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Author Topic: Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"  (Read 4157 times)

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Offline TKGS

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Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2013, 06:47:45 AM »
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  • Quote from: Nishant
    Well, here it is.

    http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/francesco/encyclicals/docuмents/papa-francesco_20130629_enciclica-lumen-fidei_en.html


    The Vatican's pdf is 88 pages.  They used big type and large margins, but this would have been a long encyclical anyway.  I wonder how many people will read it.

    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #16 on: July 05, 2013, 09:05:58 AM »
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  • I can't wait to read it! Since we are suffering through perhaps the greatest crisis the Church has ever seen, surely this encyclical will address all of the root causes of this crisis including a false hope in the novel ideology of error having public rights and its disastrous consequences, how the novel idea of collegieality has made the pope nothing more than a figure head who can be ignored, and the false perception propogated by many in the Church that salvation has no real connection to formal membership in the Church of Christ. I can't wait to see how the Pope once and for all attacks and explains these errors that have wracked the Church for the last 50 years and clearly renounce and turn away from them. I also can't wait to see a catalogue of the bad fruits of the New Mass since 1969, desacralizing the Holy Sacrifice, a denunication of the sad state of the Mass, and an elimination of the Novus Ordo. Also I can't wait to see Pope Francis condemn in the strongest terms and excommunicate those bishops and priests within the Church who support abortion, ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ "marriage", women's ordination, and contraception. I also am excited to see his explicit condemnation of national governments who support these practices and set out to destroy the family and demand that they recognize the Social Kingship of Christ or perish.

    Certainly the pope will address all of the pressing and urgent concerns to turn things around as the Church is on fire and falling apart and the world is descending into Hell.

    SURELY he won't just write another long encyclical like his predecessors on some generic spiritual topic as if everything were normal. As if the state of the Church were basically good and the faithful just need a little pep talk about Faith (in the generic sense) to pray a little more and feel better about themselves. Ha! That would be absurd!!

    Ok, let me start reading. So excited!!

     :popcorn:


    Offline StCeciliasGirl

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #17 on: July 05, 2013, 10:32:33 AM »
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  • I'm scanning it quickly now for "issues" (ie, if allah=God, or beatifications for sale to provide for the poor), but from the small bit I've scanned, it's not bad yet. Some parts are even impressive-sounding. But I find myself wondering who wrote what.
    Legem credendi, lex statuit supplicandi

    +JMJ

    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #18 on: July 05, 2013, 11:40:35 AM »
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  • What is NOT said is more telling than what is said...

    Offline Charlemagne

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #19 on: July 05, 2013, 11:44:36 AM »
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  • It's the usual fluff: "Gimme a 'V,' gimme an 'A,' gimme a 'T'..." :rahrah:
    "This principle is most certain: The non-Christian cannot in any way be Pope. The reason for this is that he cannot be head of what he is not a member. Now, he who is not a Christian is not a member of the Church, and a manifest heretic is not a Christian, as is clearly taught by St. Cyprian, St. Athanasius, St. Augustine, St. Jerome, and others. Therefore, the manifest heretic cannot be Pope." -- St. Robert Bellarmine


    Offline StCeciliasGirl

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #20 on: July 05, 2013, 12:53:05 PM »
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  • Man, I need a drink.

    I skipped ahead to the last section (oops), where I'm sure it's Francis writing about faith in our fallen society. In God Prepares a City for Them, he's already gone over the faith in the family part, and then he puts these faithful families in "society":

    Quote

    54. Absorbed and deepened in the family, faith becomes a light capable of illumining all our relationships in society. As an experience of the mercy of God the Father, it sets us on the path of brotherhood.


    Welp, seems like "Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword" is out the window.

    I need to learn to embed a video here, but here are some peaceful [probably Prot] Christians at a gαy pride parade in Seattle a few days ago. You'll note their offense is wearing a shirt that says "Jesus" and not calling anyone out of their sin, just trying to turn "their brothers" (and some ..."women") to God:

    [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/embed/utyiN7g0TkE[/youtube]



    With that show of human brotherhood in mind, continuing in the same paragraph:

    Quote
    Modernity sought to build a universal brotherhood based on equality, yet we gradually came to realize that this brotherhood, lacking a reference to a common Father as its ultimate foundation, cannot endure. We need to return to the true basis of brotherhood. The history of faith has been from the beginning a history of brotherhood, albeit not without conflict. God calls Abraham to go forth from his land and promises to make of him a great nation, a great people on whom the divine blessing rests (cf. Gen 12:1-3). As salvation history progresses, it becomes evident that God wants to make everyone share as brothers and sisters in that one blessing, which attains its fullness in Jesus, so that all may be one.


