…except the difference between a baby and the afterbirth. 

Thanks. I don’t get it.  Now I can’t get rid of the mental image.  

What do you mean by “persecuted?”  I think of persecution like physically attacked, fired from job, house burned down, vehicle destroyed or sabotaged, threatened with deadly weapon, unrelenting harassment such as a gang of rowdy demonstrators in your yard for days and nights, slander as to have serious results, children threatened, unjustly punished, ostracized or bullied at school, if you’re male, the same done to your wife, your elderly parents mistreated—-guilt by association, CPS or police called and children taken away, unfounded arrest and imprisoned or order of protection granted, unfounded lawsuit, forced into bankruptcy…all the way to being tortured, imprisoned for long term, and cruelly murdered. 

I would not include heckling, name-calling, socially excluded (unless it resulted in something serious like getting fired), unfriending on Facebook, obscene gestures, verbal insults to be persecution.  These are just the actions of immature or just mean people. 

By my idea of persecution, no, I’ve never been persecuted by the novus ordo, or by anyone who goes to the novus ordo.  I can’t think of myself in a situation that would cause it.  I’m not a priest or religious whose bishop could cancel me, laicize me, close my convent rendering me homeless, etc.  The objectionable members of the novus ordo hierarchy don’t know I exist, and if they did, would consider me of no significance, certainly not worth persecuting to force their agenda.  I’ve been to a chapel that has one house in between it and a novus ordo church. To my knowledge, nothing happened. They stay on their side; we stay on ours.  I think the priest from the novus ordo attended Mass once, but Fr. B. did not accept the invitation to attend the n.o.  I’ve also been to a parish where the FSSP shared a church building with the novus ordo.  It was a very active parish with six Sunday Masses, so people attending FSSP would mingle with people exiting the novus ordo on the way in, and again, with people attending the Spanish Mass on the way out.  A good friend (RIP), used to go to the FSSP.  They had daily Latin Mass at 6:00 AM, and daily n.o. at 7:00 AM, again, no problem.  There was no problem until Traditionis Custodes when the bishop ordered the FSSP to get out, cancelling all Latin Masses as of immediately and giving them only two weeks to the priests to move out of their rented house and remove all their belongings. People who were known to attend FSSP exclusively were supposed to sign some sort of statement agreeing to the novus ordo’s legitimacy, to enrolling their children in n.o. catechism—The FSSP had some classes dedicated to preparing for the Sacraments in the old rite.—-And suddenly, there was a problem.  Those who wouldn’t comply were dismissed from various ministries like Ladies Rosary and Altar Society, Christ the King League, Knights of Columbus, a soup kitchen and food bank, the choir, altar boys, etc.  There was fighting among the people, loss of friendships, splits in families, several really large families thrown out, harassment of women and girls who came to the novus ordo wearing veils, people who knelt to receive Communion on the tongue.  The priests obliged at first, but someone told the bishop who ordered a stop to a reverent Communion.  He wanted to ban veils, but was threatened with legal action.  So much for Francis re-establishing unity!  The FSSP moved one town over and opened a chapel in a closed Protestant church that they’re renting, but slated to purchase.  I’ve not been there since 2019, having lost my job and retirement in the scamdemic and moving 620 miles away. I don’t know what the situation is like at present.

I have been what I’d call “harassed” a few times at public events, like demonstrating outside a scandalous off-Broadway play, an abortion clinic, and a Rosary Rally in a park.  The people doing the harassment were probably NOT novus ordo, just the usual liberal characters.  We got called names, had people repeatedly drive past screaming and making obscene gestures.  People in a car threw McDonald’s food at us.  I was hit by a cup of Hi-C or whatever is their orange beverage.  An elderly woman in a wheelchair had a lesbian spit in her face.  I think that counts as persecution because the lesbian chose a person who was vulnerable and unable to defend herself.  Not surprising.  These kind of liberals are pathetic cowards who prey on the weak.  Why didn’t she spit in the face of a “grown-ass man?” There were quite a few present. 

