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Author Topic: Does praying with N.O./V2 caths count as praying with heretics??  (Read 4771 times)

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Offline Philothea3

Re: Does praying with N.O./V2 caths count as praying with heretics??
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2022, 10:37:01 AM »
Quote from: Bonaventure on March 09, 2022, 10:22:46 AM
On an individual basis, there are a good number within the Novus Ordo who, by their very words and actions, are heretics.  Some would argue the same regarding certain members within "Trad" circles.
 However, as a blanket statement covering every Catholic attending the Novus Ordo, I agree with the above statement.  Unless, of course, someone here has the gift of being able to read everyone's soul. 

If someone is clearly, and proudly, living as a heretic, then don't pray with them.
Wait, how do one act as a heretic?
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Offline trento

Re: Does praying with N.O./V2 caths count as praying with heretics??
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2022, 10:56:49 AM »
Dogmatic sedevacantists that claims Catholics cannot attend "una cuм" Masses says yes.
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Offline Francis Xavier

Re: Does praying with N.O./V2 caths count as praying with heretics??
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2022, 11:17:28 AM »
Quote from: Philothea3 on March 09, 2022, 10:37:01 AM
Wait, how do one act as a heretic?
Like attending Protestant “masses,” praying together with the heretics and schismatics, celebrating Hanukkah or kissing the Koran?
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Offline Bonaventure

Re: Does praying with N.O./V2 caths count as praying with heretics??
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2022, 11:22:31 AM »
Quote from: Philothea3 on March 09, 2022, 10:37:01 AM
Wait, how do one act as a heretic?

God granted you an intellect; use it.

If someone tells you, or publicly states, something that is clearly antithetical to Church teaching (e.g., "My wife is on the pill because we already have three kids and we don't believe the Church can tell us what to do,"), then it shouldn't be too difficult to ascertain that they're a heretic and it would be best to avoid them, let alone pray with them. (OR.... gasp.... inform them of their error.)
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Offline Matthew

  • Mod
Re: Does praying with N.O./V2 caths count as praying with heretics??
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2022, 11:37:16 AM »
Quote from: DigitalLogos on March 09, 2022, 10:27:35 AM
They have not been formally condemned as a group to be heretics, so no. The people making up the NO are at worst material heretics.

Now, if you know individuals who are formal heretics, by all means avoid praying with them.

This.

This is the logical conclusion, though, from Sedevacantists. They have deposed the pope, the hierarchy, and the whole Church. It's a fine line perhaps, but a line one must not cross nonetheless.

If you are saying the Pope is a formal heretic, the Conciliar Church is not the Catholic Church "full stop", they are all heretics "full stop", then you wonder about stuff like this -- should I associate with them? Can I pray with them? etc.

If you ask me, it's another argument against Sedevacantism. A reductio ad absurdam if you will.

And I should point out: most Sedevacantists are also Hierarchy-vacantist and Ecclesiavacantist. It is NEVER just the Pope they condemn and completely reject as 100% heretical.
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