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Author Topic: is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV  (Read 7591 times)

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Offline TCat

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is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
« on: August 22, 2013, 07:25:46 AM »
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  • Apart from them being sedevacante believers.
    Crux Sacra Sit Mihi Lux! Ne Draco Sit Mihi Dux!


    Offline Binechi

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #1 on: August 22, 2013, 08:11:30 AM »
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  • Not to detract from SSPV..  But , you asked.

    On the back of their bulletins , they have the requirements for reception of Holy Communion.  

    One Cannot hold to not believing in Baptism of Desire (No acceptance)

    One must not come to the altar rail if you are going to "Schismatic Priests"
    I think that is another  way of saying , "Thuc" line Priests.  

    And of course , you have to be practicing exclusively the Traditional Faith,
    No Novus Ordo , back and forth.

    Seems its ok to be coming from SSPX Mass s , as they don t mention that in their bulletin.  

    Best to give the Chapel s a call and talk to one of the Priests, these requirements may have changed.

    Dedicated Group, Great bunch of Sisters. Good Schools for the younger families.


    Offline TKGS

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #2 on: August 22, 2013, 08:55:31 AM »
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  • The only thing I specifically know about the SSPV is that they do refuse communion to anyone who accepts the Thuc line priests and bishops.  I do not understand their objections as their objections are weak and have been very adequately refuted many times.

    The CMRI does not refuse communion to any Catholic in the state of grace.

    Offline MyrnaM

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #3 on: August 22, 2013, 09:30:56 AM »
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  • I attended Catholic schools my entire life and I can honestly say CMRI has never taught or said anything different than the Roman Catholic Church I was brought up in.  I was born in 1940 so I had a taste of the True Church before being led into the novus ordo, and through the grace of God brought right back where I started from through CMRI, remnant of Roman Catholic church.  

    CMRI does not believe in refusing the sacraments, unless the priest knows without a doubt the person is not Catholic and never has been one.  This is what I was taught prior to Vatican II as well.  

    The sermons from CMRI are exactly the same as what I was taught, including belief in BOD and BOB, just different persons (priests) giving them. As a child growing up in the Roman Catholic church, it was stressed we can not judge the soul of another person at death, as CMRI teaches.  Which is why they do not judge at the Communion rail, just because a stranger comes to Mass.  

    Even prior to Vatican II, persons received Communion unworthy, this has always been an abuse, which is why in the Bible we are warned when we receive Our Lord, we will be judged according to the disposition of our soul.
     
    All the other groups, traditional, have little defects within them that are foreign to the way I was taught in the Church.  A good example from SSPX; it was unheard of to speak from the pulpit about bad deeds from the Holy Father, as SSPX believes he is, and yet they speak about him in such a way; and from the pulpit no less, they have no respect for the office he holds (according to their belief about him).  

    SSPV, refusing sacraments just because they do not know the person, or do not approve what Mass he has been attending, as if they are God themselves, judging souls of good willed people, and by whose authority, I would like to know.

    CMRI is willing to face the facts about what is going on, and face the truth that Masons, Commies, and Protestants should not only be refused Communion but they also can not be popes.  Therefore CMRI is not lukewarm which is the opposite of having a holy zeal for saving souls, the first mission of the Church of Christ.  They are not afraid to tell it as it is. Tcat, if you want the Truth and think you can live with the Truth, talk to a CMRI priest.  
    Please pray for my soul.
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    Offline TCat

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #4 on: August 22, 2013, 11:55:26 AM »
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  • I was watching a conference on the youtube channel "sedevideos"
    It was a conference of sedevacante clergy back in 1991.
    The CMRI bishop present said that you can go to SSPX if there is nothing else available, but that they don't recommend it.
    I never heard of the SSPV before, but one priest from the SSPV was there (but in the video you cant see him) and he said that their position is that someone cannot go to CMRI because of some situation where some bishop who was schismatic back in 1910 started a line of bishops and that there are priests in CMRI who were ordained by a bishop who was ordained by a bishop in schkism.

    The CMRI priest says that cannon law says that the excommunication does not pass "from father to son" and that just because the original skismztic was something called "Old Catholic" that he could still consecrate others.

    Very interesting but I fear these groups are only in the US and not near me.
    The only trad group is the SSPX, and if I would get trad Catholicism from joining them I would join one of their monasteries if I could.
    Crux Sacra Sit Mihi Lux! Ne Draco Sit Mihi Dux!


    Offline Binechi

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #5 on: August 22, 2013, 12:30:12 PM »
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  • I understood that the CMRI Priests were conditionally Ordained ?

    If your in another Country , Then I guess , you have no other Choice, if that group fits your bill of what the Church has always taught , and  is the best way to save your Soul.


    Offline TCat

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #6 on: August 22, 2013, 12:44:35 PM »
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  • Quote from: Director
    I understood that the CMRI Priests were conditionally Ordained ?


    Yes some were, but their original ordination was done by a valid bishop, who as far as I understand it, became "old catholic", then renounced that position made a confession and eventually became a valid bishop, he then ordained some priests who are valid priests. As the story goes as far as I gather he later carried out some unspecified uncatholic acts and the priests confronted him and he left mount saint michaels seminary.
    The priests were conditionally ordained by a valid bishop who used the latin rite and who also said he did not doubt the validity of their first ordination.

    The conference on the "sedevideos" channel on youtube has 13 videos of talks where I got this information.

    Also I wonder if I could join an SSPX monastery if I did not believe that francis was a valid pope because of heresy. I guess I must contact such a place and find out from them.
    Crux Sacra Sit Mihi Lux! Ne Draco Sit Mihi Dux!

