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Author Topic: Divine Mercy Devotion  (Read 10743 times)

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Offline Sede Catholic

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Divine Mercy Devotion
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2013, 01:13:24 AM »
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  • Servus, already you have had to concede that you did not accurately quote S. Faustina Kowalska:

    Quote from: Servus
    As far as the Eucharist, sorry, "jumped" was not the correct word. This is the quote that I was primarily refering to…


    So, Servus, you claimed that she spoke several times of the Eucharist “jumping”.
    Now you have had to concede that she did not even use the word “jumping”.
    You also wrongly and erroneously claimed that she “spoke several times” about this.
    Again, this is untrue. She mentioned it only once.
    And not in the sensational language that you erroneously claimed.

    Servus, it is a very serious sin to slander a deceased Catholic Nun.
    You are deliberately trying to injure her reputation.
    And you are using false quotes to do that. That is very sinful.
    You need to mention that in Confession.
    Also, there is the matter of restitution.
    If you harm another’s reputation with falsehoods, it is yet another sin if you do not attempt to make restitution of your injury to their reputation.
    It is even more morally serious when the injured person is a deceased Catholic nun.

    Furthermore, Servus, even in your recent post where you had to admit that you have done this, you have yet again provided another incomplete quote, which again has distorted the true meaning.

    What you have just quoted is about a prayer that S. Faustina thought up regarding her preparatin to receive Our Lord in Holy Communion.
    It is from some long notes, which she prefaced with the statement:

    Quote
    My Preparation for Holy Communion


    There are phrases like:

    Quote
    Today, I am preparing myself for Your coming as bride does for the coming of her bridegroom. He
    is great Lord, this Bridegroom of mine. The heaven cannot contain Him. The Seraphim who stand
    closest to Him cover their faces and repeat unceasingly: Holy Holy, Holy.


    This great Lord is my Bridegroom. It is to Him that the Choirs sing. It is before Him that the Thrones
    bow down. By His splendor the sun is eclipsed.


    So these are long prayers that she is making to do with preparation to receive Our Lord in Holy Communion.

    Shortly after the paragraph that you quoted, she says:
    Quote
    O my Jesus, I understand the meaning of "host," the meaning of sacrifice. I desire to be before Your Majesty a living host; that is, a living sacrifice that daily burns in Your honor. When my strength begins to fail, it is Holy Communion that will sustain me and give me strength.


    These are prayers to do with receiving Holy Communion.

    So these partial quotes do not prove anything sinister at all.

    And again, it is a matter of the Church’s authority.
    The Catholic Church of Pope Pius XI and Pope Pius XII was willing to give The Divine Mercy Imprimaturs.
    So they did not have these strange insights of yours into it, which have only surfaced in the internet age.

    I would rather accept Imprimaturs from Catholic Bishops in the pre-conciliar Catholic Church, than slander against a deceased Catholic nun from internet posters.

    If, Servus, you are not a Sedevacantist, then you are bound to accept the canonization of S. Faustina Kowalska, because canonizations are infallible.

    Whether or not you are a Sedevacantist, you are bound to accept that the Catholic Church gave The Divine Mercy extensive Imprimaturs in the Papacies of Pope Pius XI and Pope Pius XII.  

    Quote from: The Casuist (A.D. 1906)
    Where the Church has thus given her approval to any particular private revelation, it is no longer permitted to ridicule or to despise it. “Fas non est,” says Card. Franzelin, “tales revelationes contemnere” (de div. trad. 22). To do so were to fail in the respect due to the Church….


    Servus, do you accept that?
    Rather than just cutting and pasting from other people’s inaccurate “writings” on The Divine Mercy, why not state your own case?
    Servus: Are you a Sedevacantist who rejects the canonization?
    Or do you accept the Imprimaturs of Catholic Bishops from the pre-conciliar Church?

    Francis is an Antipope. Pray that God will grant us a good Pope and save the Church.
    I abjure and retract my schismatic support of the evil CMRI.Thuc condemned the Thuc nonbishops
    "Now, therefore, we declare, say, determine and pronounce that for every human creature it is necessary for salvation to be subject to the authority of the Roman Pontiff"-Pope Boniface VIII.
    If you think Francis is Pope,do you treat him like an Antipope?
    Pastor Aeternus, and the Council of Trent Sessions XXIII and XXIV


    Offline Sede Catholic

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    Divine Mercy Devotion
    « Reply #16 on: February 03, 2013, 01:24:24 AM »
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  • The true Catholic response is to have the humility to accept the Imprimaturs of the pre-conciliar Catholic Church.
    Francis is an Antipope. Pray that God will grant us a good Pope and save the Church.
    I abjure and retract my schismatic support of the evil CMRI.Thuc condemned the Thuc nonbishops
    "Now, therefore, we declare, say, determine and pronounce that for every human creature it is necessary for salvation to be subject to the authority of the Roman Pontiff"-Pope Boniface VIII.
    If you think Francis is Pope,do you treat him like an Antipope?
    Pastor Aeternus, and the Council of Trent Sessions XXIII and XXIV


    Offline SJB

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    Divine Mercy Devotion
    « Reply #17 on: February 03, 2013, 10:07:28 AM »
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  • Quote from: Sedecatholic
    The previous post is false and untrue.
    The Holy Office lost its authority on the death of Pope Pius XII.


