A stupid debate over trivial matters.  Recognizing, in the middle of an UNPRECEDENTED (and never to be repeated) CRISIS, that a heretic pope *might* still hold the governing office (and only the temporal power of the Vatican state) is just a stupid, petty, perfectionist thing to argue about.  It's so minimal and ridiculous to fight over that one might question the masculinity of those who do so.

I don't see his remarks as a reference to the CT.  I didn't think those that take that position believe Bergoglio is pope nor that the Novus Ordo sect is the Catholic Church.

Yeah, it looks as if they could be interpreted a few different ways. But, I think Bp. Sanborn, per his testimony, is taking it as directed at the Thesis because of the other remarks Bp. Dolan made regarding Sanborn's priests capitulating out of necessity to state lockdown measures rather than taking a stand.

But, I honestly don't know. I only brought this forward so people are aware of yet another trad schism in the making

I recall a few weeks ago people asking about whether there was some sort of feud between Bp. Dolan and Bp. Sanborn. Apparently, due to a recent statement in a sermon and his bulletin, Bp. Dolan has said some unsavory things about Bp. Sanborn and his seminary and priests. In particular attacking the sedeprivationist position (Cassiciacuм thesis) and how some priests shut down due to state lockdown orders.

Here is Bp. Sanborn's response and recount of the accusations.

According to a third and common exposition, by this revolt or apostacy, others understand a great falling off of great numbers from the Catholic Church and faith, in those nations where it was professed before; not but that, as S. Aug. expressly takes notice, the Church will remain always visible, and Catholic in its belief, till the end of the world. This interpretation we find in S. Cyr.[5] of Jerusalem.  Catech. 15.  See also S. Anselm on this place, S. Thomas, Salmeron, Estius, &c.


. . . . . .

The Church of God, with her head, strong in the promises of Jesus Christ, will persevere to the end, frustra circuмlatrantibus hæreticis.  Aug. de util. cred. c. xvii.


Apoc. 18

Nothing that the Protestants bring, as I think, has even the face or appearance of an objection, unless it be when they tell us, that by Babylon in S. John's Revelation is meant Rome; therefore, say they, the Church of Rome must be Babylon, and the scarlet whore that sitteth there must be the pope with his cardinals, clothed in scarlet and purple.  I answer: All Catholics, and all men of sense, have reason to wonder and ask by what kind of logic they have hooked or drawn into the consequence the Church of Rome.  There is not, as the bishop of Meaux desires the Protestants to take notice, in all these visions and predictions the least hint or insinuation of a fallen corrupted church, but of a heathen city and pagan empire.


Haydock, George. Catholic Commentary on the New Testament . Veritatis Splendor Publications. Kindle Edition.

This apostasy or revolt, by the judgment in manner of all ancient writers, is the general forsaking and fall of the Roman empire. So Tertullian li. de resur. carnis.; St. Jerome q. 11 ad Algasiam; St. Chrysostom ho. 4; and St. Ambrose upon this place, St. Augustine De Civit. Dei li. 20 c. 19. All which fathers and the rest Calvin presumptuously condemneth of error and folly herein, for that their exposition agreeth not with his and his fellows blasphemous fiction that the Pope should be Antichrist. To establish which false impiety, they interpret this revolt or apostasy to be a general revolt of the visible Church from God, whose house or building (they say) was suddenly destroyed, and lay many years ruined, and ruled only by Satan and Antichrist. So saith the foresaid Arch-heretic here, though for the advantage of his defense and as the matter elsewhere requireth, he seemeth (as all their fashion is) to speak in other places quite contrary: but with such color and collusion of words, that neither other men nor himself can tell what he would have or say. And his fathers Wyclif and Luther, his fellows and followers Illyricus, Beza, and the rest are (for the time of the Church's falling from Christ) so vatious among themselves, and so contrary to him, that it is horrible to see their confusion, and a pitiful case that any reasonable man will follow such companions to evident perdition.


The Original and True Rheims New Testament, Prepared and Edited by Dr. William von Peters, Ph.D. (Page 446).