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Author Topic: Jurisdiction  (Read 1098 times)

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Offline Capt McQuigg

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Jurisdiction
« on: March 06, 2013, 01:16:52 PM »
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  • I want to get a solid grasp on "jurisdiction" and what it means to the Holy Church and how it applies in every day life.

    Can anyone here please suggest a particular book or article (online or otherwise).

    I want to study Jurisdiction from solid sources so I can have a solid grasp on the concept.



    Offline Kephapaulos

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    Jurisdiction
    « Reply #1 on: March 07, 2013, 01:34:39 PM »
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  • I would like to learn more too. I ordered the first three volumes of Msgr. G. van Noort's Dogmatic Theology. I would guess the volume on the Church would answer questions concerning jurisdiction. There is also Rev. E. Sylvester Berry's The Church: A Dogmatic and Apologetic Treatise.
    "Non nobis, Domine, non nobis; sed nomini tuo da gloriam..." (Ps. 113:9)


    Offline Ambrose

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    Jurisdiction
    « Reply #2 on: March 07, 2013, 03:13:24 PM »
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  • This article from the CE cover the basic concept:  http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07322c.htm

    The Council of Trent, The Catechism of the Council of Trent, Papal Teaching, The Teaching of the Holy Office, The Teaching of the Church Fathers, The Code of Canon Law, Countless approved catechisms, The Doctors of the Church, The teaching of the Dogmatic

    Offline Nishant

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    Jurisdiction
    « Reply #3 on: March 07, 2013, 03:42:24 PM »
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  • This one as well. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08567a.htm

    Very brriefly, the power of jurisdiction is the governing authority Christ bestowed upon His Church, which in the Apostles and their successors confers the right to rule and in the subjects ruled the duty to obey. Many tomes have been generously uploaded on the same in the past on this forum by Hobbledehoy and others.

    In particular, if you're in a hurry, I think this paragraph captures the essence of it.

    Quote
    The Church founded by Christ for the salvation of men needs, like every society, a regulating power (the authority of the Church). This power Christ has bestowed upon it. Directly before His Ascension He gave to the Apostles collectively the commission, and with it the authority, to proclaim his doctrine to all nations, to baptize them, and to teach them to observe all things that He had commanded (Matthew 28:18 sqq.). It may be noted here that the Decree "Lamentabili sane", of 3 July, 1907, rejects (n. 52 sqq.) the doctrine that Christ did not desire to found a permanent, unchangeable Church endowed with authority.

    It is customary to speak of a threefold office of the Church: the office of teaching (prophetic office), the priestly office, and the pastoral office (governing office), also, therefore, of the threefold authority of the Church, that is, the teaching authority, ministerial authority, and ruling authority. Since, however, the teaching of the Church is authoritative, the teaching authority is traditionally included in the ruling authority; regularly, therefore, only the ministerial authority and the ruling authority are distinguished. By ministerial authority, which is conferred by an act of consecration, is meant the inward, and, because of its indelible character, permanent capacity to perform acts by which Divine grace is transmitted. By ruling authority, which is conferred by the Church (missio canonica, canonical mission), is understood the authority to guide and rule the Church of God. Jurisdiction, in so far as it covers the relations of man to God, is called jurisdiction of the internal forum or jurisdiction of the forum of Heaven (jurisdictio poli).

    This again is either sacramental or penitential, so far as it is used in the Sacrament of Penance, or extra-sacramental, e.g. in granting dispensations from private vows. Jurisdiction, in so far as it regulates external ecclesiastical relations, is called jurisdiction of the external forum, or briefly jurisdictio fori. This jurisdiction, the actual power of ruling is legislative, judicial, or coactive. Jurisdiction can be possessed in varying degrees. It can also be held either for both fora, or for the internal forum only, e.g. by the parish priest. Jurisdiction can be further sub-divided into: ordinary, quasi-ordinary, and delegated jurisdiction. Ordinary jurisdiction is that which is permanently bound, by Divine or human law, with a permanent ecclesiastical office. Its possessor is called an ordinary judge. By Divine law the pope has such ordinary jurisdiction for the entire Church and a bishop for his diocese.

    By human law this jurisdiction is possessed by the cardinals, officials of the Curia and the congregations of cardinals, the patriarchs, primates, metropolitans, archbishops, the praelati nullius, and prelates with quasi-epsicopal jurisdiction, the chapters of orders, or, respectively, the heads of orders, cathedral chapters in reference to their own affairs, the archdiaconate in the Middle Ages, and parish priests in the internal forum. If, however, jurisdiction is permanently connected with an office, but the office itself is said to be quasi-ordinary, or jurisdictio vicaria. This form of jurisdiction is possessed, for example, by a vicar-general. Temporary exercise of ordinary and quasi-ordinary jurisdiction can be granted, in varying degrees, to another as representative, without conferring on him an office properly so called. In this transient form jurisdiction is called delegated or extraordinary, and concerning it canon law, following the Roman law, has developed exhaustive provisions. This development began when the popes, especially since Alexander III (1159-81), found themselves obliged, by the enormous mass of legal business which came to them from all sides as the "judices ordinarii omnium" to hand over, with proper instruction, a large number of cases to third parties for decision, especially in matters of contentious jurisdiction.

