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Author Topic: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop  (Read 2227 times)

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Offline ElwinRansom1970

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Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
« Reply #15 on: March 25, 2024, 05:24:23 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on March 25, 2024, 12:59:19 PM
    Does the code only apply if the act becomes "notorious"?  Otherwise, they'd be "excommunicated" regardless.  Perhaps the "consecrating prelate" just doesn't want the public imposition of any penalties.
    Bingo! The penalty is ipso facto, but would be occult unless the action were publicly known. Those involved would then become notorious.

    But all this is moot for those of us who do hold that the emergency state in the Church is cause for transgressing the law (including the similar penalty in the 17 Code as amended in the 1950s) and, further, that the Conciliar hierarchy is no hierarchy at all other than in a material sense (or simply not at all).
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    Offline Motorede

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #16 on: March 25, 2024, 09:44:27 PM »
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    • Hmmm. Maybe Fr Pfieffer has recently been to Colorado?:jester:
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    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #17 on: March 27, 2024, 06:27:23 AM »
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    • Quote from: gladius_veritatis on March 25, 2024, 01:28:19 PM
    Perhaps he doesn't exist?  Perhaps s/he's an hermaphrodite, or Bergoglio himself?

    In a decades-long era of uncertainty, anonymity in such matters is unacceptable.  Even if I were 100% certain of his priesthood, I would completely avoid him and treat him as yet another, gutless NON-bishop until he proves otherwise.
    Exactly.  
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    Offline Ekim

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #18 on: April 03, 2024, 06:17:17 AM »
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    • Quote from: Stubborn on March 25, 2024, 01:46:16 PM
    “….Fr. Ward who *apparently* had himself consecrated by a NO bishop - but a NO bishop's not good enough to ordain trad priests? Makes my head spin if I think about it more than a few seconds.”
    Why is everyone assuming it’s a NO bishop??  Could have been + Williamson for all we know.  He’s been known to secretly consecrate bishops…and has known Fr.Ward longer than anyone…+Williamson has also been understanding of the Sedevecantist position…
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    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #19 on: April 03, 2024, 06:30:47 AM »
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    • Quote from: Ekim on April 03, 2024, 06:17:17 AM
    Why is everyone assuming it’s a NO bishop??  Could have been + Williamson for all we know.  He’s been known to secretly consecrate bishops…and has known Fr.Ward longer than anyone…+Williamson has also been understanding of the Sedevecantist position…

    ... because he clearly stated that the Bishop is in the Annuario Pontificio.
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    Offline OABrownson1876

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #20 on: April 03, 2024, 08:49:35 AM »
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    • According to https://www.catholic-hierarchy.org/bishop/sordb2.html there are 22 bishops still living who were consecrated in 1969, five consecrated in 1970, twelve consecrated in 1971, etc.  I guess it is possible that Fr. Ward went to one of these bishops to get consecrated, but the question is, why the silence?  I mean, for the sake of the argument let us say that Bp. Jayme Chemello (91 yr. old) in Brazil consecrated him; would this bishop really be opposed to Bp. Ward revealing this?  I assume that all retired bishops are in the Annuario Pontifico.  I do see that one of these bishops, provided they were consecrated using the old form, might think to themselves, "Fr Ward, I am consecrating you, but don't let this get out because I do not want to deal with Francis." 
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    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #21 on: April 03, 2024, 09:41:24 AM »
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    • Quote from: OABrownson1876 on April 03, 2024, 08:49:35 AM
    According to https://www.catholic-hierarchy.org/bishop/sordb2.html there are 22 bishops still living who were consecrated in 1969, five consecrated in 1970, twelve consecrated in 1971, etc.  I guess it is possible that Fr. Ward went to one of these bishops to get consecrated, but the question is, why the silence?

    I would doubt it.  I think the New Rite of Episcopal Consecration went into effect in early 1969, and all the bishops I saw who were consecrated before that time are approaching 100 ... with the notable exception of Cardinal Arinze, who's only 91.
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    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #22 on: April 03, 2024, 01:30:05 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ekim on April 03, 2024, 06:17:17 AM
    Why is everyone assuming it’s a NO bishop??  Could have been + Williamson for all we know.  He’s been known to secretly consecrate bishops…and has known Fr.Ward longer than anyone…+Williamson has also been understanding of the Sedevecantist position…
    Our Bishops from their website. All I see are NO Bishops they've used exclusively since 1977. I had no idea and it is a bit of a shock to me after having known him as a young priest fresh out of Econe. I woulda never guessed it.

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    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #23 on: April 03, 2024, 02:11:35 PM »
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    • Quote from: Stubborn on April 03, 2024, 01:30:05 PM
    Our Bishops from their website. All I see are NO Bishops they've used exclusively since 1977. I had no idea and it is a bit of a shock to me after having known him as a young priest fresh out of Econe. I woulda never guessed it.


    Interesting that one cannot copy text from that page (at least I couldn't).  It states that all bishops used the Old Rites, but if these bishops are not Old Rite themselves...?
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    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #24 on: April 04, 2024, 05:04:09 AM »
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    • Quote from: 2Vermont on April 03, 2024, 02:11:35 PM
    Interesting that one cannot copy text from that page (at least I couldn't).  It states that all bishops used the Old Rites, but if these bishops are not Old Rite themselves...?
    I was not able to copy it either so I just posted the link. I did print a pdf of the page that you can copy and paste from - attached. I did a google on some of the names mentioned and they're old enough to have been ordained the old way pre-V2, not sure about their consecrations as bishops tho, so I don't know.  I like to think that +Ward was definitely sure that they were indeed validly consecrated.

    Which makes me wonder and I wish I knew why, at his late age, did Fr. Ward have himself consecrated a bishop when he can simply have his few(?) seminarians ordained by the same Annuario Pontificio bishops?   

    What a mess.

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    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Fr. Ward consecrated Bishop
    « Reply #25 on: April 04, 2024, 06:27:39 AM »
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    • Quote from: Stubborn on April 04, 2024, 05:04:09 AM
    I was not able to copy it either so I just posted the link. I did print a pdf of the page that you can copy and paste from - attached. I did a google on some of the names mentioned and they're old enough to have been ordained the old way pre-V2, not sure about their consecrations as bishops tho, so I don't know.  I like to think that +Ward was definitely sure that they were indeed validly consecrated.

    Which makes me wonder and I wish I knew why, at his late age, did Fr. Ward have himself consecrated a bishop when he can simply have his few(?) seminarians ordained by the same Annuario Pontificio bishops?   

    What a mess.
    Maybe it's logistically easier for him to do the ordaining.  But, I agree.  What a mess.  
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