    First, why not call it "the Heresy of Modernism", not "modernity" — I've never heard the word modernity. Maybe I missed that class.

    I'd like to suggest humbly that this great brotherhood at the start of history was Cain slaying Abel. You'd think that if God had called all humanity to brotherhood, He wouldn't have called Cain's offering dog meat; He would have instead handled Cain with kid gloves and said, "Abel gets the Faithful prize, but Cain you get the Most Improved! Everybody wins!"

    Yes, Abram was called out to bring A blessing (SALVATION) to the FEW who'd seek after God, but not to evolve the whole world into brothers. Yes, Abram might have thought God was super-merciful and wouldn't blow Sodom, heh, but when God said He was going to nuke Sodom and Gomorrah, Abram learned about God's Mercy (allowing the Angel of the LORD and another angel to go try to rescue Lot), but he also learned about God's Justice: God blew Sodom sky high, and Lot's wife who yearned for Sodom got turned into a symbolic "your heart is where your treasure is" pillar even though she left, because she loved Sodom! (Not to mention, Lot merely exposing his family to depravity ruined his daughters. That's VERY worrisome to me living in our present-day Sodom.)

    Abram (Abraham, whatever) was holy to ask God to look for a few decent sorts and not blow the sodomite cities, but then Abram had to suck it up when God's Judgement came down. —I wonder if Abram ever learned that the Sodomites he tried to defend ATTEMPTED RAPE on the ANGEL OF THE LORD?  :facepalm:

    So the only "all" outside the Church is ALL getting blown up if they stay in a heathen paradise. When Lot wanted a blessing, he had to leave "his brethren" behind in Sodom and never look back. (And I still can't figure his fate; he got raped like Noah did.)

    I have so many problems with just this little section, but overall, if God had "called all humanity to brotherhood" first and foremost (versus calling all men to HOLINESS), why didn't God just take Cain's unfaithful gift so Cain wouldn't get jealous of Abel? Hello! Cain screwed up; God didn't mince words on that, and it made Cain jealous enough to be the first murderer. THAT'S the fallen world's history of brotherhood.

    And then, I'm not real comfortable with "universal brotherhood", maybe because it sounds like the "Muslim Brotherhood". This part is in the SOCIETY section, as if the whole world is magically in the Church, and that's what God intended? But that's sorta NOT what God intended: separation of wheat and chaff... someone's got to be the chaff.

    Yes, I see "the fullness in Jesus so that all may be one", but God doesn't say anywhere that EVERYONE is going to share in the blessing of Abraham unless they're IN the Church AND repent, give up their perverse natures and become one with +Jesus through the Holy Eucharist. THAT'S "the Faith."

    And on this Abraham stuff... I'd point out that not everyone before Christ went to Hell (though it was still "through Christ"), nor did Jesus descend to Hell to get only Jews (much less "everyone"). The early guys like Enoch (who we know NOTHING about) and Elijah (who found most of Israel completely EVIL and was done with them) were "translated," for one; and then some of God's "friends" who were definitely scooped up from Hell when Christ descended into Hell weren't ALL Jews, or maybe not even "Abrahamic". Um, Ruth, Rahab, JOB, and ..well, I'm sure there are plenty of others floating around that had remembered God. Job surely wasn't a Jew stuck down in Egypt being a slave when he was called "the most holy person on earth" (which, btw, doesn't say much for Jacob's offspring in that 400 yr period). Yeah, it's a mystery I don't get, but the pre-Christ faithful weren't all of Abraham's seed. What about those Persians who came to see the Advent of Christ?

    (Yeah, it's possible they got it from some of Abraham's myriad offspring; I just don't know, except that they weren't all ONLY Jacob's offspring who God loved and considered faithful.)

    If anything stands out in the OT, it's how ungodly the blessed Jews who brought the scriptures were when a prophet like Moses wasn't in their faces 24x7. I get it; that's why my priest is on speed dial. But Abraham brought forth a people (not ALL the people) who would eventually bring forth the holy scriptures and the Holy Mother and Jesus, and that's IT. After that, your nationality isn't going to matter much: you're a Catholic holding to the tradition of the Apostles, or you're not. All this "Abraham" talk bothers me for some reason. I don't think being a Jew, Christian, or Muslim gives you the "faith of Abraham". Obviously not. We need to stop lifting up Abraham and start lifting up +JESUS, the point where Jews and Muslims fall away quickly.

    Yes, all that from ONE paragraph of the encyclical. I'mma need a drink to continue, which means after getting my housework done tonight.