    "Never will anyone who says his Rosary every day become a formal heretic ... This is a statement I would sign in my blood." St. Montfort, Secret of the Rosary. I support the FSSP, the SSPX and other priests who work for the restoration of doctrinal orthodoxy and liturgical orthopraxis in the Church. I accept Vatican II if interpreted in the light of Tradition and canonisations as an infallible declaration that a person is in Heaven. Sedevacantism is schismatic and Ecclesiavacantism is heretical.

    Offline TKGS

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    Jurisdiction
    « Reply #4 on: March 07, 2013, 03:44:36 PM »
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  • Go to the website:  http://sedevacantist.com/

    There are some docuмents concerning jurisdiction there.  I believe they are in the discussion forum though I don't remember where.


    Offline 7sorrowsbvm

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    Jurisdiction
    « Reply #5 on: March 09, 2013, 10:09:24 PM »
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  • Quote
    ...how it applies in every day life.


    The most important thing:

    A priest must have jurisdiction in order to absolve sins in confession because absolution is by nature a judicial act.  The jurisdiction is normally delegated to a priest from an ordinary (bishop), but may be supplied automatically by the Church in other cases.   The sacrament is invalid if the priest has no jurisdiction.

    The code of canon law (1917) covers this and, if I remember correctly, St. Thomas discusses the necessity of jurisdiction in the Summa.
    Is it not we miserable sinners who pierced this most innocent heart of Mary at the time of the Passion of the Savior, with countless thousands of shafts of sorrow by our innumerable sins? How greatly are we obliged, then, to render all the honor within

    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Jurisdiction
    « Reply #6 on: March 09, 2013, 11:45:53 PM »
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  • Quote from: 7sorrowsbvm
    Quote
    ...how it applies in every day life.


    The most important thing:

    A priest must have jurisdiction in order to absolve sins in confession because absolution is by nature a judicial act.  The jurisdiction is normally delegated to a priest from an ordinary (bishop), but may be supplied automatically by the Church in other cases.   The sacrament is invalid if the priest has no jurisdiction.

    The code of canon law (1917) covers this and, if I remember correctly, St. Thomas discusses the necessity of jurisdiction in the Summa.


    It's like you are clairvoyant, or something to that effect.

    I want to study Jurisdiction and I want to have a solid grasp on the topic so I could discern Jurisdiction and how it applies in this time of a devastating historical State of Emergency.


    Offline Ambrose

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    Jurisdiction
    « Reply #7 on: March 10, 2013, 06:53:27 AM »
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  • Quote from: Capt McQuigg
    Quote from: 7sorrowsbvm
    Quote
    ...how it applies in every day life.


    The most important thing:

    A priest must have jurisdiction in order to absolve sins in confession because absolution is by nature a judicial act.  The jurisdiction is normally delegated to a priest from an ordinary (bishop), but may be supplied automatically by the Church in other cases.   The sacrament is invalid if the priest has no jurisdiction.

    The code of canon law (1917) covers this and, if I remember correctly, St. Thomas discusses the necessity of jurisdiction in the Summa.


    It's like you are clairvoyant, or something to that effect.

    I want to study Jurisdiction and I want to have a solid grasp on the topic so I could discern Jurisdiction and how it applies in this time of a devastating historical State of Emergency.



    Capt McQuigg,

    It is very useful to understand jurisdiction during this crisis, but I would also urge a related study of supplied jurisdiction and epikeia.  

    For example, if a priest does not have permission from the local bishop to hear confessions, the jurisdiction could be supplied if the conditions are met.  This is the justification used by the traditional clergy to hear confessions.  

    The Council of Trent, The Catechism of the Council of Trent, Papal Teaching, The Teaching of the Holy Office, The Teaching of the Church Fathers, The Code of Canon Law, Countless approved catechisms, The Doctors of the Church, The teaching of the Dogmatic


    Offline MyrnaM

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    Jurisdiction
    « Reply #8 on: March 10, 2013, 09:05:20 AM »
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  • I agree with Ambrose, above,  to say otherwise means God left us orphans.  
    Please pray for my soul.
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    Offline Stubborn

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    Jurisdiction
    « Reply #9 on: March 12, 2013, 07:46:06 AM »
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  • Bishops frequently reproach me, and remind me, that I confer the Sacrament where I am not authorized. To them I answer that I confirm because the faithful fear that their children have not received the grace of Confirmation, because they have a serious doubt as to the validity of the Sacrament conferred in their Churches. Therefore, in order that they might at least be secure in their knowledge of the validity of the sacramental grace, they ask that I confirm their children. And I respond to their plea because it appears to me that I may not refuse those who request that their confirmation be valid, even if it may not be licit. We are clearly at a time when divine natural and supernatural law takes precedence over positive Church law when the latter is opposed to the former, when in reality it should be the channel leading to it. - From A Lecture Given by His Grace Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre -  An Examination of the Shocking Similarities Between the "New Mass" and Luther's "Mass"

    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse