Author Topic: Fixing the conciliar church?  (Read 2106 times)

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Offline soulguard

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Fixing the conciliar church?
« on: October 30, 2013, 12:04:09 PM »
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  • I know there was a similar thread posted long ago about this, but this was a notion of "dominvs saboath" who said he wanted to be a priest and had ridiculous notions IMO about tradition.

    But what do people think about this notion.
    Is it possible to change the church from the inside?
     :popcorn:

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #1 on: October 30, 2013, 12:36:28 PM »
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  • Quote from: soulguard
    I know there was a similar thread posted long ago about this, but this was a notion of "dominvs saboath" who said he wanted to be a priest and had ridiculous notions IMO about tradition.

    But what do people think about this notion.
    Is it possible to change the church from the inside?
     :popcorn:


    We would have to take over the formerly Catholic structures.  And re-consecrate everything.  Just to start.  If they authentically convert they can join us as laypeople but they probably should take a vow of silence and do penance for the rest of their lives refraining from all speaking and writing apart from that which is necessary, say in Confession for instance.  
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


    Offline soulguard

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #2 on: October 30, 2013, 01:17:15 PM »
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  • Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: soulguard
    I know there was a similar thread posted long ago about this, but this was a notion of "dominvs saboath" who said he wanted to be a priest and had ridiculous notions IMO about tradition.

    But what do people think about this notion.
    Is it possible to change the church from the inside?
     :popcorn:


    We would have to take over the formerly Catholic structures.  And re-consecrate everything.  Just to start.  If they authentically convert they can join us as laypeople but they probably should take a vow of silence and do penance for the rest of their lives refraining from all speaking and writing apart from that which is necessary, say in Confession for instance.  


    I was wondering whether someone who was a priest or brother could hope to change the conciliar church back towards tradition, or at least slow the decay towards open Protestantism.

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #3 on: October 30, 2013, 01:32:29 PM »
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  • Quote from: soulguard
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: soulguard
    I know there was a similar thread posted long ago about this, but this was a notion of "dominvs saboath" who said he wanted to be a priest and had ridiculous notions IMO about tradition.

    But what do people think about this notion.
    Is it possible to change the church from the inside?
     :popcorn:


    We would have to take over the formerly Catholic structures.  And re-consecrate everything.  Just to start.  If they authentically convert they can join us as laypeople but they probably should take a vow of silence and do penance for the rest of their lives refraining from all speaking and writing apart from that which is necessary, say in Confession for instance.  


    I was wondering whether someone who was a priest or brother could hope to change the conciliar church back towards tradition, or at least slow the decay towards open Protestantism.


    No.  It needs a miracle or to be taken over by true Catholics. Eventually they will get so bad that more people will realize it perhaps.  We can convert some and bring them to us.  But even if Bergi became Catholic he would then be a lay member within the Church.  It would not automatically Pope him :o)  

    The inmates are running the asylum.  They have taken over and cast us underground.  Pius the fifth and Christendom with Catholic laws could do it.  A real Pope like Pius V out of exile who would have them all hung or doing penance in a monastery would purge the number of heretics who call themselves Catholic by insisting on the compromised truth.  He would take a "take it or leave it" stance and a "don't let the door hit you on the way out" stand.  Later much dudes.  Bye bye now.  The good guys have taken over.  

    We have to separate our minds form the idea that the formerly Catholic structures are over us in any way shape or form.  There may be good willed Catholics within that structure but the hierarchy is 'nil.  Not valid and they adhere to a false sect which will be condemned by the next valid Pope unless God does it first.
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline LoverOfTradition

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #4 on: October 30, 2013, 01:46:00 PM »
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  • The Counciliar Church has to return to tradition.

    As Archbishop Lefebvre said, Rome must to return to tradition.


    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #5 on: October 30, 2013, 02:06:01 PM »
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  • Quote from: LoverOfTradition
    The Counciliar Church has to return to tradition.

    As Archbishop Lefebvre said, Rome must to return to tradition.


    He also thought that Paul 6, the guy that destroyed everything was Pope.

    The Catholic Church never needs to return to tradition.  She is always there.  Same with Catholic Popes.  The Conciliar Church is a different animal as are their "Pope" or whatever they prefer to be called these days.  

    We will welcome any of her members back with open arms should they sincerely convert.
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Matto

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #6 on: October 30, 2013, 02:07:28 PM »
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  • I don't think the conciliar sect will ever become Catholic again. I think the end of the world is more likely. There are supposedly over a billion Catholics in the world and nearly all of them are either fallen away or Novus Ordo. There are less than a million traditional Catholics. That is less than one tenth of one percent. It would require a miracle greater than any that have ever happened before for the Novus Ordo sect to become Catholic again.
    I Love Watching Butterflies . . ..

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #7 on: October 30, 2013, 02:11:19 PM »
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  • Quote from: Matto
    I don't think the conciliar sect will ever become Catholic again. I think the end of the world is more likely.


    I believe that is an accurate assessment.  Apart from a miracle where everyone sees their souls as they really are or something to that effect.
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


    Offline soulguard

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #8 on: October 30, 2013, 02:26:06 PM »
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  • Surely the conciliar church cant disown its own history?

    Offline songbird

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #9 on: October 30, 2013, 03:14:35 PM »
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  • Read Cpt 12 of Daniel, what Lover of Truth said is correct, God will handle things and do as they have told us to do, Prayer and Penance.

