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Offline Lover of Truth

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Father Kramer Reject Francis
« on: December 02, 2013, 08:38:04 AM »
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  • Was the below already posted:

    http://www.novusordowatch.org/wire/paul-kramer-rejects-francis.htm

    Thank Almighty God for His goodness!

    On November 28, 2013, the Feast of St. Catherine Laboure, the Rev. Paul Leonard Kramer announced on his Facebook page that he rejects Francis' claim to the papacy due to manifest heresy found in his newly-published "Apostolic Exhortation" Evangelii Gaudium. The Rev. Kramer is not unknown among traditionalists in the Vatican II Church. He is editor of the immensely popular book The Devil's Final Battle and has written for publications such as The Fatima Crusader and appeared at various conferences.

    "Fr." Kramer -- a priest ordained in the doubtful rite of Paul VI -- posted, among other things, the following on Facebook:

    kramer-sede1.jpg


    kramer-sede2.jpg


    In case the above text-image won't display on some devices, we are here reproducing it as text-only version. "Fr." Kramer said:

    "Pope" Francis in Evangelii Gaudium n. 247: "We hold the Jewish people in special regard because their covenant with God has never been revoked". This text is an explicit profession of heresy, directly opposed to the solemn dogmatic definition of Pope Eugenius III and the Ecumenical Council of Florence, and the doctrine taught by the supreme magisterium of Pope Benedict XIV in Ex Quo Primum, set forth repeatedly and explicitly citing the definition of Florence, to wit, that the Mosaic covenant has been "revoked" and "abrogated". I have been saying for years that when a "pope" will officially teach explicit and clear heresy flatly contradicting the infallibly defined dogma of the Catholic faith, then you will know that he is the false pope prophecied in many Church approved prophecies and Marian apparitions. St. Robert Bellarmine, St. Alohonsus Liguori, St. Antoninus and Pope Innocent III all teach that when the pope demonstrates himself to be a manifest heretic, i.e. a plainly manifested public heretic, he ceases to be pope (or, if already was a public heretic he was invalidly elected) because he is not a Catholic -- not a member of the Catholic Church. Bellarmine explains that the Roman Pontiff is the visible head of the Church, and the head is a member. One who is not a member cannot be the head, and therefore the election to the supreme pontificate of a public heretic is canonically null & void. The heresy of Bergoglio in no. 247 is such a clear cut case of manifest, public heresy, expressed in stark, unequivocal terms, that it can be said without doubt that if this proposition of no. 247 is not manifestly heretical, then nothing else can be said to be so. It is morally impossible that one who manifestly displays such clearly expressed contempt for a defined dogma of faith by plainly denying it, can be believed to validly hold the office of Roman Pontiff. St. Francis of Assisi foretold of the uncanonically elected pope who would not be "a true pastor but a destroyer". Bergoglio plainly fits the description.


    paul-kramer.jpg

    While, of course, Kramer (pictured to the left) still believes the Vatican II Church to be the true Church and Francis' five predecessors of unhappy memory to have been true and valid Popes, nevertheless this is a gigantic step in the right direction. We commend the Rev. Kramer for taking this (emotionally difficult) step of finally recognizing the undeniable: Jorge Bergoglio cannot be the Pope of the Catholic Church! Let's finally be done with all the excuse-making and willful blindness; these matters are serious!

    For your reference, here is the entire paragraph 247 (as well as the following two paragraphs) of Francis' 51,000-word mammoth exhortation Evangelii Gaudium:

    247. We hold the Jewish people in special regard because their covenant with God has never been revoked, for “the gifts and the call of God are irrevocable” (Rom 11:29). The Church, which shares with Jews an important part of the sacred Scriptures, looks upon the people of the covenant and their faith as one of the sacred roots of her own Christian identity (cf. Rom 11:16-18). As Christians, we cannot consider Judaism as a foreign religion; nor do we include the Jews among those called to turn from idols and to serve the true God (cf. 1 Thes 1:9). With them, we believe in the one God who acts in history, and with them we accept his revealed word.

    248. Dialogue and friendship with the children of Israel are part of the life of Jesus’ disciples. The friendship which has grown between us makes us bitterly and sincerely regret the terrible persecutions which they have endured, and continue to endure, especially those that have involved Christians.

    249. God continues to work among the people of the Old Covenant and to bring forth treasures of wisdom which flow from their encounter with his word. For this reason, the Church also is enriched when she receives the values of Judaism. While it is true that certain Christian beliefs are unacceptable to Judaism, and that the Church cannot refrain from proclaiming Jesus as Lord and Messiah, there exists as well a rich complementarity which allows us to read the texts of the Hebrew Scriptures together and to help one another to mine the riches of God’s word. We can also share many ethical convictions and a common concern for justice and the development of peoples.


    According to Bergoglio, these three paragraphs describe what supposedly is the Catholic Church's view of her relations with Judaism. This text is filled with heresy and error, failing to distinguish today's religion of "Judaism" with the Judaism of the Old Covenant, which ceased with the establishment of the Catholic Church on Pentecost Sunday. It is in the coming of the Messiah and the founding of the True Church that God has remained faithful to His promises, so Francis' misuse of Sacred Scripture (already perpetrated by John Paul II) to bolster his position is nothing short of sickening.

    Today's Jews are not "the people of the covenant"; their religion, established by Annas and Caiaphas in 33 AD, is a "foreign religion", it is not the faith of the Catholic Church in any way, nor that of Abraham (cf. Jn 8; Gal 3); and, worshipping a god that is not the Most Holy Trinity, they must turn and convert to the worship of the True God. And it speaks volumes that Francis mentions that "certain Christian beliefs are unacceptable to Judaism," yet utterly fails to point out that, likewise, certain Jewish beliefs are unacceptable to Christians! Bergoglio's modus operandi is always the same: Bash Catholics; adulate or exonerate everyone else.

    We have tackled the topic of Francis' judaizing heresy in greater depth in the following important post:

        Are Today's Jews Still God's Chosen People?


    Here is a list of links to documents referenced by "Fr." Kramer in his Facebook post:

        Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence -- see Denzinger no. 712
        Pope Benedict XIV, Encyclical Ex Quo (March 1, 1756)
        St. Robert Bellarmine, On The Roman Pontiff, Book 2, Ch. 30
        St. Francis of Assisi's Prophecy of a Destroyer Antipope


    A few months ago we had predicted that there would at some point be those who will agree that Francis is an Antipope but yet believe the last true Pope wasn't Pius XII but Benedict XVI (Ratzinger). It looks like "Fr." Kramer is the first one to take this position, at least for now. This is very damaging to the truth inasmuch as it still concedes to the false Vatican II Religion its claim to being the true Catholic Church. Still, we are gladdened that Rev. Kramer has come to accept the obvious facts about Francis and hope and pray that the rest will eventually fall into place.
    gruner.jpg

    With this bombshell development, the Rev. Nicholas Gruner (left) -- with whom the Rev. Kramer has been associated -- and his collaborators at the Fatima Center can now be expected to jump into high gear to attack sedevacantism and sedevacantists. The reason is simple: Gruner's apostolate can only successfully operate on the premise that Francis is in fact the Pope, as the main goal of their enterprise is the Pope's consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. If Francis is not the Pope of the Catholic Church, the Fatima Center can pretty much close its doors. This is why in the past we have jokingly referred to the collection of anti-sedevacantist writings by the usual suspects as "Father Gruner Needs a Pope".

    We will brace ourselves, therefore, for a new onslaught of anti-sedevacantist articles (which, we wish to point out, are a lot easier to produce when you're getting paid to write this stuff because then you have a lot more time at your disposal).

    We pray that John Vennari will be the next one to "finally get it" and stop his persistent refusal to face the facts.

