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Author Topic: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?  (Read 243 times)

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Offline Pax Vobis

  • Supporter
Re: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?
« Reply #5 on: Today at 08:23:40 AM »
Quote from: TomGubbinsKimmage on Today at 08:20:07 AM
In a matter so grave as Sacramental validity, we must abstain where the suspicion is credible.
A suspicion is only credible when it's based on facts.  A suspicion without facts is just a fantasy.

Why is the suspicion credible/believable?  Based on what?

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Trying to say that it is about "evidence" is a deliberate (and quite frankly retarded) distraction.
Canon Law says that doubts must be based on evidence.  If there's no evidence, then you're acting like a child who lives through imagination. 
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Offline TomGubbinsKimmage

Re: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?
« Reply #6 on: Today at 08:28:25 AM »
Quote from: Pax Vobis on Today at 08:23:40 AM
A suspicion is only credible when it's based on facts.  A suspicion without facts is just a fantasy.
Canon Law says that doubts must be based on evidence.  If there's no evidence, then you're acting like a child who lives through imagination.
The fact of whether he withheld intention the whole way along his career can only be verified by the man himself.
I have repeated this multiple times now. You are clearly showing how stubborn you are, and quite frankly just autistic at this point. Not even an attempt to be objective.

We would have evidence if he was alive to tell us that he withheld intention. We cant get that now. So the whole thing is inconclusive. 

Dont be a moron. If you have inconclusivity in such a serious matter you are morally obliged to abstain.

Stop leading folks to hell by encouraging them to go to CMRI.
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Offline Pax Vobis

  • Supporter
Re: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?
« Reply #7 on: Today at 08:40:28 AM »
Quote from: TomGubbinsKimmage on Today at 08:28:25 AM
The fact of whether he withheld intention the whole way along his career can only be verified by the man himself.
Ok, so you admit that we cannot verify this.  Which means that there is no proof.

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We would have evidence if he was alive to tell us that he withheld intention. We cant get that now. So the whole thing is inconclusive.
If something is inconclusive, then it can't be credible/believable.  Do you not understand this?

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Dont be a moron. If you have inconclusivity in such a serious matter you are morally obliged to abstain.
No, it's the exact opposite.  Canon Law takes the approach of "sacraments are valid until proven otherwise".

If you were going to prove invalidity, there are 2 steps along the way - 

a) facts which show the sacrament was doubtfully valid. (canon law calls this "positive doubt")
b) final determination of invalid.

You don't even have any evidence to support step (a).  There is no evidence to suggest that +Thuc withheld his intention, except people's opinion.  An opinion isn't a fact.  WITHOUT ANY EVIDENCE, then YOU MUST PRESUME VALIDITY.  This is church law.

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Stop leading folks to hell by encouraging them to go to CMRI.
Stop ignoring canon law.
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