Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: Charismatic Renewal Defended  (Read 4935 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Charismatic Renewal Defended
« Reply #25 on: April 06, 2010, 10:39:29 AM »
"The form of worship that they utilize is the Ordinary Form of the Mass as well as the Liturgy of the Hours. Where you get the idea that these are "Pentecostal" or "Protestant" is beyond me (unless of course you're calling the Ordinary Form itself into question). "

well, this guy is not even close to understanding the grave faults of the NO....apparently, he does not have Pentecostals in Canada or even really understands what it is about....

reminds me of arguing, in vain, with a fellow that would accept much of what Stevus aopponent would say, their minds are closed in connecting the dots to the subversion before and esp, at VII and afterwards....like Bishop Williamson has stated, some people do not have the capacity for reasoning....they get to a point nad cannot go further....he has stated "you cannot talk to a person unhinged, you cannot open or swing a door that is laying on the floor..their minds are unhinged"

Charismatic Renewal Defended
« Reply #26 on: April 06, 2010, 12:07:47 PM »
Quote from: stevusmagnus
Quote
I believe it is the duty of the Magisterium (i.e. the Pope together with the bishops) to interpret the docuмents of Vatican II in light of Tradition, not some armchair theologian.  Also, the likes of Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI are much more highly educated than yourself. Not to mention that it is their duty, not yours, to pastor Christ's flock here on earth. If they say that the Charismatic Renewal is okay, so long as it remains faithful to Scripture, Tradition and the Magisterium and avoids the extremes and excesses that can befall any movement within the Church, then I think I'll trust them.

Secondly, the Mass prayed in English is perfectly valid, albeit the translation is faulty. It was approved by the bishops and by Rome. These are the people in charge of the Mass and other liturgies. While it is not recommended because it would not be a very pastoral move, they do have the right to change the Mass of their own particular Church.

Thirdly, the quotes from St. John of the Cross from that apologetics website are taken out of context. If you read the rest of the Ascent of Mount Carmel, and also the writings of Teresa of Avila, you'll see that St. John does admit the occurence of spiritual phenomena. What he discourages is seeking after the phenomena in themselves and building one's spiritual life around those phenomena. Teresa, on the other hand, seems to encourage seeking after the phenomena in her autobiography as well as the Interior Castle. However, she also admits that one needs to work very closely with a spiritual director. I'll admit that there can be a tendency among many charismatics to seek after the spiritual phenomena for their own sakes. But that is just one of the extremes that must be avoided. The Charismatic Renewal isn't all about speaking in tongues, resting in the spirit, prophecy, etc. It simply admits that these things can and do happen.


I just can't believe how stupid these people are.  Now who's an "arm chair" theologian?  Even a cursory reading of St. John of the Cross would suppress any such delusions, but nooo, they just keep right on going.  


Charismatic Renewal Defended
« Reply #27 on: April 06, 2010, 06:28:00 PM »
Apparently St. Pius X is a fan as well...

Quote
I am looking at the back of my St. Pius X holy card.
St. Pius X "inaugurated liturgical renewal and the restoration of frequent Communion from childhood...His overriding concern was to renew all things in Christ."

Each of us, regardless of where we are in our walk with Christ is called to holiness, to continued conversion. Rather than look at the Renewal as a movement, look instead at how the charisms, presuming they are real, might help your own walk with Christ.
It is not merely the past four popes who have given their blessing to the Charismatic Renewal, but the bishops as well who have given their ascent to the authenticity of the gifts, these special graces which come from God.
The OP asked the question, "What is the Charismatic Renewal?" I have limited my responses to the magisterial teaching of the Church as laid out in the Catechism of the Catholic Church as well as my own experience.
One of the most common songs during a Charismatic prayer meeting is "Seek first the Kingdom of God."
St. Pius X gave "great impetus to biblical studies and the codification of Canon Law." "From St. Pius X we learn again that 'the folly of the cross,' simplicity of life, and humility of heart are still the highest wisdom and the indispensable conditions of a perfect Christian life, for they are the very source of all apostolic fruitfulness."
In light of the teachings of St. Pius X, I second the challenge laid out in "One Bread, One Body" to read the entire NT during this Easter Season. See what scripture itself says about the charisms.

I did not seek membership in a particular movement. As already stated, I would not return the gifts I have received even if I could. I knew full well the objections I would face when I accepted these gifts, the main reason I immediately made an appointment with my pastor to describe my experience. Receipt of the gifts did not change the outcome of the crisis I faced. Knowledge of God dwelling within my heart and being with me during every moment of my life gave me a Peace I would not otherwise have experienced during a very trying time. He gave me the strength to forgive, to move forward along the path He had chosen for my life.

Charismatic Renewal Defended
« Reply #28 on: April 06, 2010, 06:51:40 PM »
  You can do nasty things and then ask why you get persecuted.  :fryingpan:
  There is prot church here which has secret weird members. Unlike other christians who have some defined freedoms, they always catch into some trouble and get smaller day by day. Their is a semi-dark and unadorned temple with a minister who says he is a jew by birth, His cloths are ridiculous and his sermons are as mysterious as his church. He speaks about The Holy Spirit as though He was a UFO or a secret agent that would come out of blue. Their title is 'England church' and now they allow dogs and homos.
Whatever they do, they say that The Spirit made them do that. If you ask them what they plan to do, they say that they are waiting for The Spirit to decide.
 I think it is very natural that the gov treats them like that.

Charismatic Renewal Defended
« Reply #29 on: April 06, 2010, 06:59:43 PM »