    See Also:

        Is Francis Catholic? The Facts about Jorge Bergoglio
        Sedevacantism: A Quick Primer
        Video: Why Sedevacantism? & Answers to Objections
        Fr. Michael Oswalt: The Novus Ordo Priest who became Sedevacantist
        Rejecting the Impostor Church: Fr. Oswalt's Letter to his Diocese
        Fr. Herman Kramer warns in 1956: "If Satan would contrive to hinder a papal election, the Church would suffer great travail"
        Mgr. Fulton Sheen warns in 1948: Satan "will set up a counter-church which will be the ape of the [Catholic] Church"
        Fr. Sylvester Berry warns in 1927: "Satan will set up a False Church"
        Fr. Berry in 1921: "Satan will Persecute the Papacy"
        Eclipse of the Church: What happened after the death of Pope Pius XII?
        Speculation, but very interesting: White Smoke 1958
        The "Canonization" of John Paul II: Decision Time for "Resistance" Traditionalists
        "Pope" Francis and Fatima
        "Pope" Benedict XVI - No Friend of Fatima
        Bp. Bernard Fellay, SSPX: Francis is a "Genuine Modernist"
        Stumbling at the Finish Line: The SSPX's Illogical Stance on the Pope Question
        Concerning an SSPX Dossier on Sedevacantism
        The Absurdity of the "Recognize-and-Resist" Position Demonstrated
        The "Rad Trads" Respond to Catholic Answers
        Traditionalists, Infallibility, and the Pope [PDF]
        Opinionism - Is the Pope Question just a Matter of "Opinion"?
        A Refutation of Various Common Objections to Sedevacantism
        Resistance and Indefectibility: Where is the Church?
        The Apostasy of John Paul II: A Catholic Response
        The Impossible Crisis
        The Loss of Ecclesiastical Offices: Is Holy Church Unprotected?
        Sede Vacante 1958-2008: Reflections on a 50-Year Vacancy of the Apostolic See
        The Chair Is Still Empty: A Response to John Salza on Sedevacantism
        50 Years of Vatican II: A Review of the Modernist Errors of the Second Vatican Council (audio)
        Traditional Catholics and Devotion to the Pope: Can we "Recognize and Resist"? (audio)
        "The Errors of the Society of Saint Pius X" (audio)
        "The Ordinary Magisterium and Devotion to the Pope" (audio)
        When Death comes for you, how you will you choose?
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #1 on: December 03, 2013, 11:25:11 AM »
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  • Buump.

    The pronunciation is BOOMP.
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


    Online 2Vermont

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #2 on: December 03, 2013, 02:54:51 PM »
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  • Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?
    "For there is not any thing secret that shall not be made manifest, nor hidden, that shall not be known and come abroad."- Luke 8:17

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #3 on: December 04, 2013, 09:16:26 AM »
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  • Quote from: 2Vermont
    Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?


    I'm really not sure.  I know something was posting something regarding this topic and the Dimond brothers but I do not know who posted first regarding Novus Ordo Watch which I believe has to be one of the better sites out there.  What I particularly like about that site is that the writers are thorough and present undeniable facts while backing it up with authoritative and infallible documents that back up their claims.  They have an amazing gift of pointing out the inconsistency and ironies of the "R & R" position and the direct contradiction with doctrine by the false V2 "Popes".
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Centroamerica

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #4 on: December 04, 2013, 09:27:15 AM »
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  • Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: 2Vermont
    Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?


    I'm really not sure.  I know something was posting something regarding this topic and the Dimond brothers but I do not know who posted first regarding Novus Ordo Watch which I believe has to be one of the better sites out there.  What I particularly like about that site is that the writers are thorough and present undeniable facts while backing it up with authoritative and infallible documents that back up their claims.  They have an amazing gift of pointing out the inconsistency and ironies of the "R & R" position and the direct contradiction with doctrine by the false V2 "Popes".


    What a bunch of hooplah and confusion. People really take the Dimond brothers seriously here. Really!!! And no one seems to know the actual position taken by Fr. Kramer. Just a bunch of people stating things without even caring to see what Fr. Kramer himself says.  :smash-pc:
    We conclude logically that religion can give an efficacious and truly realistic answer to the great modern problems only if it is a religion that is profoundly lived, not simply a superficial and cheap religion made up of some vocal prayers and some ceremonies...


    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #5 on: December 04, 2013, 09:40:53 AM »
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  • Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: 2Vermont
    Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?


