Author Topic: Vatican Response (Read 1858 times)

poche · « **on:** July 02, 2015, 11:45:27 PM »

Twelve years ago, the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith looked anticipated the possibility that some states might recognize same-sex marriage, and said:

In those situations where ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions have been legally recognized or have been given the legal status and rights belonging to marriage, clear and emphatic opposition is a duty. One must refrain from any kind of formal cooperation in the enactment or application of such gravely unjust laws and, as far as possible, from material cooperation on the level of their application. In this area, everyone can exercise the right to conscientious objection.

http://www.catholic culture.org/commentary/the-city-gates.cfm?id=1097

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/docuмents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ-unions_en.html

GottmitunsAlex · « **Reply #1 on:** July 03, 2015, 01:09:29 AM »

Quote from: poche

Twelve years ago, the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith looked anticipated the possibility that some states might recognize same-sex marriage, and said:

In those situations where ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions have been legally recognized or have been given the legal status and rights belonging to marriage, clear and emphatic opposition is a duty. One must refrain from any kind of formal cooperation in the enactment or application of such gravely unjust laws and, as far as possible, from material cooperation on the level of their application. In this area, everyone can exercise the right to conscientious objection.

http://www.catholic culture.org/commentary/the-city-gates.cfm?id=1097

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/docuмents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ-unions_en.html

What did Francis say clearly and emphatically regarding the Supreme Court ruling which affects the entire US?

Also, did Francis distance himself from his UN allies? Did he desist with any formal cooperation from the UN?

Nuff' said.

poche · « **Reply #2 on:** July 03, 2015, 03:25:11 AM »

Quote from: GottmitunsAlex

Quote from: poche
Twelve years ago, the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith looked anticipated the possibility that some states might recognize same-sex marriage, and said:

In those situations where ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions have been legally recognized or have been given the legal status and rights belonging to marriage, clear and emphatic opposition is a duty. One must refrain from any kind of formal cooperation in the enactment or application of such gravely unjust laws and, as far as possible, from material cooperation on the level of their application. In this area, everyone can exercise the right to conscientious objection.

http://www.catholic culture.org/commentary/the-city-gates.cfm?id=1097

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/docuмents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ-unions_en.html

What did Francis say clearly and emphatically regarding the Supreme Court ruling which affects the entire US?

Also, did Francis distance himself from his UN allies? Did he desist with any formal cooperation from the UN?

Nuff' said.

I am not sure that what the Supreme court of the United States does is very important to Pope Francis. This issue is a worldwide issue. There are evil developments all over te globe what happens in the United States is just another domino in an evil movement.

TKGS · « **Reply #3 on:** July 03, 2015, 07:53:18 AM »

Quote from: poche

Quote from: GottmitunsAlex
Quote from: poche
Twelve years ago, the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith looked anticipated the possibility that some states might recognize same-sex marriage, and said:

In those situations where ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions have been legally recognized or have been given the legal status and rights belonging to marriage, clear and emphatic opposition is a duty. One must refrain from any kind of formal cooperation in the enactment or application of such gravely unjust laws and, as far as possible, from material cooperation on the level of their application. In this area, everyone can exercise the right to conscientious objection.

http://www.catholic culture.org/commentary/the-city-gates.cfm?id=1097

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/docuмents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ-unions_en.html

What did Francis say clearly and emphatically regarding the Supreme Court ruling which affects the entire US?

Also, did Francis distance himself from his UN allies? Did he desist with any formal cooperation from the UN?

Nuff' said.

I am not sure that what the Supreme court of the United States does is very important to Pope Francis. This issue is a worldwide issue. There are evil developments all over te globe what happens in the United States is just another domino in an evil movement.

Then what has "Pope Francis" said about this "worldwide issue"? I mean, other than, "Who am I to judge?"

Bergoglio doesn't consider himself bound by anything Our Lord Jesus Christ said, let alone something Joseph Ratzinger put out 12 years ago as head of the CDF.

