host there, or suggest that was an option.  I would be concerned on how he was able to acquire a consecrated host for his basement chapel.

    Offline Neil Obstat

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 14758
    • Reputation: +7494/-292
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #9 on: November 09, 2017, 12:12:08 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Yes.
    Only as long as there is an immovable, locked, tabernacle, and only for maximum one month, with the presiding priest/bishop holding the key to the tabernacle.
    .
    "The" key? You do realize it's no big deal to obtain a duplicate key. Tabernacle keys are generally very low grade security-wise.
    .
    What constitutes "immovable?"  How thick do the walls have to be?  
    .
    I know a priest who secures the Blessed Sacrament overnight in his chapel by keeping It in a gun safe.
    .
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.

    Offline TKGS

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4221
    • Reputation: +3607/-198
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #10 on: November 09, 2017, 01:19:27 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Perhaps I missed the answer, if so, please point me to the post.

    How did this fellow get a valid host or hosts of the Blessed Sacrament to begin with?  The answer to this question would, I think, answer some of the questions and concerns being asked.


    Offline Neil Obstat

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 14758
    • Reputation: +7494/-292
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #11 on: November 09, 2017, 01:47:42 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I've heard the following grave responsibilities:  1) if the votive light goes out and is not lit within an hour, that's a mortal sin.  
    .
    Do I hear you saying that if the responsible person fails to check the the votive light every hour he commits a mortal sin?
    .
    He would have to check it every hour if he wanted to be certain it does not go out for over one hour.
    .
    Or, do you suppose that if the light goes out while there's no one to see it go out, it doesn't matter?
    .
    If so, then the one hour rule only starts when it's noticed that the light has gone out.
    .
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.

    Offline Neil Obstat

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 14758
    • Reputation: +7494/-292
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #12 on: November 09, 2017, 01:58:12 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Perhaps I missed the answer, if so, please point me to the post.

    How did this fellow get a valid host or hosts of the Blessed Sacrament to begin with?  The answer to this question would, I think, answer some of the questions and concerns being asked.
    .
    I would expect a priest would be very reluctant to get started supplying hosts for such private chapels. 
    .
    He would have to keep a list of all the places and be sure to keep in touch with them to make sure they don't forget or become indifferent. It would be a constant source of concern for any priest. 
    .
    I have heard of two such places where a private chapel is kept with no resident priest. One is supported by CMRI priests.
    .
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.

    Offline Pax Vobis

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1711
    • Reputation: +1022/-353
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #13 on: November 09, 2017, 02:15:23 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote
    Do I hear you saying that if the responsible person fails to check the the votive light every hour he commits a mortal sin?
    If the votive candle goes out for more than an hour, it's a mortal sin, so I've been told by a priest.  If some emergency causes the candle to go out, I don't think that's a sin.  Usually there's not a lot of drafts in a church, and votive candles are kept in cases designed to limit airflow influences.  A normal candle at our chapel lasts 6-7 days, so you can reasonably know when the candle will get low. 

    Offline klasG4e

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 704
    • Reputation: +461/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Keeping the Holy Eucharist in your home
    « Reply #14 on: November 09, 2017, 04:03:20 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • As for the 1917 Code, Section 1108 reads: "No one is allowed to keep the Blessed Sacrament in his private house, or to carry it with him when traveling."

     

    Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16