Author Topic: Communion with the accursed  (Read 4219 times)

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Offline Stubborn

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Re: Communion with the accursed
« Reply #210 on: December 07, 2017, 11:17:37 AM »
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  • Stubborn, where are you? You wouldn't happen to be a coward, would you? You come across as so knowledgeable and confident when you post. Even Meg thought so. Please, don't let all your fans down. Just answer my questions so I can provide you with the teaching you desire.


    What "specific wording is required" in order to identify Catholic dogma? I might also ask, in which sources must this specific wording be present? Please, you have asked me to find a teaching that meets your specifications. You must now provide me with the specific information that I need.
    I already gave it to you so stop with the side tracking ignorance and just do as I asked.
    I say that it is licit to resist the Roman Pontiff by not doing what he orders and by impeding the execution of his will; it is not licit, however, to judge, punish or depose him, since these are acts proper to a superior." St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #211 on: December 07, 2017, 11:20:14 AM »
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  • I did not lie. What you said made no sense and IS gibberish, especially since I never said that Catholics are heretics.
    I am a Catholic and you say I am a heretic all the time, so what you just said is an outright lie - but what else can you do at this point *except* lie?
    I say that it is licit to resist the Roman Pontiff by not doing what he orders and by impeding the execution of his will; it is not licit, however, to judge, punish or depose him, since these are acts proper to a superior." St. Robert Bellarmine


    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #212 on: December 07, 2017, 11:30:13 AM »
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  • Exactly. All of his arguments are built on sand. He binds himself and others to dogma, but he has no idea (himself) the exact wording and sources that constitute a dogma (not to mention he can interpret teaching that he decides is dogma anyway he wants). Not a bad gig he's got there. In a nutshell "Stubborn has created his own religion in which HE is the Magisterium".
    The problem is, you sedes have no faith whatsoever, certainly not the Catholic faith. That's the actual problem in a nutshell.

    I say that it is licit to resist the Roman Pontiff by not doing what he orders and by impeding the execution of his will; it is not licit, however, to judge, punish or depose him, since these are acts proper to a superior." St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline An even Seven

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #213 on: December 07, 2017, 11:37:26 AM »
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  • I am a Catholic and you say I am a heretic all the time, so what you just said is an outright lie - but what else can you do at this point *except* lie?
    Let's see if you're Catholic.
    Vatican I: "Wherefore we teach and declare that, by divine ordinance, the Roman church possesses a pre-eminence of ordinary power over every other church, and that this jurisdictional power of the Roman pontiff is both episcopal and immediate. Both clergy and faithful, of whatever rite and dignity, both singly and collectively, are bound to submit to this power by the duty of hierarchical subordination and true obedience, and this not only in matters concerning faith and morals, but also in those which regard the discipline and government of the church throughout the world."

    You do not submit to this power of the man you call pope, by refusing his teachings on faith and morals and also rejecting how they govern the "church". You are not a Catholic.

    Vatican I: "In this way, by unity with the Roman pontiff in communion and in profession of the same faith , the church of Christ becomes one flock under one supreme shepherd."

    You deny that the Church of Christ is one flock by saying that there is another "church" within the Catholic Church. You deny the unity of faith by saying the Catholic Church can have more than one faith by having a heretic as its head. In effect, since this teaching of the Catholic Church is infallible, and since even you admit that its head is a heretic and you are subject to him, you are saying that you profess the same faith as the heretic.

    So let's review, you say you are not a heretic but the above is PROOF that you are.
    There is no difference between an intoxicated man and one full of his own opinion, and one is no more capable of reasoning than the other.----St. Francis de Sales

    Offline Bellator Dei

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #214 on: December 07, 2017, 11:44:51 AM »
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  • You deny that the Church of Christ is one flock by saying that there is another "church" within the Catholic Church. You deny the unity of faith by saying the Catholic Church can have more than one faith by having a heretic as its head. In effect, since this teaching of the Catholic Church is infallible, and since even you admit that its head is a heretic and you are subject to him, you are saying that you profess the same faith as the heretic.

    An excellent summary, Seven.

