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Author Topic: Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?  (Read 1650 times)

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Offline Nathan

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Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
« on: January 10, 2013, 11:19:33 PM »
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    • Could someone explain to me (or provide a source that explains) whether or not the confiteor before the communion of the people is optional or obligatory?  I just read recently that it was against the rubrics, but Archbishop Lefebvre added it by his own authority because he wanted to.  Is this true or false?
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    Offline Incredulous

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    Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
    « Reply #1 on: January 11, 2013, 12:42:05 AM »
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    • Quick explanation, without sources:

    There are three Confiteors in the Tridentine Mass:

    1st: For remitting sins of the celebrant priest (foot of the altar).

    2nd: For remitting the sins of the altar server (foot of the altar)

    3rd: For remitting the sins of the faitiful comminicants assisting at the Mass.
           The altar server does this for the faithful just before the "Ecce Agnus Dei".

    You want to be sure this Confiteor is prayed for yourself and that you get the priest's absolution.

    Its just another example of why the Novus ordo missae is evil.

    Evil ?  Yes, because it removed something abosolutely good from the Mass.

    According to +ABL, this is the definition of evil.
    To remove an "absolute good" from something, is evil.

    Consider that the reason for removing the "Confiteor of the faithful" must be considered diabolical.

    What does it do?   It sets up the faithful to then receive the Holy Eucharist without the priestly absolution for their venial sins.  
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    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline Quo Vadis Petre

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    Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
    « Reply #2 on: January 11, 2013, 12:56:55 AM »
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    • Pre-1962, it was obligatory. 1962, it was omitted. Omitting it blurs the distinction between the Communion of the priest and the Communion of the people. Contrary to Modernist liturgical ideas, it isn't a repetition but for the people, whereas the 2nd confiteor after the priest was for the ministers at the altar.
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    "In our time more than ever before, the greatest asset of the evil-disposed is the cowardice and weakness of good men, and all the vigour of Satan's reign is due to the easy-going weakness of Catholics." -St. Pius X

    "If the Church were not divine, this

    Offline TKGS

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    Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
    « Reply #3 on: January 11, 2013, 06:46:48 AM »
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    • I think it must be said that Archbishop Lefebvre did not add "it by his own authority because he wanted to."  

    In Church Law something takes on the force of law when it becomes a custom of many years (I won't get into precise numbers here because I don't know for sure what they are--but I don't think it is necessarily a precision issue).  The Confetior prior to Communion began a few centuries ago as a pious practice in churches throughout the world.  Rome later made it obligatory.  Thus, it began through custom and not legal fiat.  

    The 1962 Missal removed the legal requirement.  The SSPX was originally flexible on which Missal the priests used.  Some used the 1962 Missal, others used an earlier Missal.  In the United States, I understand that most Society chapels used the 1955 Missal.  At some point, Archbishop Lefebvre standardized the Missal used in Society chapels to the 1962 Missal.  Although the Confetior prior to Holy Communion is not in this Missal, the archbishop recognized that its use was of long established custom and, because many of the faithful wished its retention, he encouraged its inclusion in the Masses of Society priests.  I don't think a priest who uses the 1962 Missal is necessarily wrong or right to include or exclude the Confetior prior to Holy Communion.

    One additional comment:  The Confetior said at the foot of the altar is not said solely for the servers.  If there are no servers, the priest's Confetior is said on behalf of himself and the people.  If there are servers, the Confetior is said on behalf of themselves and the people.  The layman in the pew does not have to "say" the Confetior in order to receive the benefits of the forgiveness of venial sins.
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    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
    « Reply #4 on: January 11, 2013, 08:50:29 PM »
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    • Quote from: Incredulous
    Quick explanation, without sources:

    There are three Confiteors in the Tridentine Mass:

    1st: For remitting sins of the celebrant priest (foot of the altar).

    2nd: For remitting the sins of the altar server (foot of the altar)

    3rd: For remitting the sins of the faitiful comminicants assisting at the Mass.
           The altar server does this for the faithful just before the "Ecce Agnus Dei".

    You want to be sure this Confiteor is prayed for yourself and that you get the priest's absolution.

    Its just another example of why the Novus ordo missae is evil.

    Evil ?  Yes, because it removed something abosolutely good from the Mass.

    According to +ABL, this is the definition of evil.
    To remove an "absolute good" from something, is evil.

    Consider that the reason for removing the "Confiteor of the faithful" must be considered diabolical.

    What does it do?   It sets up the faithful to then receive the Holy Eucharist without the priestly absolution for their venial sins.  



    Well said.

    Read this everyone.
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    Offline parentsfortruth

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    Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
    « Reply #5 on: January 12, 2013, 02:09:43 PM »
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    • Maybe off the subject, but I feel that the resistance priests should really consider the use of a PRE 1962 missal, since the SSPX has no power to dictate which missal they must use anymore.
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    Matthew 5:37

    But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over and above these, is of evil.

    My Avatar is Fr. Hector Bolduc. He was a faithful parish priest in De Pere, WI,

    Offline drivocek

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    Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
    « Reply #6 on: January 21, 2013, 12:05:29 PM »
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    • In the 1940'3 and 1950's, we always had the confiteor before Communion.
    Altar boy in 50s. Seminarian 50's to 1962 at which time I left and would have been ordained in 1969 according to changed rites.

            Quantum Potes, Tantum Aude!
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    Offline drivocek

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    Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
    « Reply #7 on: January 21, 2013, 12:10:08 PM »
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    • Quote from: parentsfortruth
    Maybe off the subject, but I feel that the resistance priests should really consider the use of a PRE 1962 missal, since the SSPX has no power to dictate which missal they must use anymore.


         Fr. Hannifin (Requiescat in Pace) never used the 1962 missal and he was a saint. On a First Saturday, I was only attendee and he asked me to be his altar
    boy. At the Consecration, he elevated the host and I watched him change into a radiant being of light. I blinked and looked again. It was real. I saw a young man in a being of light. Same happened at elevation of the chalice. He and I never discussed. I know he is a saint.

        Agree Parents for Truth.

         Quantum Potes, Tantum Aude!
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    Offline drivocek

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    Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
    « Reply #8 on: January 31, 2013, 10:30:29 AM »
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    • Quote from: parentsfortruth
    Maybe off the subject, but I feel that the resistance priests should really consider the use of a PRE 1962 missal, since the SSPX has no power to dictate which missal they must use anymore.


            Agree.
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    Offline drivocek

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    Is the 2nd Confiteor Optional?
    « Reply #9 on: January 31, 2013, 10:37:45 AM »
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    • Quote from: Nathan
    Could someone explain to me (or provide a source that explains) whether or not the confiteor before the communion of the people is optional or obligatory?  I just read recently that it was against the rubrics, but Archbishop Lefebvre added it by his own authority because he wanted to.  Is this true or false?


      FALSE! We used the confiteor before Communion in 40's and 50's. I was an altar boy then and remember those good ol's days. Rising at 5:00 A. M. to bicycle to church (2 blocks), open the church, turn the lights on, ring the bells (my daddy had to make a noose for a short rope so that I could connnect to the large rope and swing up about 10 feet in the air for the 5:30 Bells and the 5:45 bells for the 6:00 A. M. Mass which I served for several years.

       Oh, another point: Altar boys said the second "Domine, non sum dignus . . "
    I was so surprisedm to finally find the Tridentine Mass and see the priest say the second "Domine, non sum dignus    . . . ."

                   Tantum Aude!
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