    I'm really not sure.  I know something was posting something regarding this topic and the Dimond brothers but I do not know who posted first regarding Novus Ordo Watch which I believe has to be one of the better sites out there.  What I particularly like about that site is that the writers are thorough and present undeniable facts while backing it up with authoritative and infallible documents that back up their claims.  They have an amazing gift of pointing out the inconsistency and ironies of the "R & R" position and the direct contradiction with doctrine by the false V2 "Popes".


    What a bunch of hooplah and confusion. People really take the Dimond brothers seriously here. Really!!! And no one seems to know the actual position taken by Fr. Kramer. Just a bunch of people stating things without even caring to see what Fr. Kramer himself says.  :smash-pc:


    What are you talking about?  My information is from Novus Ordo Watch not the Dimonds.  Do people actually read the posts or jump in after guessing what was posted?  :facepalm:

    Father Kramer rejects the papacy of Frances but still accepts the other conciliar "Popes" as being valid.  This has been mad clear.  
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Centroamerica

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #6 on: December 04, 2013, 09:59:16 AM »
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  • Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: 2Vermont
    Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?


    I'm really not sure.  I know something was posting something regarding this topic and the Dimond brothers but I do not know who posted first regarding Novus Ordo Watch which I believe has to be one of the better sites out there.  What I particularly like about that site is that the writers are thorough and present undeniable facts while backing it up with authoritative and infallible documents that back up their claims.  They have an amazing gift of pointing out the inconsistency and ironies of the "R & R" position and the direct contradiction with doctrine by the false V2 "Popes".


    What a bunch of hooplah and confusion. People really take the Dimond brothers seriously here. Really!!! And no one seems to know the actual position taken by Fr. Kramer. Just a bunch of people stating things without even caring to see what Fr. Kramer himself says.  :smash-pc:


    What are you talking about?  My information is from Novus Ordo Watch not the Dimonds.  Do people actually read the posts or jump in after guessing what was posted?  :facepalm:

    Father Kramer rejects the papacy of Frances but still accepts the other conciliar "Popes" as being valid.  This has been mad clear.  


    Clearly if you are quoting someone else why would I be referring to you. Yes I read the posts. Fr. Kramer says the resignation of Benedict was not valid. His official position is una cum papa nostro Benedicto. Just so you know.
    We conclude logically that religion can give an efficacious and truly realistic answer to the great modern problems only if it is a religion that is profoundly lived, not simply a superficial and cheap religion made up of some vocal prayers and some ceremonies...

    Offline parentsfortruth

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #7 on: December 04, 2013, 10:37:54 AM »
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  • You know what's really curious? I was reading about the last papal abdication, and from what I've read, Pope Gregory XII was given another position as a bishop, among other responsibilities, and the SEAT REMAINED VACANT until he DIED. His abdication came so that the Western Schism would be resolved. So there was a significant time of Sede Vacante. He died on the 18 of October, 1417. His papacy ended on July 4, 1415. And the new pope didn't get elected until AFTER his death, on 14 November, 1417. That is MORE THAN TWO YEARS of Sede Vacante. There were NEVER two popes living at the same time. Not even in that case.

    Very, very curious.
    Matthew 5:37

    But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over and above these, is of evil.

    My Avatar is Fr. Hector Bolduc. He was a faithful parish priest in De Pere, WI,


    Offline ggreg

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #8 on: December 04, 2013, 10:50:56 AM »
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  • "The entire college of cardinals gathered in Avignon, declared that they'd been forced to elect Urban, and—only six months into Urban's reign—they elected Clement VII in his place. The Italian cardinals chose not to take part in the election, but they were there and did not complain."

    Wasn't that another occasion with two Popes?

    Offline parentsfortruth

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #9 on: December 04, 2013, 11:23:01 AM »
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  • The predecessor of Pope Clement VII was not Urban. It was Pope Adrian IV. Here is a list of all the Pope Urbans. I don't know which one you're talking about.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Urban_%28disambiguation%29
    Matthew 5:37

    But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over and above these, is of evil.

    My Avatar is Fr. Hector Bolduc. He was a faithful parish priest in De Pere, WI,

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #10 on: December 04, 2013, 11:38:49 AM »
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  • Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: 2Vermont
    Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?