    Offline Mithrandylan

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #10 on: October 30, 2013, 03:44:58 PM »
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  • Those who desire to enter into religious orders in the Novus Ordo Church to change it from the inside suffer from not really grasping the insidious and undermining nature of modernism.  To borrow the common analogy of a soup that has only a few drops of poison, it would be like trying to eat around the poison in that soup.  There are only two possible results: One, after a bite or two you realize the futility of the venture and put down your spoon and don't return.  Two, you keep eating and eating and you are infected with the poison.  

    This idea is just another avenue down the "reform of the reform."  It sees the crisis as cosmetic crisis, something that a little TLC and some shoe polish can take care of.  It fails to realize that modernism is a heresy that affects doctrine, and that once adopted, takes meticulous awareness and discipline to eradicate, because a modernist thinks in an entirely different way than a Catholic does.  

    More Catholic Discussion: http://thetradforum.com


    Offline Emitte Lucem Tuam

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #11 on: October 30, 2013, 06:43:12 PM »
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  • My question to you would be:  Can you fix the Anglican Church from within?  Can you fix the Lutheran Church from within?  Of course not.  And you can't fix the Novus Ordo Church from within either.  Too much time has elapsed since their break with the Holy Roman Catholic Church.  The Novus Ordo Church is just another (albeit big) heretical Christian sect among many others.  You do the math. It's in God's hands now -  not man's.

    Offline IllyricumSacrum

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #12 on: October 30, 2013, 06:59:49 PM »
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  • Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: soulguard
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: soulguard
    I know there was a similar thread posted long ago about this, but this was a notion of "dominvs saboath" who said he wanted to be a priest and had ridiculous notions IMO about tradition.

    But what do people think about this notion.
    Is it possible to change the church from the inside?
     :popcorn:


    We would have to take over the formerly Catholic structures.  And re-consecrate everything.  Just to start.  If they authentically convert they can join us as laypeople but they probably should take a vow of silence and do penance for the rest of their lives refraining from all speaking and writing apart from that which is necessary, say in Confession for instance.  


    I was wondering whether someone who was a priest or brother could hope to change the conciliar church back towards tradition, or at least slow the decay towards open Protestantism.


    No.  It needs a miracle or to be taken over by true Catholics. Eventually they will get so bad that more people will realize it perhaps.  We can convert some and bring them to us.  But even if Bergi became Catholic he would then be a lay member within the Church.  It would not automatically Pope him :o)  

    The inmates are running the asylum.  They have taken over and cast us underground.  Pius the fifth and Christendom with Catholic laws could do it.  A real Pope like Pius V out of exile who would have them all hung or doing penance in a monastery would purge the number of heretics who call themselves Catholic by insisting on the compromised truth.  He would take a "take it or leave it" stance and a "don't let the door hit you on the way out" stand.  Later much dudes.  Bye bye now.  The good guys have taken over.  

    We have to separate our minds form the idea that the formerly Catholic structures are over us in any way shape or form.  There may be good willed Catholics within that structure but the hierarchy is 'nil.  Not valid and they adhere to a false sect which will be condemned by the next valid Pope unless God does it first.


    Such a valid, future restorationist  pontiff will need some foreign powers to back him up and stave off certain other powers. I can see the "Great Democracies" utilizing "the Base" to foment an "uprising" in Italy a la Lybia, Egypt, Syria. Just imagine the MSM trying to swell support for the "Rebels" against those nasty San Marco battalions.

    Personally, I feel that the True Church and Papacy will be restored through the BIOLOGICAL option. The Pepsi/VII generation will die off and be judged. The younger, more orthodox (within the conciliar structures and without)  clergy and religious born after '59 will take over. I understand that some NO presbyters seek out conditional ordination and consecration. You have the independents. And the Eastern churches. After chaos frank's departure the Cardinals might even elect a valid Eastern Patriarch. That'll get the ball rolling.
    Much to ponder and pray over.   :stare:

    Offline Mabel

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #13 on: October 30, 2013, 07:04:12 PM »
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  • The Concilliar sect is in a state of auto demolition. It is unsustainable.  They are going to diminish and become less and less relevant. In their attempt to be relevant in the secular world, they will create upheaval among the people they have ensnared, of good will, who are actually Catholic. Those people will get a clue at some point and hopefully join forces with other Catholics. Through a true pope and whatever Our Lady has in store for us through the Triumph of her Immaculate Heart, I believe we can and will see the restoration of Catholicsm throughout the world once again.

    Every Catholic who believes the Faith will have a part to play. But, I don't think that it can be done by Catholics who know better by working from inside Concilliardom. We can labor and pray with one another, who remain united in Faith during this time, through the rosary, good works, and penance.

    Offline OHCA

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    Fixing the conciliar church?
    « Reply #14 on: October 30, 2013, 07:20:23 PM »
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  • Quote from: soulguard
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: soulguard
    I know there was a similar thread posted long ago about this, but this was a notion of "dominvs saboath" who said he wanted to be a priest and had ridiculous notions IMO about tradition.

    But what do people think about this notion.
    Is it possible to change the church from the inside?
     :popcorn:


    We would have to take over the formerly Catholic structures.  And re-consecrate everything.  Just to start.  If they authentically convert they can join us as laypeople but they probably should take a vow of silence and do penance for the rest of their lives refraining from all speaking and writing apart from that which is necessary, say in Confession for instance.  


    I was wondering whether someone who was a priest or brother could hope to change the conciliar church back towards tradition, or at least slow the decay towards open Protestantism.


    No.  Anybody trying that would be about as effective as a fart in a whirlwind.  Plus an inside NO priest would be required to say at least some (probably many) sacrilegious NO "masses" thereby endangering his own soul.

     

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