Quote from: Meg I'm glad that you are saying something about the problem of sedeism, because it is a BIG problem in tradition. Good luck trying to get through to them, though (sedes). Most of them are too far gone. Here in the U.S., individualism is rampant, and sedeism is an extreme form of individualism
Yes, Svism is a problem, that's probably why the SSPX endorsed an excellent book by Salza and Siscoe that thoroughly refutes sedevacantism. https://sspx.org/en/news-events/news/sedevacantism-refuted-true-or-false-pope-brian-mccall Nevertheless, I regard most of those who've fallen to the error as Traditional Catholic brothers and sisters. I know quite a few former sedes who are now non-SV Traditional Catholics. For many of them, the consideration mentioned in the OP was decisive. The main problem with SVism is this, when we hold to easy ideas like "all I need to do is say he's not the Pope, and everything will be fine", the end goal of final Restoration in Rome gets delayed. I believe in the next decade, as 60+ year svism becomes increasingly absurd to many, we will see many SVs become non sv traditionalists, and the cause of Restoration will advance quickly. However, IMO,....it's not a good idea to make a case, as you do in the above post, that the SSPX either will or does somehow boldly stand for Truth, and as such, clergy in the conciliar church are counting on them to stand for Truth.
Well, it was docuмented in the OP link I gave that many members of the Catholic Hierachy agreed with His Excellency Bishop Fellay on the "open questions" like ecuмenism and interfaith dialogue, and many had praised and lauded H.E. for fighting them. But here's a more recent interview from Rev. Father Pagliarani, where Father condemns Amazon synod's apostasy, and much else besides. The problem with the Resistance is that they're not really interested in doing anything, as if just condemning is going to be enough. What is really important is this - training an Army of Priests, say at least 10,000 in the next 10 to 20 years. It would be wonderful if all Traditional Fraternities united to do this, "Unite the Clans", or a Holy Alliance.https://fsspx.news/en/church-its-head-50632 The Resistance doesn't want to do that. Some Resisters seem to want even to prevent us from doing it. The SSPX continues to condemn error. But right now it is more focused on the goal of forming many holy Traditional Priests.But you can’t have one foot “under new-rome” and one foot with Tradition
Riiight. Try finding this in a Traditional Catechism or theology manual if you can. This is what Fr. Gueranger says about such a false attitude, "We, then, both priests and people, have a right to know whence our pastors have received their power. From whose hand have they received the keys? If their mission come from the Apostolic See, let us honor and obey them, for they are sent to us by Jesus Christ, who has invested them, through Peter, with His own authority ... Thus it is that the divine Founder of the Church, who willed that she should be a city seated on a mountain, gave her visibility; it was an essential requisite; for since all were called to enter her pale, all must be able to see her. But He was not satisfied with this. He moreover willed that the spiritual power exercised by her pastors should come from a visible source, so that the faithful might have a sure means of verifying the claims of those who were to guide them in His name. Our Lord (we say it reverently) owed this to us; for, on the last day, He will not receive us as His children, unless we shall have been members of His Church, and have lived in union with Him by the ministry of pastors lawfully constituted."You can find the same teaching of necessary subordination to the Hierarchical Teaching Church in Pope St. Pius X's Catechism. See "The Ninth Article of the Creed, Q. 38 to 72." E.g. https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/catechism-of-st-pius-x-1286 45
Q. Who, then, are they who possess the teaching power in the Church? A. The teaching power in the Church is possessed by the Pope and the Bishops, and, dependent on them, by the other sacred ministers. 46 Q. Are we obliged to hear the Teaching Church? A. Yes, without doubt we are obliged under pain of eternal damnation to hear the Teaching Church; for Jesus Christ has said to the Pastors of His Church, in the persons of the Apostles: "He who hears you, hears Me, and he who despises you, despises Me."
True Tradition is Tradition in Communion with the Church of Rome, the Church of 2000 years, the Church of all time. "Come and attend Mass in this chapel with the priests of the Society, and, in the various centers, bring about a regrouping of the faithful staying with the Society, so that they keep their bond with Rome and with the Church. It is very important that there should always be the bond with Rome if we wish to remain Catholic; even if we do not agree with everything being done in Rome, I think the bond is absolutely indispensable."As for liars who call the Society schismatic, who hardly deserve to be answered again, the Pope himself has answered them, "
As a result of the Pope’s act, during the Holy Year, we will have ordinary jurisdiction. In the image I mentioned, this has the effect of giving us the official insignia of firefighters, whereas such a status was denied us for decades" https://damselofthefaith.wordpress.com/2015/12/01/ordinary-jurisdiction-for-the-year-of-mercy-bishop-fellay-says/ It is Pope Francis himself who refutes the calumny, and Bishop Fellay has rightly explained, with the indefinite extension of those faculties by the Holy Father, that SSPX Bishops do indeed have Ordinary Jurisdiction going forward. The right path for SVists is to return to Catholic Communion, by recognizing the Pope, obtaining Habitual Jurisdiction from him, and working for the Restoration of Tradition from within the Church. It's not true that Jurisdiction is a human invention; Papal Primacy of Jurisdiction is Dogma. Jurisdiction is Represented in Scripture by the Keys, it is Divinely Instituted. No non-Catholic Bishop can ever have Ordinary Jurisdiction, either "Old Catholic", "Orthodox" or anyone else. Only Catholic Hierarchs can have OJ, by divine law.
Topic: Every Pius XII appointed Bishop dead except one - time to move on from SVism? (Read 16074 times)