    Very depressing.
    Legem credendi, lex statuit supplicandi

    +JMJ

    Offline Charlemagne

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #21 on: July 05, 2013, 01:00:50 PM »
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  • Cecilia, did you leave Fish Kill?
    "This principle is most certain: The non-Christian cannot in any way be Pope. The reason for this is that he cannot be head of what he is not a member. Now, he who is not a Christian is not a member of the Church, and a manifest heretic is not a Christian, as is clearly taught by St. Cyprian, St. Athanasius, St. Augustine, St. Jerome, and others. Therefore, the manifest heretic cannot be Pope." -- St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #22 on: July 05, 2013, 01:53:05 PM »
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  • Has the novus ordo echo chamber declared this encyclical a masterpiece yet?



    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #23 on: July 05, 2013, 04:45:04 PM »
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  • The word "soul" never appears in this encyclical.  And the word "Catholic" is only mentioned in the context of "Catechism of the Catholic Church" otherwise, we are to surmise that the replacement word "people of God" is a stand-in to remove the word Catholic.

    The passages on Baptism are repulsive.  There is no mention of Original Sin.  None whatsoever.    

    The entire encyclical, and I have read it all today, is jibberish mixed in with the nouvelle theologie.  It bores more than it infuriates but a diligent person could probably pore over it and find a list of 35 or more concepts that are "off".  

    Reading it was a challenge because it was so dull, yet twinkled with passages that could easily be seen as saying something heretical yet phrased in such a muddled manner that Scott Hahn or some stooge on EWTN will proclaim it a wonderful treatise on faith.  

    I found the passages on the Creed really disappointing.  I found a couple of lines outright heretical.

    Line 1:  "We come from others"  (Baltimore Catechism tells us we were made by God to Know Him, Love Him and Serve Him in this world and to be happy forever with Him in the next.  I choose the Baltimore Catechism over this current jibberish - if we strictly come from our parents and their biological function, does that leave God out?  If it doesn't, it certainly is minimalist!)

    Line 2:  Faith outside fo a community is impossible."  Nothing is impossible to God.  Then it went on to speak of "I believe" in the creed only makes sense in the "we believe" concept and uses the word "communitarian" in the paragraph.  

    There were other practices in this encyclical that would lead a reader away from Traditional Catholicism.  The "h" in he was not capitalized, even when referring to Our Lord.  

    The standard alluding to the Second Vatican Council was standard throughout, no other councils in the Church's history was mentioned, unless vaguely in passing, I could double check but others will find it if I missed it.  The Holy Council of Trent certainly wasn't mentioned.  

    A form of deception, or conciliar writing style, was the way the encyclical kicked off.  At the end of paragraph 5, a Christian named Hierax is mentioned and he is referring to the Christ being Our Father and the Faith being Our Mother.  (This person was probably speaking before the dogmas regarding Our Lady were revealed to us as Catholics) Then, paragraph 6 speaks of the Year of Faith and how this validates the Second Vatican Council.  The conciliarist are always bouncing back and forth between barely verifiable antiquity (or edited to serve their purposes) and the Second Vatican Council.  We are to have no memory or any respect for the Holy Church between the Council of Nicea and the beginning of Vatican II.  That's how Marxist regines use history and that's how conciliarists use history.  Is this merely a coincidence?

    The advice to families was merely to encourage expressions of faith and this was only to help the youngsters become mature in the faith.  What do they mean by expression of faith?  I don't want the unwary ready to think the phrase "expression of faith" is just the writers of this encyclicals way of saying "family rosary" or some other venerable Catholic devotion.  

    The entire encyclical was a bore but I made it through all right.  It made me realize the wisdom of my own slogan regarding the novus ordo leadership summed up in four words:  Do Not Follow Them.  


     

    Offline Matto

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #24 on: July 05, 2013, 04:49:29 PM »
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  • I am not going to read it. It would just make me upset. :really-mad2:
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.

    Offline Binechi

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #25 on: July 05, 2013, 08:48:55 PM »
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  • [

    Quote
    The passages on Baptism are repulsive.  There is no mention of Original Sin.  None whatsoever.    



    It must have been disappointing for Baptism of Desire Avocates  to see the absence  of an explaination of salvation by invinciple ignorance or by desire.

     


    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #26 on: July 05, 2013, 10:15:20 PM »
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  • Quote from: Capt McQuigg
    Has the novus ordo echo chamber declared this encyclical a masterpiece yet?



    Capt. You can bet they will be praising it ad nauseam. The pope could publish a recipe for beef stroganoff and they would hail it as the greatest thing since sliced bread.