Losing my job, retirement, housing, and most of my possessions because I refused the v-word was persecution, but it wasn’t by the novus ordo!  It was the US government, state government, and city government. Being deprived of Mass for 2 1/2 years was persecution of the US government and that of another country. 

Technically it is persecution though no where near the level one typically expects from the use of the word. Still we all have our own 'persecutions'. The (((vaccine))) was certainly a big one (though for me it was more of a group persecution than a personal one).

Old thread:



And now Songbird complains that she has been persecuted.

Lol, dang it Mark now I have the phrase "Placenta...NOT baby" stuck in my head again.

Take consolation in this, Grumpy

Blessed are they that suffer persecution for justice' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven  [Matthew 5:10]

Jesus has promised persecution
Who shall not receive an hundred times as much, now in this time; houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions: and in the world to come life everlasting  [Mark 10:30]

If you desire eternal life be grateful for and don’t worry about persecution. It’s the doorway to Heaven.

I try to console myself with these scriptures... Sometimes things are so bad, they barely work... 

I don't understand why God allows SO much evil.. not just persecutions but just whatever... the imploded sub (even though that was human error, likely pride, etc.. but still, that one guy was just a kid..)
and then there is Kermit Gosnell and other such monsters... 
sigh

What do you mean by “persecuted?”  I think of persecution like physically attacked, fired from job, house burned down, vehicle destroyed or sabotaged, threatened with deadly weapon, unrelenting harassment such as a gang of rowdy demonstrators in your yard for days and nights, slander as to have serious results, children threatened, unjustly punished, ostracized or bullied at school, if you’re male, the same done to your wife, your elderly parents mistreated—-guilt by association, CPS or police called and children taken away, unfounded arrest and imprisoned or order of protection granted, unfounded lawsuit, forced into bankruptcy…all the way to being tortured, imprisoned for long term, and cruelly murdered. 

I would not include heckling, name-calling

I don't think what happened to me is on your list but that doesn't mean it's not egregious. It is. I just don't want to talk about it. Some would likely scoff, for one thing.. wouldn't believe me. But it has to do with a priest being.. not too priestly, shall we say. 

Some day I will talk about it. Today .. not.. long story

I try to console myself with these scriptures... Sometimes things are so bad, they barely work...

I don't understand why God allows SO much evil.. not just persecutions but just whatever... the imploded sub (even though that was human error, likely pride, etc.. but still, that one guy was just a kid..)
and then there is Kermit Gosnell and other such monsters...
sigh

God allows evil for several reasons.

1. Freewill
2. To refine His Saints
3. For punishment

"that one guy was just a kid"

Look at it another way. If that kid died later rather than now, he might have committed much more sins and have a worse punishment in hell. God often takes sinner early as a form of mercy. Many times God allows sinners to stay alive as a form of punishment and also mercy. I.e Giving them time to repent or allowing them to add sin to sin as a punishment for their sins.

Evil abounds because most people do not repent and follow God.

God allows evil for several reasons.

1. Freewill
2. To refine His Saints
3. For punishment

"that one guy was just a kid"

Look at it another way. If that kid died later rather than now, he might have committed much more sins and have a worse punishment in hell. God often takes sinner early as a form of mercy. Many times God allows sinners to stay alive as a form of punishment and also mercy. I.e Giving them time to repent or allowing them to add sin to sin as a punishment for their sins.

Evil abounds because most people do not repent and follow God.

I understand all that. I wasn't trying to get into a big discussion on the youngster who died in the implosion of the sub. But I appreciate you making this point because a lot of people.. I've met people on forums who bewail everything "bad" that God allows. A lot of times they are in grief because someone they loved died "too early."  I tell them things such as what you mention here. But again, a lot of secular forums are hostile to Catholics.. Understatement.

The loss of the lives in the sub also sent a message, received or not, to the survivors, the loved ones. I mean, death always makes people think of the next life.

As it says somewhere in Scripture: Think of death and you will not sin.

Looks like people aren't thinking about it much these days.. otherwise, why all this hideous sin (grooming.. sɛҳuąƖizing children.. pushing for abortion to the 9th month... transgendering, the lawlessness at the border [broken federal laws]... etc)