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Author Topic: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?  (Read 3472 times)

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Re: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?
« Reply #180 on: Today at 09:14:26 AM »
If a bishop's life was so scrutinized like people do with Abp. Thuc, we would have some terrible doubts about the validity of a lot of clerics ordained or consecrated before the 1960s.

Some folks here need to understand the difference between positive and negative doubt.

Who ordained Cardinal Lienart? Was he of sound mind? Was this man interviewed? Do we have witnesses? Maybe Abp. Lefebvre was not really a priest, let alone a bishop. It goes on and on...

Except we're in a time of apostasy and the faithful have a right to know where their clergy stand.

So get a grip and stop being tradcuмenical.

Re: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?
« Reply #181 on: Today at 09:15:37 AM »
Lazarus, you are misunderstanding what I have written. You had the time and patience, and put in the effort to analyze and make judgements on my intelligence and style of thinking, instead of looking at evidence and Church teaching? Sounds more like an excuse and is a more subtle ad hominem. Your subtly exposes you like the slime left from a slug.

By gaslighting, I meant twisting what I have said, not rejecting something due to a legitimate disagreement.

Pax Vobis, PRUDENT DOUBT IS LITERALLY A TERM IN MORAL THEOLOGY AS I HAVE SHOWN IN THE LONG POST. Is that clear enough? I am not yelling, I am putting it in CAPS so that your eye is drawn here, because your eyes seem to be wandering all over the place in a disordered manner.

The more I explain, the more my words get manipulated. All I have done is share or paraphrase information from reputable sources.

I have never tried to force anyone here to doubt the +Thuc consecrations. I am here to inform, and I have done so to the best of my ability.

+Thuc people, if you’re so right, then why argue here? If you have the truth, who cares what others say?

I wish you all well.


Lazarus is not of sound mind. I'm choosing not to engage with him.

The other gents are redeemable and just mad or not very bright. But Lazarus is just in another world.


Re: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?
« Reply #182 on: Today at 09:17:40 AM »
Who cares?  None of this affects +Thuc’s ability to consecrate.  It’s completely off-topic.  With each post, you further prove you don’t understand the principles in question. 
I've already responded to that point.

Re: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?
« Reply #183 on: Today at 09:20:24 AM »
This is a direct quote from Cardinal Achille Lienart, taken from the book Twelve Council Fathers:

"Nor is it true that the Jews are a deicide people, for, if they had been aware of His divinity, they would have believed in Him and would not have brought about his death."  In the same book Lienart admitted that he had allowed Orthodox priests to study at his seminary since 1953.  Orthodox are heretics, even if they have valid orders. He said that his main preoccupation was to further Pope John's aggiornamento. And he was in favor of the liturgical changes. I quote:

"There will be, for example, some changes in our liturgical functions, in order that the initiated will not be the only ones to understand the liturgy but that it may become more accessible to everyone." (p. 52) 

And because of the Council the "Church appears more alive than ever." (p. 53) Leinart was an absolute modernist who praised the Council. Card. Lienart consecrated Abp. Lefebvre.  I would not be so quick to attack the orthodoxy of Bp. Thuc. The fact is that so many of these bishops were already immersed in liberalism long before the Council got started.


You're acting like there is some kind of equality of character between Thuc and Lefebvre. 

The instability of mind is SUPPORTIVE evidence of possible withholding of intention. Such an accusation was never leveled against Lefebvre. EVER.

Re: Is there evidence that +Thuc ordinations are invalid?
« Reply #184 on: Today at 09:22:21 AM »
I was referring to Tom as the one doing the calumniating, certainly not you. I'm sorry that I was not clear on that.

+ABL did his consecrations under completely different, incomparable circuмstances.

Again, the idea of +Thuc suffering from some mental disorder is, and should be taken as a lying rumor that's still believed by many - perhaps it was started by that same NO cardinal from that article you posted. Who knows? I say this because if +Thuc had a mental disorder, then all trads of the day had the same disorder, but to a lesser (or more?) degree perhaps.

Those who try to deny the obvious craziness of Thuc are motivated by their bias in trying to prove that his line had no problems.

They are not objective.