    The 1959 decision of the Holy Office is just a fact.

    Who else "lost their authority" with the death of Pius XII? Everybody in the Hierarchy? You sound like you've been listening to Fr. Cekada.
    It would be comparatively easy for us to be holy if only we could always see the character of our neighbours either in soft shade or with the kindly deceits of moonlight upon them. Of course, we are not to grow blind to evil

    Offline SJB

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    Divine Mercy Devotion
    « Reply #18 on: February 03, 2013, 10:30:18 AM »
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  • Quote from: Sedecatholic
    Servus, it is a very serious sin to slander a deceased Catholic Nun.
    You are deliberately trying to injure her reputation.
    And you are using false quotes to do that. That is very sinful.
    You need to mention that in Confession.
    Also, there is the matter of restitution.
    If you harm another’s reputation with falsehoods, it is yet another sin if you do not attempt to make restitution of your injury to their reputation.
    It is even more morally serious when the injured person is a deceased Catholic nun.


    Did Cardinal Ottaviani, head of the Holy Office which supressed The Divine Mercy in 1959, need to "go to confession?"

    Anyway, nobody is impugning Sr. Faustina. The fact is that her Diary was put on the Index. That is proof positive that something in that Diary is against the Catholic faith. The placement of a book on The Index of Forbidden Books is a serious matter.

    Here's the preface of a book from around 1940 called What is the Index?:

    Quote
    Extract translations from the Preface of
    INDEX LIBRORUM PROHIBITORUM
    Anno MDCCCCXL
    Index of prohibited books
    Year 1940

    "The Holy Church has through many centuries carried out immense persecutions, and the number of heroes who sealed the Christian faith with their blood, were multiplied. Today we face a struggle which is lead by the Devil himself; it is founded on something both insincere and destructive; Malicious publications.

    No other danger is greater, it threatens the faith and exercise of custom and integrity, therefore the Holy Church will increasingly point this out to the Christians, in that way enabling them to retreat before this threat."

    " The Holy Church, which was appointed by God himself, could not proceed otherwise. It represents an infallible master who securely leads his believers. Thus, the Church is equipped with all necessary and useful means to prevent the infection of the herd of Jesus, by the erroneous and corrupt which will show itself irrespective of the mask it hides behind. Consequently The Holy Church has the duty, and hence the right, to pursue this aim.

    One must not claim that the condemnation of harmful books is a violation of freedom or a war against the Light of Truth, and that the index of forbidden books is a permanent attack against the progress of science and literature."
    "Irreligious and immoral books are written in a seductive manner, often with themes which deal with fleshly passion, or themes that deceive the pride of the soul. These books are carefully written to make an impression and aim at gaining ground in both the heart and mind of the incautious reader."

    "In addition, the necessity to suppress malicious publications for the wellbeing of the public, has particularly been proven lately, when even civil governments, have used preventive censorship to protect the judicial system and public order, with a rigidity unknown to the Church. This shows us how well it corresponds with the true liberty. No matter how much true literary and scientific values a book can possess, it cannot legitimate the distribution which opposes the religion and good custom. On the contrary, the more subtle and seductive the evil is, the more it necessitates stronger and more efficient suppression of it."

    "These prohibited books were written to make an impression, and all this have been exposed to remove any doubt occurring among the Catholic believers. This explanation is intended for the devoted, good sons, who readily listen to the words of the good Shepherd Jesus, and to his representative on earth; the Pope. In short, this is intended for those who scrupulously comply with the rules, possibly with some exceptions arising from extreme conditions, where the Church grant exemptions for those who dissociate themselves from reading or owning the books which have been prohibited by the Holy Church."

    * From Palazzo del S. Uffizio,
    Festa del S. Cuore di Gesu
    7th of June 1929

    Cardinal MERRY DEL VAL,
    Suprema S. C. Del Sant'Uffizio Secretary
    It would be comparatively easy for us to be holy if only we could always see the character of our neighbours either in soft shade or with the kindly deceits of moonlight upon them. Of course, we are not to grow blind to evil

    Offline Sigismund

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    Divine Mercy Devotion
    « Reply #19 on: February 04, 2013, 03:58:57 PM »
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  • Quote from: Marlelar
    I've always been suspicious of this devotion.  For one thing, why would Christ command that a novena to His mercy be started on Good Friday????  Good Friday has always been completely and totally devoted to contemplating Christ's death on the cross.  