    Stubborn KNOWINGLY and WILLINGLY subjects himself to a man that he considers a heretic...absurd...complete insanity.      
    Please pray for all of the holy souls in purgatory.


    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #215 on: December 07, 2017, 11:48:29 AM »
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  • An excellent summary, Seven.

    Stubborn KNOWINGLY and WILLINGLY subjects himself to a man that he considers a heretic...absurd...complete insanity.      
    You have no understanding of the Catholic faith.
    You dogmatic sedes believe the pope is God - so you believe God is a heretic.
    The question is - since the pope is a heretic therefore not pope - does that mean you believe God is not God?
    I say that it is licit to resist the Roman Pontiff by not doing what he orders and by impeding the execution of his will; it is not licit, however, to judge, punish or depose him, since these are acts proper to a superior." St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #216 on: December 07, 2017, 11:55:20 AM »
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  • Let's see if you're Catholic.
    Vatican I: "Wherefore we teach and declare that, by divine ordinance, the Roman church possesses a pre-eminence of ordinary power over every other church, and that this jurisdictional power of the Roman pontiff is both episcopal and immediate. Both clergy and faithful, of whatever rite and dignity, both singly and collectively, are bound to submit to this power by the duty of hierarchical subordination and true obedience, and this not only in matters concerning faith and morals, but also in those which regard the discipline and government of the church throughout the world."

    You do not submit to this power of the man you call pope, by refusing his teachings on faith and morals and also rejecting how they govern the "church". You are not a Catholic.

    Vatican I: "In this way, by unity with the Roman pontiff in communion and in profession of the same faith , the church of Christ becomes one flock under one supreme shepherd."

    You deny that the Church of Christ is one flock by saying that there is another "church" within the Catholic Church. You deny the unity of faith by saying the Catholic Church can have more than one faith by having a heretic as its head. In effect, since this teaching of the Catholic Church is infallible, and since even you admit that its head is a heretic and you are subject to him, you are saying that you profess the same faith as the heretic.

    So let's review, you say you are not a heretic but the above is PROOF that you are.
    Sedes are really extremely ignorant, all but completely devoid of the Catholic faith. Unam Sanctam teaches we must be subject to the pope - not blindly submit to him. If that means we must disobey popes till the end of the world in order to not offend God, then that's what it means, what it does not mean is that he is not the pope.

    That is about as basic of Catholicity as it gets. The rest you can never hope to understand as a dogmatic sede.
    I say that it is licit to resist the Roman Pontiff by not doing what he orders and by impeding the execution of his will; it is not licit, however, to judge, punish or depose him, since these are acts proper to a superior." St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline GJC

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #217 on: December 07, 2017, 11:59:17 AM »
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  • You have no understanding of the Catholic faith.
    You dogmatic sedes believe the pope is God - so you believe God is a heretic.
    The question is - since the pope is a heretic therefore not pope - does that mean you believe God is not God?
    Sorry chief, but could rephrase that for me....?







    Offline Bellator Dei

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #218 on: December 07, 2017, 12:06:37 PM »
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  • The question is - since the pope is a heretic therefore not pope - does that mean you believe God is not God?

    No. 

    The question is - Why would you KNOWINGLY and WILLINGLY be the "good subject" of a heretic?    
    Please pray for all of the holy souls in purgatory.

    Offline An even Seven

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #219 on: December 07, 2017, 12:15:36 PM »
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  • You have no understanding of the Catholic faith.
    So next we can expect him to teach us the Catholic Faith right?
    Quote
    Stub: You dogmatic sedes believe the pope is God - so you believe God is a heretic.
    Nope, instead he pompously rips off another of his one-liners which make no sense and was uttered by no Sede ever and attributes incredible blasphemy to Catholics.
    Quote
    Stub: The question is - since the pope is a heretic therefore not pope - does that mean you believe God is not God?
    Here he makes an assumption based on his one-liner which he attributes to Sedes in order to make it seem like a good argument. Since his first point is not claimed by Sedes, his second makes no sense and he appears to blaspheme God himself. All because of this fake debate he's having in his own head. The Catholics present all this Catholic information to him and his response is "I won't accept Catholic teaching to vindicate Catholic belief and instead I will make up my own ideas of what it is I think I'm arguing about and proceed to straw man everyone to death".