    Offline Geremia

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #27 on: July 05, 2013, 11:03:18 PM »
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  • some New Theology gobbledygook from the encyclical:
    Quote from: Francis
    The creed does not only involve giving one’s assent to a body of abstract truths; rather, when it is recited the whole of life is drawn into a journey towards full communion with the living God.
    Abstract truths? That sounds like what the Modernist New Theologians argue: theology is abstract and not applicable to "modern man," but personal experience is what really matters!

    condemned by the Holy Office, December 1, 1924:
    Quote
    No abstract proposition can have in itself immutable truth. Even after Faith has been received, man ought not to rest in the dogmas of religion, and hold fast to them fixedly and immovably, but always solicitous to remain moving ahead toward a deeper truth and even evolving into new notions, and even correcting that which he believes.
    Maurice Blondel wrote in Les Annals de Philosophie chrétienne [“The Annals of Christian Philosophy”], June 15, 1906, p. 235: “For the abstract and chimerical adaequatio vei et intellectus one substitutes methodical research, l’adaequatio realis mentis et vitae.” Fr. Garrigou-Lagrange, O.P., says "It is not without great responsibility that one calls 'chimerical' the traditional definition of the truth defined for centuries in the Church, and that one speaks of it by substituting another, in every area that comprises the theological Faith."

    (quotes from Fr. Garrigou-Lagrange, O.P.'s "Where is the New Theology Leading Us?")
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    Offline Geremia

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #28 on: July 05, 2013, 11:07:09 PM »
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  • Quote from: Capt McQuigg
    The word "soul" never appears in this encyclical.
    But the word "supernatural" does, surprisingly, considering it never did in Vatican II docuмents.
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    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Francis First Encyclical To Be Released on Friday: "Lumen Fidei"
    « Reply #29 on: July 05, 2013, 11:34:07 PM »
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  • Let the Neo-Cath praise begin!

    http://www.ncregister.com/daily-news/new-encyclical-truly-a-spiritual-light-vatican-publisher-affirms#When:2013-07-5%2021:05:01

    VATICAN CITY — As its title suggests, Lumen Fidei (The Light of Faith) — the first encyclical by Pope Francis, released July 5 — is truly a “light,” said Father Giuseppe Costa, director of the Vatican Publishing House.

    In a July 5 interview with CNA, he described the new encyclical as “really beautiful and spiritually exciting.”

    “It well portrays the spirit of a spiritual renewal. It really is a light.”
    Father Costa observed that Lumen Fidei, which translates as “The Light of Faith,” contains a style that is “part Benedict’s and part Francis’s, especially the introduction where Pope Francis makes the encyclical his own.”

    However, unlike other commentators, he said that he would not describe the encyclical as being “written by four hands.”

    “Pope Francis presents the encyclical as his,” the priest explained. “This was a gesture of spiritual fraternity between his predecessor, Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI, and Pope Francis himself. This is why I would not say that the encyclical has been written by four hands.”
    In the docuмent’s introduction, Pope Francis notes that Benedict XVI had worked before his resignation to nearly finish a first draft of the encyclical. Pope Francis explains that “as his brother in Christ I have taken up his fine work and added a few contributions of my own.”
    During the docuмent’s release, Archbishop Gerhard Mueller, prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, pointed out that the docuмent bears only the signature of Pope Francis and not of the former Pope because “the Church has just one Pope.”
    Discussing his work at the publishing house, Father Costa told CNA that “serving Pope Francis is no different from serving Benedict XVI. We are simply at the service of the Pope.”
    The only difference lies in the approach, he explained, saying that “Benedict XVI’s audience was of a high cultural level and connected with a cultural stimulus that could be gained from Ratzinger’s writings.”

    He said that Pope Francis also offers writings that are “full of stimuli” but described him as having “a straight-forward approach based on the observation of reality.”
    Father Costa maintains that “behind Pope Francis’ simplicity there is a great understanding of the human being and a considerable ability to think critically.”
    The Vatican Publishing House owns all of the Pope’s copyrights since the moment of his election, and has already published several collections of Cardinal Jorge Mario Bergoglio’s writings and homilies, as well as the first speeches and homilies that he delivered as Pope.
    Father Costa said that “books of and on Pope Francis are having an amazing reception. I can say that a message of hope is spreading.”
    The Vatican Publishing House will distribute 400,000 copies of the Italian version of the encyclical. It has also authorized four Catholic publishing houses in Italy to produce a customized edition of the encyclical.

    The distribution of the encyclical in foreign countries is being taken care of by nuncios and bishops’ conferences throughout the world, Father Costa said.