    Marsha


    Well, isn't Our Lord's death His ultimate act of mercy?
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir


    Offline SJB

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    Divine Mercy Devotion
    « Reply #20 on: February 04, 2013, 04:20:06 PM »
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  • Quote from: Sigismund
    Quote from: Marlelar
    I've always been suspicious of this devotion.  For one thing, why would Christ command that a novena to His mercy be started on Good Friday????  Good Friday has always been completely and totally devoted to contemplating Christ's death on the cross.  

    Marsha


    Well, isn't Our Lord's death His ultimate act of mercy?


    St. Faustina said that God's mercy is His greatest attribute. This is wrong, as Mercy and Justice are both infinitely perfect in God, because God is His attributes, which is why it's wrong to say that either is "greater" than the other. But that is what Sr. Faustina's diary claims that God said to her.

    What exactly is the value of this new devotion over and above that of the ancient devotion to the Sacred Heart? The main difference that I can see is this new one is very Novus Ordo - it promises lots of mercy without demanding anything in return.

    The message of the Sacred Heart is that Christ loves us and asks us to make reparation. That's what the Church has always promoted and the devotion to the Sacred Heart is the pefect means to that end. Anyway, if you want God's mercy, pray and go to confession. There's nothing new or complicated about it.
    It would be comparatively easy for us to be holy if only we could always see the character of our neighbours either in soft shade or with the kindly deceits of moonlight upon them. Of course, we are not to grow blind to evil

    Offline Sigismund

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    Divine Mercy Devotion
    « Reply #21 on: February 04, 2013, 08:37:31 PM »
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  • I am no particular defender of the Divine Mercy devotion.  I just didn't see anything wrong with reflecting on God's mercy on Good Friday.

    Theologically, your post seems entirely correct.
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir

    Offline parentsfortruth

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    Divine Mercy Devotion
    « Reply #22 on: February 04, 2013, 11:53:57 PM »
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  • Quote from: SJB
    Quote from: Sigismund
    Quote from: Marlelar
    I've always been suspicious of this devotion.  For one thing, why would Christ command that a novena to His mercy be started on Good Friday????  Good Friday has always been completely and totally devoted to contemplating Christ's death on the cross.  

    Marsha


    Well, isn't Our Lord's death His ultimate act of mercy?


    St. Faustina said that God's mercy is His greatest attribute. This is wrong, as Mercy and Justice are both infinitely perfect in God, because God is His attributes, which is why it's wrong to say that either is "greater" than the other. But that is what Sr. Faustina's diary claims that God said to her.

    What exactly is the value of this new devotion over and above that of the ancient devotion to the Sacred Heart? The main difference that I can see is this new one is very Novus Ordo - it promises lots of mercy without demanding anything in return.

    The message of the Sacred Heart is that Christ loves us and asks us to make reparation. That's what the Church has always promoted and the devotion to the Sacred Heart is the pefect means to that end. Anyway, if you want God's mercy, pray and go to confession. There's nothing new or complicated about it.


     :applause:

    Best post so far about this. Divine Mercy is entirely bogus, and it astonishes me that traditional Catholics would defend such things, when it's clear she supposedly heard from whatever devil that was (she claims it was Christ):

    "... I am uniting myself with you so intimately as with no other creature." Did the proponents of this fraud artist Faustina, consider that OUR LADY was the most intimately joined with Our Lord, and not SHE?

    Fraudstina also said that (Jesus, according to her) said "Tell the Superior General to count on you as the most faithful daughter in the Order." And contrast that with the suffering that Mother Mariana went through, and she was even thrown into prison! I'm sure Our Lady didn't sit there and tell her to boast that she was the most "faithful daughter in the order."

    This "devotion" takes away from the Sacred Heart. The promises attached to the ABSOLUTELY WORTHY Sacred Heart devotion are ten thousand times more believable than this tripe.

    This whole thing is trash. Throw it where it belongs.

    Hey, go sing with these guys if you like the "divine mercy chaplet." Welcome your novus ordo company.



    Then you guys can sing this song after you're done!



    But you probably want it in Latin. Maybe they'll concede. Then you'll be singing this.



    Matthew 5:37

    But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over and above these, is of evil.

    My Avatar is Fr. Hector Bolduc. He was a faithful parish priest in De Pere, WI,


    Offline rowsofvoices9

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    Divine Mercy Devotion
    « Reply #23 on: February 05, 2013, 01:43:05 AM »
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  • Quote from: SJB
    Quote from: Sigismund
    Quote from: Marlelar
    I've always been suspicious of this devotion.  For one thing, why would Christ command that a novena to His mercy be started on Good Friday????  Good Friday has always been completely and totally devoted to contemplating Christ's death on the cross.  

    Marsha


    Well, isn't Our Lord's death His ultimate act of mercy?


    St. Faustina said that God's mercy is His greatest attribute. This is wrong, as Mercy and Justice are both infinitely perfect in God, because God is His attributes, which is why it's wrong to say that either is "greater" than the other. But that is what Sr. Faustina's diary claims that God said to her.