    I'm really not sure.  I know something was posting something regarding this topic and the Dimond brothers but I do not know who posted first regarding Novus Ordo Watch which I believe has to be one of the better sites out there.  What I particularly like about that site is that the writers are thorough and present undeniable facts while backing it up with authoritative and infallible documents that back up their claims.  They have an amazing gift of pointing out the inconsistency and ironies of the "R & R" position and the direct contradiction with doctrine by the false V2 "Popes".


    What a bunch of hooplah and confusion. People really take the Dimond brothers seriously here. Really!!! And no one seems to know the actual position taken by Fr. Kramer. Just a bunch of people stating things without even caring to see what Fr. Kramer himself says.  :smash-pc:


    What are you talking about?  My information is from Novus Ordo Watch not the Dimonds.  Do people actually read the posts or jump in after guessing what was posted?  :facepalm:

    Father Kramer rejects the papacy of Frances but still accepts the other conciliar "Popes" as being valid.  This has been mad clear.  


    Clearly if you are quoting someone else why would I be referring to you. Yes I read the posts. Fr. Kramer says the resignation of Benedict was not valid. His official position is una cum papa nostro Benedicto. Just so you know.


    It looked like you were quoting me in the above quote.  It starts with "Lover of Truth".
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #11 on: December 04, 2013, 11:41:44 AM »
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  • Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: 2Vermont
    Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?


    I'm really not sure.  I know something was posting something regarding this topic and the Dimond brothers but I do not know who posted first regarding Novus Ordo Watch which I believe has to be one of the better sites out there.  What I particularly like about that site is that the writers are thorough and present undeniable facts while backing it up with authoritative and infallible documents that back up their claims.  They have an amazing gift of pointing out the inconsistency and ironies of the "R & R" position and the direct contradiction with doctrine by the false V2 "Popes".


    What a bunch of hooplah and confusion. People really take the Dimond brothers seriously here. Really!!! And no one seems to know the actual position taken by Fr. Kramer. Just a bunch of people stating things without even caring to see what Fr. Kramer himself says.  :smash-pc:


    What are you talking about?  My information is from Novus Ordo Watch not the Dimonds.  Do people actually read the posts or jump in after guessing what was posted?  :facepalm:

    Father Kramer rejects the papacy of Frances but still accepts the other conciliar "Popes" as being valid.  This has been mad clear.  


    Clearly if you are quoting someone else why would I be referring to you. Yes I read the posts. Fr. Kramer says the resignation of Benedict was not valid. His official position is una cum papa nostro Benedicto. Just so you know.


    I would imagine that if a Pope retires a Pope retires.  That is one of the three ways the chair can become vacant.  The others being death and public apostasy, heresy or schism.  Oh yeah.  Insanity or I guess if he had a sex change I suppose.

    But what reason(s) does he give for Ratzinger's resignation not being a resignation?  

    The real reason is that he was never Pope in the first place and one cannot retire from a position that one does not hold.  
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Centroamerica

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #12 on: December 04, 2013, 12:51:49 PM »
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  • Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: 2Vermont
    Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?


    I'm really not sure.  I know something was posting something regarding this topic and the Dimond brothers but I do not know who posted first regarding Novus Ordo Watch which I believe has to be one of the better sites out there.  What I particularly like about that site is that the writers are thorough and present undeniable facts while backing it up with authoritative and infallible documents that back up their claims.  They have an amazing gift of pointing out the inconsistency and ironies of the "R & R" position and the direct contradiction with doctrine by the false V2 "Popes".


    What a bunch of hooplah and confusion. People really take the Dimond brothers seriously here. Really!!! And no one seems to know the actual position taken by Fr. Kramer. Just a bunch of people stating things without even caring to see what Fr. Kramer himself says.  :smash-pc:


    What are you talking about?  My information is from Novus Ordo Watch not the Dimonds.  Do people actually read the posts or jump in after guessing what was posted?  :facepalm:

    Father Kramer rejects the papacy of Frances but still accepts the other conciliar "Popes" as being valid.  This has been mad clear.  


    Clearly if you are quoting someone else why would I be referring to you. Yes I read the posts. Fr. Kramer says the resignation of Benedict was not valid. His official position is una cum papa nostro Benedicto. Just so you know.