    Offline Hobbledehoy

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #7 on: August 22, 2013, 12:51:43 PM »
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  • Quote from: Director
    I understood that the CMRI Priests were conditionally Ordained?


    Yes, this is true: those who were ordained by Schuckhardt submitted to conditional Ordination after he was out of the picture, and those who were yet to be ordained at that time had recourse to traditionalist Bishops for Sacred Orders. The objection raised on the part of SSPV and other adversaries of the CMRI regarding Schuckhardt is therefore moot, but that has not stopped them from bringing this up time and time again.
    Please ignore all that I have written regarding sedevacantism.


    Offline MyrnaM

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #8 on: August 22, 2013, 01:27:58 PM »
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  • Quote from: Hobbledehoy
    Quote from: Director
    I understood that the CMRI Priests were conditionally Ordained?


    Yes, this is true: those who were ordained by Schuckhardt submitted to conditional Ordination after he was out of the picture, and those who were yet to be ordained at that time had recourse to traditionalist Bishops for Sacred Orders. The objection raised on the part of SSPV and other adversaries of the CMRI regarding Schuckhardt is therefore moot, but that has not stopped them from bringing this up time and time again.


    As always another true and thought out reply.   :applause:
    Please pray for my soul.
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    Online Ladislaus

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #9 on: August 22, 2013, 01:49:46 PM »
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  • Yes, that's what SSPV means by "schismatic" bishops; they're not referring to the Thuc line per se, but rather to the CMRI or anyone who has been "contaminated" by the CMRI.  They kindof view "schism" as a contagious disease, so that if you have any communicatio in sacris with schismatics such as the Old Catholics, then you become schismatic yourself unless you formally abjure the schism.  Now, I don't even think it would be enough for the CMRI to abjure Old Catholicism in general; SSPV would have them basically abolish the CMRI, break any ties or contagion lineage with them, and possibly form a new group.

    But of course they regard the Thuc bishops as dubious (invalid in practice), so that's a separate issue.

    Offline Hobbledehoy

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #10 on: August 22, 2013, 02:05:52 PM »
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  • Quote from: Ladislaus
    Yes, that's what SSPV means by "schismatic" bishops; they're not referring to the Thuc line per se, but rather to the CMRI or anyone who has been "contaminated" by the CMRI.  They kindof view "schism" as a contagious disease, so that if you have any communicatio in sacris with schismatics such as the Old Catholics, then you become schismatic yourself unless you formally abjure the schism.  Now, I don't even think it would be enough for the CMRI to abjure Old Catholicism in general; SSPV would have them basically abolish the CMRI, break any ties or contagion lineage with them, and possibly form a new group.


    That's sounds more like what Bp. Sanborn has said regarding the CMRI, both publicly and privately.

    The SSPV neither have the authority nor the competence to exclude Catholics from Holy Communion merely because they receive the Sacraments from "Thucite Bishops." Their arguments against Archbp. Thuc have been roundly refuted and yet they still continue to condemn clergy such as the CMRI from the pulpit. There is no precedent in ecclesiastical history for such an aberrant and scandalous practice, and it only serves to exacerbate the SSPV's own problematic situation all the more.
    Please ignore all that I have written regarding sedevacantism.


    Offline Sigismund

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #11 on: August 22, 2013, 05:09:06 PM »
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  • Quote from: Hobbledehoy
    Quote from: Director
    I understood that the CMRI Priests were conditionally Ordained?


    Yes, this is true: those who were ordained by Schuckhardt submitted to conditional Ordination after he was out of the picture, and those who were yet to be ordained at that time had recourse to traditionalist Bishops for Sacred Orders. The objection raised on the part of SSPV and other adversaries of the CMRI regarding Schuckhardt is therefore moot, but that has not stopped them from bringing this up time and time again.


    Yes, and this corrected the problem from any reasonable perspective.  
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir

    Offline Iuvenalis

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #12 on: August 24, 2013, 09:18:23 AM »
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  • Quote from: Sigismund
    Quote from: Hobbledehoy
    Quote from: Director
    I understood that the CMRI Priests were conditionally Ordained?


    Yes, this is true: those who were ordained by Schuckhardt submitted to conditional Ordination after he was out of the picture, and those who were yet to be ordained at that time had recourse to traditionalist Bishops for Sacred Orders. The objection raised on the part of SSPV and other adversaries of the CMRI regarding Schuckhardt is therefore moot, but that has not stopped them from bringing this up time and time again.


    Yes, and this corrected the problem from any reasonable perspective.  


    I was unaware of the conditional reords.

    I always worried in the back of my mind about ordinations by Schuckhardt and what it meant for CMRI, it does indeed sound like it is moot.

    Offline Hobbledehoy

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #13 on: August 24, 2013, 02:52:26 PM »
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  • It took exceeding great integrity, courage, self-detachment and zeal for the glory of God and the salvation of souls for the CMRI Fathers to have undergone the humiliation of seeking conditional Ordination after Schuckhardt's expulsion from Mt. St. Michael's.

    In this one may behold the fruits of true devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary as taught in the spiritual doctrine of St. Louis-Marie.

    The CMRI Fathers knew that this was the only way to allay the scruples that would understandably assail the consciences of the faithful and to silence the waylayers who would seek to defame them in times to come. Unfortunately, however, the adversaries of the CMRI still discuss Schuckhardt as if he had any relevance when it comes to the validity of these Priests' sacred Orders.
    Please ignore all that I have written regarding sedevacantism.

    Offline Iuvenalis

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    is there anything I should know about the CMRI and SSPV
    « Reply #14 on: August 24, 2013, 11:24:13 PM »
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  • Hobbledehoy,

    What of questioning the CMRI's *charism* because of the founder/Schuckhardt? (As opposed to the validity of Holy Orders, which very well seems settled)