    What exactly is the value of this new devotion over and above that of the ancient devotion to the Sacred Heart? The main difference that I can see is this new one is very Novus Ordo - it promises lots of mercy without demanding anything in return.

    The message of the Sacred Heart is that Christ loves us and asks us to make reparation. That's what the Church has always promoted and the devotion to the Sacred Heart is the pefect means to that end. Anyway, if you want God's mercy, pray and go to confession. There's nothing new or complicated about it.


    St. Thomas would agree with St. Faustina that God's mercy always precedes His justice.

    Quote
    The absolute priority of Divine Mercy

    St. Thomas Aquinas offers a brilliant explanation of the fact that, although mercy and justice are in every act of God, mercy always precedes justice:

    “Whatever is done by God in created things, is done according to proper order and proportion wherein consists the idea of justice. Thus justice must exist in all God’s works, Now the work of divine justice always presupposes the work of mercy; and is founded thereupon. For nothing is due to creatures, except for something pre-existing in them, or foreknown. Again, if this is due to a creature, it must be due on account of something that precedes. And since we cannot go on to infinity, we must come to something that depends only on the goodness of the divine will—which is the ultimate end. So in every work of God, viewed at its primary source, there appears mercy.” (ST I, q.21, a.4)

    Because God does not have to create anything at all, everything he does in the world is an expression first and foremost of his Divine Mercy.

    Even the souls condemned to eternal punishments in hell first experience mercy before justice: For they have no claim to existence, and it is a great act of mercy that God continues to preserve them in existence (especially since they hate him).
    Now, if the soul in mortal sin and even the soul in hell is supported by the Divine Mercy, how much more are we who live (and especially those in the state of grace) encompassed in Mercy?! What have we to fear?
    My conscience compels me to make this disclaimer lest God judges me partly culpable for the errors and heresy promoted on this forum... For the record I support neither Sedevacantism or the SSPX.  I do not define myself as either a traditionalist or Novus

    Offline SJB

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    « Reply #24 on: February 05, 2013, 06:41:57 AM »
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  • Quote from: rowsofvoices9
    St. Thomas would agree with St. Faustina that God's mercy always precedes His justice.


    The truth that God’s power is manifested more greatly in His mercy is a distinct and unrelated matter.

    If Sr. Faustina had said that to us that God's mercy is greater, or that His greatest work is His mercy, or some other such expression which referred to mercy as it is "out of" God, then there is no problem. The problem arose precisely because she chose to refer to God's "attributes." Attributes are qualities as they exist in the being. This is obvious even in everyday speech as we speak of what a man does, and this is different from his attributes. The latter are the things that he actually is.

    Even to speak of "attributes" of God is to speak analogically anyway, because God does not "have" attributes - He IS those attributes. So Sr. Faustina used the analogical language of theology to express an untruth about God.

    Also note that metaphorical language about God (God's "anger," "repentance," etc.) is one thing but it is quite another thing entirely to employ technical language inaccurately. Anyway, she is supposed to be reporting what God said to her anyway, so it is God who made this mistake, if we are to believe her. God certainly knows the difference, along with all Catholic theologians, including the 1959 Holy Office.
    It would be comparatively easy for us to be holy if only we could always see the character of our neighbours either in soft shade or with the kindly deceits of moonlight upon them. Of course, we are not to grow blind to evil

    Offline Sigismund

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    « Reply #25 on: February 05, 2013, 07:10:07 PM »
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  • Perhaps Sister Faustina simply wasn't very bright, or at least not theologically well educated.
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir


    Offline Kephapaulos

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    « Reply #26 on: February 05, 2013, 10:48:27 PM »
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  • God's Divine Mercy is indeed so great since He would have every right to smite all of us right now according to His Divine Justice, but He chooses not to do so out of His great love for us.
    "Non nobis, Domine, non nobis; sed nomini tuo da gloriam..." (Ps. 113:9)

    Offline SJB

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    « Reply #27 on: February 06, 2013, 09:51:22 AM »
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  • Quote from: Kephapaulos
    God's Divine Mercy is indeed so great since He would have every right to smite all of us right now according to His Divine Justice, but He chooses not to do so out of His great love for us.


    True, but as I said before, the truth that God’s power is manifested more greatly in His mercy is a distinct and unrelated matter.
    It would be comparatively easy for us to be holy if only we could always see the character of our neighbours either in soft shade or with the kindly deceits of moonlight upon them. Of course, we are not to grow blind to evil

    Offline SJB

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    « Reply #28 on: February 06, 2013, 08:36:57 PM »
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  • Quote from: Sigismund
    Perhaps Sister Faustina simply wasn't very bright, or at least not theologically well educated.