    It looked like you were quoting me in the above quote.  It starts with "Lover of Truth".


    Oh, I'm having problems with quoting people today. I can't seem to quote only a small piece and it come out right. I have to quote 10 thousand quotes to quote one line.  


    We conclude logically that religion can give an efficacious and truly realistic answer to the great modern problems only if it is a religion that is profoundly lived, not simply a superficial and cheap religion made up of some vocal prayers and some ceremonies...

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #13 on: December 04, 2013, 01:56:44 PM »
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  • Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: 2Vermont
    Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?


    I'm really not sure.  I know something was posting something regarding this topic and the Dimond brothers but I do not know who posted first regarding Novus Ordo Watch which I believe has to be one of the better sites out there.  What I particularly like about that site is that the writers are thorough and present undeniable facts while backing it up with authoritative and infallible documents that back up their claims.  They have an amazing gift of pointing out the inconsistency and ironies of the "R & R" position and the direct contradiction with doctrine by the false V2 "Popes".


    What a bunch of hooplah and confusion. People really take the Dimond brothers seriously here. Really!!! And no one seems to know the actual position taken by Fr. Kramer. Just a bunch of people stating things without even caring to see what Fr. Kramer himself says.  :smash-pc:


    What are you talking about?  My information is from Novus Ordo Watch not the Dimonds.  Do people actually read the posts or jump in after guessing what was posted?  :facepalm:

    Father Kramer rejects the papacy of Frances but still accepts the other conciliar "Popes" as being valid.  This has been mad clear.  


    Clearly if you are quoting someone else why would I be referring to you. Yes I read the posts. Fr. Kramer says the resignation of Benedict was not valid. His official position is una cum papa nostro Benedicto. Just so you know.


    It looked like you were quoting me in the above quote.  It starts with "Lover of Truth".


    Oh, I'm having problems with quoting people today. I can't seem to quote only a small piece and it come out right. I have to quote 10 thousand quotes to quote one line.  




    I hear that.  I have had frustrations posting on this site as well.  Sometimes working for extended periods of time only to lose it when I try to post it. :pc:  :cussing:
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Online 2Vermont

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    Father Kramer Reject Francis
    « Reply #14 on: December 04, 2013, 03:04:42 PM »
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  • Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: Centroamerica
    Quote from: Lover of Truth
    Quote from: 2Vermont
    Isn't this basically the same thing that the other thread posted?  Or am I missing something?


    I'm really not sure.  I know something was posting something regarding this topic and the Dimond brothers but I do not know who posted first regarding Novus Ordo Watch which I believe has to be one of the better sites out there.  What I particularly like about that site is that the writers are thorough and present undeniable facts while backing it up with authoritative and infallible documents that back up their claims.  They have an amazing gift of pointing out the inconsistency and ironies of the "R & R" position and the direct contradiction with doctrine by the false V2 "Popes".


    What a bunch of hooplah and confusion. People really take the Dimond brothers seriously here. Really!!! And no one seems to know the actual position taken by Fr. Kramer. Just a bunch of people stating things without even caring to see what Fr. Kramer himself says.  :smash-pc:


    What are you talking about?  My information is from Novus Ordo Watch not the Dimonds.  Do people actually read the posts or jump in after guessing what was posted?  :facepalm:

    Father Kramer rejects the papacy of Frances but still accepts the other conciliar "Popes" as being valid.  This has been mad clear.  


    Clearly if you are quoting someone else why would I be referring to you. Yes I read the posts. Fr. Kramer says the resignation of Benedict was not valid. His official position is una cum papa nostro Benedicto. Just so you know.


    It looked like you were quoting me in the above quote.  It starts with "Lover of Truth".


    Oh, I'm having problems with quoting people today. I can't seem to quote only a small piece and it come out right. I have to quote 10 thousand quotes to quote one line.  




    WTH are you talking about?  I'm sorry, there were only two posters in this thread when you first posted (myself and LOT).  Exactly what did you mean to quote if you "misquoted"?  
    "For there is not any thing secret that shall not be made manifest, nor hidden, that shall not be known and come abroad."- Luke 8:17

     

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