Viva Cristo Rey · « **Reply #4 on:** July 03, 2015, 09:27:09 AM »

Quote from: poche

Twelve years ago, the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith looked anticipated the possibility that some states might recognize same-sex marriage, and said:

In those situations where ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions have been legally recognized or have been given the legal status and rights belonging to marriage, clear and emphatic opposition is a duty. One must refrain from any kind of formal cooperation in the enactment or application of such gravely unjust laws and, as far as possible, from material cooperation on the level of their application. In this area, everyone can exercise the right to conscientious objection.

http://www.catholic culture.org/commentary/the-city-gates.cfm?id=1097

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/docuмents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ-unions_en.html

Actions speak louder then words.

When Dolan says bravo to ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs, the whole world was watching.
When he led the ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs in the St Pat's Parade, the whole world was watching. Rome as usual was silent.

Rome was silent and protected pedophile priests.

Rome wasn't silent when Archbishop Lefebvre concecrated bishops.

poche · « **Reply #5 on:** July 06, 2015, 11:50:23 PM »

Quote from: Viva Cristo Rey

Quote from: poche
Twelve years ago, the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith looked anticipated the possibility that some states might recognize same-sex marriage, and said:

In those situations where ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions have been legally recognized or have been given the legal status and rights belonging to marriage, clear and emphatic opposition is a duty. One must refrain from any kind of formal cooperation in the enactment or application of such gravely unjust laws and, as far as possible, from material cooperation on the level of their application. In this area, everyone can exercise the right to conscientious objection.

http://www.catholic culture.org/commentary/the-city-gates.cfm?id=1097

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/docuмents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ-unions_en.html

Actions speak louder then words.

When Dolan says bravo to ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs, the whole world was watching.
When he led the ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs in the St Pat's Parade, the whole world was watching. Rome as usual was silent.

Rome was silent and protected pedophile priests.

Rome wasn't silent when Archbishop Lefebvre concecrated bishops.

In the past Rome may have been silent about pedophile priests but now they have charged one ex-nuncio criminally. They have also removed bishops and priests who have been found to have been complicit. Now there is a new department in the Vatican to investigate and punish those found to have been complicit and negligent.

TKGS · « **Reply #6 on:** July 07, 2015, 06:33:07 AM »

Quote from: poche

In the past Rome may have been silent about pedophile priests but now they have charged one ex-nuncio criminally. They have also removed bishops and priests who have been found to have been complicit. Now there is a new department in the Vatican to investigate and punish those found to have been complicit and negligent.

I think the few actions against a few individuals is an attempt at public relations rather than a true attempt at correcting the problem. Rome isn't "cleaning up its act" in any way. They are making a few examples in order to make some people think they're "doing something". And it appears to be working.

JPaul · « **Reply #7 on:** July 07, 2015, 10:24:15 AM »

There are many known ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ Bishops in the U.S. and Europe. Rome has known for decades. They have done nothing about them, and they will do nothing about them.
ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ priests operate freely under ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ Bishops.

Also, folks need to stop using the terms of the Jєωιѕн media when referring to these priests. They are not pedophiles, they are ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs.

This has been from the beginning, a ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ operation within the Church and the Vatican, which research shows is crawling with them.

Benedict XVI and Who is he to judge, both know who they are.

Gregory I · « **Reply #8 on:** July 09, 2015, 12:27:31 AM »

Quote from: J.Paul

There are many known ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ Bishops in the U.S. and Europe. Rome has known for decades. They have done nothing about them, and they will do nothing about them.
ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ priests operate freely under ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ Bishops.

Also, folks need to stop using the terms of the Jєωιѕн media when referring to these priests. They are not pedophiles, they are ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs.

This has been from the beginning, a ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ operation within the Church and the Vatican, which research shows is crawling with them.

Benedict XVI and Who is he to judge, both know who they are.

AS bad as this may be, let us remember, we are not Donatists, and that the moral depravity of individuals does not invalidate their office and the respect we owe to it (not them). Let us always call to mind first our own sins and try to stop being part of the problem in that sense, and perhaps one day our own sanctity will allow our voices to be heard. In the meantime, let us resist as best as we can serenely and peacefully, in the grace of God, yet using the gift of Anger, which is the incendiary power of the soul, against our real enemy :Satan and his minions. Let us also remember that no one really wants to do evil, but people get caught up in worldliness and worldly ways of thinking. They are also victims of the deceptions of the evil one.

Just a few thoughts. It's not so much us vs them, conservative vs liberal, Straight vs gαy as ALL OF US Vs Satan, just the majority are deceived. But are we less deceived if we turn into backbiters, slanderers, hypocrites and verbal murderers of the brethren???

No accusations here, just rumination. :detective:

TKGS · « **Reply #9 on:** July 09, 2015, 08:27:56 AM »

Quote from: Gregory I

AS bad as this may be, let us remember, we are not Donatists, and that the moral depravity of individuals does not invalidate their office and the respect we owe to it (not them).

You're right. Their moral depravity does not invalidate their offices. Their public and pertinacious heresy and apostasy invalidates their offices. The fact that most of them are ordained and consecrated using doubtful and invalid rites invalidates their priesthood and episcopacy.

They deserve the same sort of respect we would give to a Lutheran pastor, a Baptist minister, an Anglican bishop, the Dalai Lama. They deserve civility. Nothing more.

JPaul · « **Reply #10 on:** July 10, 2015, 11:01:43 AM »

It is out of respect for their offices and for love of the Brethren, (whose souls are imperiled by this shirking rebellion against the Church), that we protest their culpable failure to live up to the duties of those offices.

Neither your sins nor my sins, are responsible for their sins. That they choose to serve another master, must by justice, generate a passion in the Catholic heart to defend God's honor and His Church.

We love all, with Christ's love as we are commanded, but we also stand against those who would despoil His flock, and mock His Majesty.

PerEvangelicaDicta · « **Reply #11 on:** July 10, 2015, 11:13:28 AM »

Quote

Also, folks need to stop using the terms of the Jєωιѕн media when referring to these priests. They are not pedophiles, they are ~~ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs~~ sodomites.

This can't be stressed enough.

Quote

Neither your sins nor my sins, are responsible for their sins.

This nightmare is certainly chastisement so wouldn't we be culpable?

poche · « **Reply #12 on:** July 10, 2015, 11:33:08 PM »

The Vatican says;

10. If it is true that all Catholics are obliged to oppose the legal recognition of ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions, Catholic politicians are obliged to do so in a particular way, in keeping with their responsibility as politicians. Faced with legislative proposals in favour of ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions, Catholic politicians are to take account of the following ethical indications.

When legislation in favour of the recognition of ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions is proposed for the first time in a legislative assembly, the Catholic law-maker has a moral duty to express his opposition clearly and publicly and to vote against it. To vote in favour of a law so harmful to the common good is gravely immoral.

When legislation in favour of the recognition of ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ unions is already in force, the Catholic politician must oppose it in the ways that are possible for him and make his opposition known; it is his duty to witness to the truth. If it is not possible to repeal such a law completely, the Catholic politician, recalling the indications contained in the Encyclical Letter Evangelium vitae, “could licitly support proposals aimed at limiting the harm done by such a law and at lessening its negative consequences at the level of general opinion and public morality”, on condition that his “absolute personal opposition” to such laws was clear and well known and that the danger of scandal was avoided.(18) This does not mean that a more restrictive law in this area could be considered just or even acceptable; rather, it is a question of the legitimate and dutiful attempt to obtain at least the partial repeal of an unjust law when its total abrogation is not possible at the moment.

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/docuмents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ-unions_en.html

JPaul · « **Reply #13 on:** July 11, 2015, 07:40:47 AM »

Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta

Quote
Also, folks need to stop using the terms of the Jєωιѕн media when referring to these priests. They are not pedophiles, they are ~~ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs~~ sodomites.

This can't be stressed enough.

Quote
Neither your sins nor my sins, are responsible for their sins.

This nightmare is certainly chastisement so wouldn't we be culpable?

Yes, the Church has suffered from a deliberate infestation of ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖs which occurred many decades ago and continues today, for the purpose of doing what it is doing today, destroying faith and defacing the Church.

While the success of the revolutionaries may in part be due to the general failure of Catholics to be faithful, each man has the power and free will to sin, or not to sin.
So we, who are trying our best to be faithful and avoid sin, are not responsible for the free decisions of the faithless to commit sins.