    True or not, this is really beside the point. The childern at Fatima were certainly not theologically trained and were very young. They didn't need to be educated to be used by God for His purposes. The point isn't that Sr. Faustina was poorly educated, but that her diary tells us either she misunderstood God's message or God told her an untruth, which is impossible. Either way, the whole thing should be avoided and that's exactly what the Holy Office told us to do in 1959.
    It would be comparatively easy for us to be holy if only we could always see the character of our neighbours either in soft shade or with the kindly deceits of moonlight upon them. Of course, we are not to grow blind to evil

    Offline rowsofvoices9

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    « Reply #29 on: February 08, 2013, 05:55:52 PM »
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  • http://www.unamsanctamcatholicam.com/spirituality/82-spirtuality/222-defense-of-divine-mercy.html

    Defense of the Divine Mercy Devotion

    Devotion of Divine Mercy
    From God, the Imagination, or the Devil?
    by Kasey Moerbeek
    Part 1


    This last Pentecost my husband and I were at a BBQ with fellow traditional Catholics and, come to find out, some tended to be more “anti-anything-new” and who viewed holiness as being in direct relation to how against “anything-new” they were. While I hate the accusation toward us trads that we're being “pharisees”, many of us do come across that way. We love to imitate St. Paul when he said “But when Cephas was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed” (1) but ignore that the same Holy Ghost said through him “And if I should prophecy and should know all mysteries, and all knowledge, and if I should have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.” (2) We emphasize the importance of reverence at the Sacrifice of the Mass, but gossip about our “ignorant” neighbors. We use our opportunities to pray for the Pope and our bishops as a gossip/condemnation-fest, much like the story of the Pharisee and publican. We may be more pure in doctrine than many bishops, but our pride and lack of true charity makes us, to use the word of God Himself, nothing. On judgment day it will not matter how traditional and faithful we were if we were full of pride and hate for the fathers (Pope and bishops) that God gave us, regardless of their faithfulness.

    One view that expressed was an intense hatred and disgust for the Divine Mercy devotions of St. Faustina, even though none of these people had read more than a few select verses from her Diary. They were doing what many anti-Catholic Protestants do: rely on hearsay, ignore the context of the actual source, and guilt by association. This prompted me to write a defense of the devotion against those who claim it is false. Part 1 is going to deal with the objections raised by Fr. Peter Scott, SSPX.

    Fr. Scott has a lengthy attack on the Divine Mercy devotion published online. In this attack, he states that the devotions was “condemned by the Holy Office.” (3) Maybe I'm dense, but why does it matter if the Holy Office condemned it when that same Holy Office approved it after investigation? Yes, her Diary was put on the Catholic No-No Reading List, but the reasons have been clarified since: bad translations and doctrinal misunderstandings, both of which have since been corrected and understood. How do we know? Cardinal Ottaviani – a Cardinal instrumental in getting the Diary on the No-No List – encouraged the reversal in 1965 4). It would be like attacking the devotion to Our Lady of Guadaluple because Bishop Zumarraga was at first skeptical, ignoring the fact that he later endorsed it enthusiastically.

    Fr. Scott is of the opinion that the Diary was condemned because of the alleged over-emphasis on “God's mercy as to exclude His justice.” This seems to be the opinion – unfounded, might I add - of those who have not read the Diary (or only parts) and rely on hearsay. Is mercy emphasized? Well, the Diary is about God's mercy, and it's been my understanding that God is not scatter-brained, so yes, the Diary focuses on mercy. This particular argument – mercy with no justice - against her writings reveals that one needs to drop the theology books and pick up a dictionary. Mercy is desired when one wishes to avoid a just punishment. To request mercy from God is to admit that one has messed up badly and that one cannot bear the punishment rightfully due. This message is perfectly in line with the Christ of the Scriptures Who said to those He called hypocrites and vipers:

    “Go then and learn what this means, 'I will have mercy and not sacrifice.' For I am not come to call the just, but sinners.” (5)[size]

    “Before the Day of Justice I am sending the Day of Mercy.” (6) I can hear the argument against this already: then was the time of mercy, now is the time of justice. Really? Have you been cast into Hell yet? As you're reading this now, it would seem that God has given you another day to amend your life and grow in perfection, despite your faults and previous (and, God forbid, current) offenses. That is mercy, not justice.

    Father Scott: "The true image of God’s mercy is the Sacred Heart of Jesus[...] The Sacred Heart calls for a devotion of reparation, as the popes have always requested. However, this is not the case with the Divine Mercy devotion."

    It seems Father is trying to say that there is only one image of God's mercy, and that image is the Sacred Heart. Is not the Crucifixion an image of God's mercy? The Sacred Heart is a devotional image, not a dogma of the Faith. It is a devotional image to convey the love of Christ for humanity. The Divine Mercy is a devotional image to convey the mercy of Christ for sinners. “The [Divine Mercy] image has no heart” says Fr. Scott. As much as I enjoy (to my shame) being the bearer of the obvious, I feel extra guilty when it's with a priest. The crucifix has no exposed Heart. Images of the Child Jesus do not have His exposed Heart, yet who loves and forgives more easily than a child? Did Christ come as the Sacred Heart when appearing during the miracle of the sun at Fatima? The Sacred Heart is a wonderful devotion that every Catholic should practice, but it is not the be all and end all of Catholic piety.