    There is no difference between an intoxicated man and one full of his own opinion, and one is no more capable of reasoning than the other.----St. Francis de Sales

    Offline Lastdays

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #220 on: December 07, 2017, 12:19:49 PM »
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  • I already gave it to you so stop with the side tracking ignorance and just do as I asked.

    You gave me what you believed to be Catholic dogmas. I asked...

    "What specific wording is required in order to identify Catholic dogma?" I also asked, "In which sources must this specific wording be present?"

    Please, you have asked me to find a teaching that meets your specifications. You must now provide me with the specific information that I need.

    Catholic Encyclopedia – Heresy, 1913: The Pope himself, if notoriously guilty of heresy, would cease to be Pope because he would cease to be a member of the Church.


    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #221 on: December 07, 2017, 12:27:54 PM »
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  • Sorry chief, but could rephrase that for me....?


    In this post, AES says: "Being subject to the Pope IS being subject to God."

    Being as not even one sede ever corrected him, it is fair to say that all dogmatic sedes believe the pope is God - so if the pope is a heretic, they must believe God is a heretic.
    This is how screwed up they have allowed themselves to get. A lot of that comes from trying to vindicate sedeism using Catholic teachings.
    I say that it is licit to resist the Roman Pontiff by not doing what he orders and by impeding the execution of his will; it is not licit, however, to judge, punish or depose him, since these are acts proper to a superior." St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline An even Seven

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #222 on: December 07, 2017, 12:28:53 PM »
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  • Sedes are really extremely ignorant, all but completely devoid of the Catholic faith.
    Next we can expect that he will teach us the Catholic Faith and remove our ignorance right?
    Quote
    Stub: Unam Sanctam teaches we must be subject to the pope - not blindly submit to him.
    Wrong. Instead he adds words to the Dogma. The Dogma never mentions how or in what circumstances we are to submit to the Pope. His additions are from his lack of understanding of what it means to be subject to a Pope.

    Quote
    Stub: If that means we must disobey popes till the end of the world in order to not offend God, then that's what it means, what it does not mean is that he is not the pope.
    More straw man arguments. No Sede ever said the Pope is not the Pope, but when you know you lost the argument with a true opponent, you must argue with yourself in order to beat yourself. Anybody can say that another person or group believes anything and then proceed to destroy that argument as if it was actually made. The problem comes from whether or not that other person or group actually made it. No one says that the Pope is not the Pope but if Stubs keeps saying they do, he can win the argument by battling with himself and ignoring Catholic Teaching.


    There is no difference between an intoxicated man and one full of his own opinion, and one is no more capable of reasoning than the other.----St. Francis de Sales

    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #223 on: December 07, 2017, 12:31:53 PM »
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  • Nope, instead he pompously rips off another of his one-liners which make no sense and was uttered by no Sede ever and attributes incredible blasphemy to Catholics. aes

    In your defense, I don't blame you for such outright lies, that's all you have. Here are your own words: "Being subject to the Pope IS being subject to God".
    I say that it is licit to resist the Roman Pontiff by not doing what he orders and by impeding the execution of his will; it is not licit, however, to judge, punish or depose him, since these are acts proper to a superior." St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline Lastdays

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    Re: Communion with the accursed
    « Reply #224 on: December 07, 2017, 12:39:39 PM »
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  • In your defense, I don't blame you for such outright lies, that's all you have. Here are your own words: "Being subject to the Pope IS being subject to God".

    Stubborn, you gave me what you believed to be Catholic dogmas. I asked...

    "What specific wording is required in order to identify Catholic dogma?" I also asked, "In which sources must this specific wording be present?"

    Please, you have asked me to find a teaching that meets your specifications. You must now provide me with the specific information that I need. I'm still waiting. I'm not using any formatting. The least you can do is answer my questions.
    Catholic Encyclopedia – Heresy, 1913: The Pope himself, if notoriously guilty of heresy, would cease to be Pope because he would cease to be a member of the Church.

     

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