    As for reparation, while (to my recollection anyway) Christ doesn't tell St. Faustina to shout to the world “make acts of reparation”, He does make it very clear that reparation is part of the work of mercy:


    “The love and sacrifice of these souls sustain the world in existence.” (7)

    “win souls for Me by prayer and sacrifice, and by encouraging them to trust in My mercy.” (8)


    Again, Father Scott: "This absence of the need for reparation for sins is manifest in the strange promise of freedom from all the temporal punishment due to sin for those who observe the 3:00 p.m. Low Sunday devotions. How could such a devotion be more powerful and better than a plenary indulgence, applying the extraordinary treasury of the merits of the saints?"

    First of all, this statement is either deliberately dishonest or based on poor research. There is no removal of temporal punishment “for those who observe the 3:00 pm Low Sunday devotions” in the Diary. The Church, however, has granted a plenary indulgence for this, so his question “how could such a devotion be more powerful and better than a plenary indulgence” doesn't work as plenary indulgences are granted by the Church.
    The removal of the temporal punishment due to sin that Father is referring to is granted directly by God. As I recall, the Bridegroom has more authority and power than the Bride. I would like to ask back “how can applying the extraordinary treasury of the merits of the Saints be more efficacious than applying the Blood of God in obedience?” as the devotion of the Divine Mercy says. Trusting in the promise granted by Christ (and endorsed by the Church) is no different than trusting in the promises granted by the Virgin Mary to those who pray the Rosary, or the promises granted by Christ to those who practice the First Fridays devotion.

    Father asks “How could it not require as a condition that we perform a penitential work of our own?”

    What it requires, Father, is the Sacrament of Penance, and as we Catholics know, one can perform all the penances one likes, but if the Sacrament of Penance is avoided, one's mortification mean nothing.  Sacraments over-ride our good works, at least that was my understanding. We ought not play mortification off against penance.

    As a follow-up, he also asks “How could it not require the detachment from even venial sin that is necessary to obtain a plenary indulgence?”

    Well, why isn't “the detachment from even venial sin” required for Baptism? The answer is from God Himself, “I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy; and I will shew mercy to whom I will shew mercy.” (9) “Is it not lawful for Me to do what I will? Is thy eye evil, because I am good?” (10)

    Another accusation, this one against the Saint herself, is that she uses the words of Christ to praise herself. First of all, true humility is admitting what you are, not lying for the sake of appearing holy and humble. If someone compliments me on a meal I cooked which was in fact very good, it would be dishonest (not virtuous) of me to say “No, it's trash, not fit for human consumption.” Second, she often refers to herself as a miserable and weak creature, which I will quote shortly. Thirdly, why is she proud, but other Saints who've said similar things not? “Real Saints don't do that, and Christ doesn't praise sinners because He doesn't want them to become proud” you say? Really? Are you sure about that?

    Christ appeared, with His Mother, to St. Gertrude and referred to the Saint as “My elect” (11) and that those who thanked Him for graces He bestowed on her would participate in her merits and obtain their petition if it be for their eternal welfare (12). Or how about His exact words recorded by the Saint herself, “If anyone, being oppressed by sorrow and grief, humbly and sincerely seeks consolation in thy words, he will not be deceived in his desires; for I, the God abiding in thee, urged by the liberality of My love and goodness, desire through thee to bestow much good on many.Whosoever commends himself with full confidence to thy prayers will obtain life eternal by thy mediation. Just as much as anyone hopes to receive from thee, so much will he surely obtain. Besides this, whatever thou shalt promise anyone in My Name, that I shall certainly grant him.” (13)

    Or this, “Just as I have now drawn in My breath, so shall I in truth draw to Myself all who incline toward thee with love and devotion for My sake.” (14)

    Moses says “Moses was a man exceeding meek above all men that dwelt upon earth” (15).

    Our Blessed Mother says “My soul doth magnify the Lord. [...]He hath regarded the humility of His handmaid; for behold from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed, (16)

    St. John the Divine constantly refers to himself as the “disciple whom Jesus+ loved” throughout his Gospel.

    Why are these Saints to be imitated, their writings not condemned as “proud”, but St. Faustina and her writings not? Because she was highly regarded by a Pope with issues is not a valid reason for dismissing her or her writings anymore than the writings of St. Peter are to be dismissed because his behavior required rebuke by his subordinate, St. Paul.

    Throughout the Diary, we see plenty examples of her humility. “Going deeper into myself, I could find nothing but great misery.” (17) “I know very well what I am of myself, because for this purpose Jesus has opened the eyes of my soul; I am an abyss of misery, and hence I understand that whatever good there is in my soul consists solely of His holy grace.” (18) “O Jesus, eternal Truth, strengthen my feeble forces; You can do all things, Lord. I know that without You all my efforts are in vain. O Jesus, do not hide from me, for I cannot live without You. Listen to the cry of my soul. Your mercy has not been exhausted, Lord, so have pity on my misery.” (19) “My Jesus, despite Your graces, I see and feel all my misery.”  (20) “I saw the postulants, in spirit, beautiful and pleasing to the Lord; and myself, an abyss of misery.” (21) “Without You, I am weakness itself. What am I without Your grace if not an abyss of my own misery? Misery is my possession.” (22) These are just a few examples, her diary is laden with more.

    Conclusion: People who dislike the Diary, devotion of the Divine Mercy, and St. Faustina do so not because it actually contains error, but because either 1) it's the “trad” thing to do, or 2) they don't like Bl. John Paul II, and if he liked her, it must be because she and her writings are heretical. Guilt by association. It's just as dishonest for a non-traditional Catholic to say that all who prefer the Tridentine Mass are schismatics based on their experience with Sedevacantists.

    Citations

    1) Galatians 2:11
    2) 1 Corinthians 13:2, italics mine
    3) All quotes of Father Scott, unless otherwise noted:  http://www.angelusonline.org/index.php?section=articles&subsection=show_article&article_id=2895
    4) http://thedivinemercy.org/message/history/timeline.php
    5) Matthew 9:13
    6) Divine Mercy In My Soul, #1588
    7) ibid. #367
    8) ibid #1690
    9) Romans 9:15
    10) Matthew 20:15
    11) St. Gertrude the Great: Herald of Divine Love pg. 42
    12) ibid. pg 62
    13) ibid. pg 24
    14) ibid. pg 25
    15) Numbers 12:3
    16) Luke 1:46-48
    17) Divine Mercy in my Soul, #23
    18) ibid. #56
    19) ibid. #69
    20) ibid. #606
    21) ibid. #1108
    22) ibid. #1630

    Defense of the Divine Mercy Devotion (part 2)

    Last time in this series, we examined some objections to the Divine Mercy Devotion of St. Faustina presented by Fr. Peter Scott, SSPX, and found them wanting. In this article will be dealing with the objections made by Mr. (more commonly known as “Brother”) Peter Dimond, Sedevacantist. He seems to deliberately twist the facts of the Divine mercy so he can continue to add to the reasons that he hates Bl. John Paul II. That is quite a claim, but it is a claim that I intend to back up. Some of his objections are similar if not the same as those of Fr. Scott, and to those objections I will provide a link to my previous article.

    Before addressing his objections, I have to say that I think it's sad that anyone would take seriously the “investigation” of someone like Brother Dimond, who (1) seems to have not read the diary himself; and (2) admits that the “investigation” of a 600-page book consisted of a quick “flip through”[1].

    Let's tackle Brother Dimond's objections one at a time.

    Objection 1

    “The fact is that in the 1950's the Divine Mercy Devotion was suppressed and Sr. Faustina's diary was on the index of forbidden books.”

    What Bro. Dimond doesn't tell you is that Bl. Pius XII refused to put the Diary on the Index. The Pope who opened the Second Vatican Council - Bl. John XXIII, a Pope that Mr. Dimond does not acknowledge to be a valid Pope– is the one who did so. So, according to him, an anti-Pope put it on the list, and then after thorough investigation – as opposed to a “quick flip through of the Diary” - gave it approval. The last pre-Vatican II Pope did not condemn her, but the Pope who opened the Second Vatican Council did. This is not a strong argument coming from a Sedevacantist.

    Objection 2

    “In addition to that, something that concerned us was that it seemed to be popular among the Charismatic 'Catholics,'”

    Perhaps it is popular among them, but it is also popular among Catholics who are not charismatic. Reading the Bible is popular among Protestants, but that doesn't mean it's demonic, how many Saints are there who loved reading the Scriptures? Guilt by association, is a fallacy Mr. Diamond. It should also be noted that many Catholics who are not charismatic also practice this devotion, so the premise here isn't even sound.

    Objection 3

    “[...]and that it seemed to be used as a substitute for the Rosary.

    Here Mr. Dimond never substantiates this claim and only uses his opinion, possibly based on his personal experience. In my personal experience, the majority of those who pray the Divine Mercy are people who pray 5-15 decades of the Rosary, daily.  The more liberal Catholics that I know, who do not pray the Rosary, do not pray the Divine Mercy chaplet. Those who are disposed to Marian devotion via the Rosary are also disposed to practice the Divine Mercy devotion. But either way, the Diary does not support his claim, and thus one cannot blame it even if this were the fact, which it is not.

    Objection 4

    “the promotion of Communion in the hand”

    his objection is particularly ludicrous, as there is no example of self-communication (Communion in the hand) in the Diary. Bro. Dimond cites two passages and, not surprisingly, takes them out of context. Some investigation is needed here.

    When Christ said “I desired to rest in your hands, not only in your heart” [2] it was after St. Faustina had received – on the tongue from the hand of her priest – Holy Communion; a second Host had fallen into her hand, which she gave back to the priest. What should she have done, move her hand out of the way and allow Our Lord to drop to the floor as though It were something disgusting?

    Mr. Dimond also sites St. Faustina's words “...and the host came out of the tabernacle and came to rest in my hands and I, with joy, placed it back in the tabernacle. This was repeated a second time, and I did the same thing. Despite this, it happened a third time...” [3] What Mr. Dimond fails to mention is that this was not during Mass or any sort of Communion service, and that it may have in fact been nothing more than a vision. Christ was revealing to the Saint His displeasure with things that were going on in the House, and that He wished to leave. He was making a point. What point, you ask? The power of intercessory prayer. She loved Him, she wanted Him to stay, and He stayed, but she would have to intercede on behalf of her Community. She then undertook “three days of adoration by way of reparation.” How many of us are willing to do the same for erring brethren?

    Neither case establishes that either St. Faustina or the Diary support the practice of Communion in the hand.

    Objection 5

    “unnecessary praise heaped upon this sister.”[/b][font]

    Does Christ heap a bit of praise on her? Yes. But as I addressed in my previous article, [4] He did on St. Gertrude the Great as well, yet I've never heard any traditional Catholic suggesting that her visions were demonic.

    Objection 6

    “Sr. Faustina is told that God’s spark – which will prepare the world for His Second Coming – comes out of Poland! This has been interpreted to mean that God’s chosen person was John Paul II,”[font]

    This is the most ridiculous objection I think I've ever heard. In essence “People interpreted this prophesy to mean X, therefore the prophesy is false.” I have to wonder if this is even a serious objection. Should we also get rid of the Holy Bible because of the interpretation of Protestants? There is no reference to “the spark” (Christ never said “My spark”, by the way) being a Pope, or a bishop, or a priest...that it is even a person at all. For all we know, it could be an event that will help prepare the world.

    Objection 7

    “Divine Mercy Devotion is centered around mercy at a time when mankind was coming closer and closer to having filled up the cup of divine justice.”[font]

    This same objection was also raised by Fr. Scott, and I addressed it previously. [5] As an emphasis I will say this: look at the times. Are we seeing God's just judgment? The fact that God is being patient with all the evil in the world shows that we are living in an era of Mercy. Beside, it is good to remember that Mercy and Judgment go hand in hand. God never exercises judgment without also extending His mercy to those willing to listen.

    Objection 8

    “would God reveal a new devotion to be said on the beads of the Rosary shortly after His Mother came to Fatima to work a profound miracle to reveal, among other things, the necessity of the Rosary?”[font]

    The rosary beads make a chaplet used for praying the Rosary. Praying other prayers on it is not a sin, just as it is not a sin to pray the Rosary in a church where the Mass is said. I have prayed novenas to Saints and used the beads of the Rosary to help me keep track of where I was, but not as a replacement to the Rosary, and not in defiance of Our Lady's request for the daily Rosary. The objection cannot stand anyway as there are chaplets now made specifically for the Divine Mercy devotion (not all the beads of the Rosary are used when praying this chaplet). Why did Christ tell her to pray it on the beads of the Rosary? There was no Divine Mercy chaplet. Now there is.

    Besides, the Divine Mercy Chaplet is not the first devotion prayed on the Rosary that is distinct from the Rosary. The Chaplet of the Seven Sorrows of Mary is another devotion prayed on the Rosary; it was approved by the Pope in 1817 and even has been indulgenced by three subsequent popes. We could also mention the Rosary of St. Joseph, in which events from the life of St. Joseph are substituted for events in the life of our Lord and Lady. The use of other prayers on the rosary is not unknown in the history of the Church.

    Like the charges against the devotion by Fr. Scott, the accusations of Br. Dimond fall away under scrutiny and a proper reading of the Diary in context.



    REFERENCES:

    1. All quotes of Mr. Peter Dimond are taken from http://onetruecatholicfaith.com/Roman-Catholic-Articles.php?id=209&title=Divine+Mercy+Devotion+is+something+to+avoid&category=False+Apparitions&page=1

    2. Divine Mercy In My Soul, entry #160

    3 .ibid, entry #44

    4. http://www.unamsanctamcatholicam.com/component/content/article/82-spirtuality/222-defense-of-divine-mercy.html (for citation, see #11-14)

    5.http://www.unamsanctamcatholicam.com/component/content/article/82-spirtuality/222-defense-of-divine-mercy.html



    My conscience compels me to make this disclaimer lest God judges me partly culpable for the errors and heresy promoted on this forum... For the record I support neither Sedevacantism or the SSPX.  I do not define myself as either a traditionalist or Novus