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Author Topic: Catholic refutations against this  (Read 8449 times)

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Offline WhiteWorkinClassScapegoat

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Catholic refutations against this
« on: November 25, 2024, 11:09:16 AM »
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  • Please post refutations against this:

    Romans 13 - Paul was a DECEIVER who perverted the teachings of Christ and demanded obedience to corrupt government

    https://banned.video/watch?id=6743575193c6449637856a00

    Offline Gray2023

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    Re: Catholic refutations against this
    « Reply #1 on: November 25, 2024, 12:54:52 PM »
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  • Why?

    This person said James was the half brother of Jesus.  He has basically reduced the bible to just the Gospels.

    This person giving the "Sermon", seems to be just as deceptive as the Paul he is describing.

    My husband says "Ultimately the books chosen for the bible and the doctrines that we believe come from the authority of the Church which Christ set up on Earth.
    Why we accept the epistles of St. Paul and not the Gospel of St Thomas is due to the authority of the Catholic Church that was established by Jesus Christ.  There is no rule of Faith established, if there is no authority to follow."

    This point was the whole reason my husband converted to Catholicism, it was a question of who did Jesus give authority to continue His Church.

    Governments are not protected by God to not err against the Church, only the Catholic Church seemed to have these protections until the 1960s.

    1 Corinthians: Chapter 13 "4 Charity is patient, is kind: charity envieth not, dealeth not perversely; is not puffed up; 5 Is not ambitious, seeketh not her own, is not provoked to anger, thinketh no evil;"


    Offline WhiteWorkinClassScapegoat

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    Re: Catholic refutations against this
    « Reply #2 on: November 25, 2024, 07:42:39 PM »
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  • Communists and other tyrants try to get Americans to give up their guns by quoting Romans 13. It's a misinterpretation. 

    Offline Philothea3

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    Re: Catholic refutations against this
    « Reply #3 on: November 28, 2024, 12:31:46 AM »
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  • Let every soul be subject to higher powers: for there is no power but from God: and those that are, are ordained of God. - Romans 13:1

    Let every soul, or every one, be subject The Jews were apt to think themselves not subject to temporal princes, as to taxes and lest Christians should misconstrue their Christian liberty, he here teacheth them that every one (even priests and bishops, says St. Chrysostom) must be subject and obedient to princes, even to heathens, as they were at that time, as to laws that regard the policy of the civil government, honouring them, obeying them, and their laws, as it is the will of God, because the power they act by is from God. So that to resist them, is to resist God. And every Christian must obey them even for conscience-sake. St. Chrysostom takes notice that St. Paul does not say that there is no prince but from God, but only that there is no power but from God, meaning no lawful power, and speaking of true and just laws. See hom. xxiii. (Witham)

    - George Leo Haydock

     
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    THY WILL BE DONE ON EARTH AS IT IS IN HEAVEN, so that we may love you with all our heart, by always having you in mind; with all our soul, by always longing for you; with all our mind, by determining to seek your glory in everything; and with all our strength, of body and soul... 
    - St Francis de Assisi

    Offline Philothea3

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    Re: Catholic refutations against this
    « Reply #4 on: November 28, 2024, 12:35:47 AM »
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  • Most rightly, Paul warns against anyone who is puffed up with pride by the fact that he has been called by his Lord into freedom and become a Christian, and therefore thinks that he does not have to keep the status given to him in the course of this life or submit to the higher powers to whom the government of temporal things has been confided for a time. For because we are made of soul and body and as long as we are in this life we make use of temporal things as a means of living this life, it is fitting that, as far as this life is concerned, we be subject to the authorities, i.e., to the people who with some recognition administer human affairs. But as far as the spiritual side is concerned, in which we believe in God and are called into his kingdom, it is not right for us to be subject to any man who seeks to overturn in us the very thing which God has been pleased to grant us so that we might obtain eternal life. So if anyone thinks that because he is a Christian he does not have to pay taxes or tribute nor show the proper respect to the authorities who take care of these things, he is in very great error. Likewise, if anyone thinks that he ought to submit to the point where he accepts that someone who is his superior in temporal affairs should have authority even over his faith, he falls into an even greater error. But the balance which the Lord himself prescribed is to be maintained: “Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s but unto God the things which are God’s.” For although we are called into that kingdom where there will be no power of this world, nevertheless, while we are on the way there and until we have reached that state where every principality and power will be destroyed, let us put up with our condition for the sake of human affairs, doing nothing falsely and in this very thing obeying God, who commands us to do it, rather than men.

    - Augustine of Hippo

    So OP, if you are looking for refutation for the fact St Paul insisted we need to obey government on non religious matters, there's none. But the refutation is, St Paul is no liar, but true witness of Our Lords's teaching.
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    THY WILL BE DONE ON EARTH AS IT IS IN HEAVEN, so that we may love you with all our heart, by always having you in mind; with all our soul, by always longing for you; with all our mind, by determining to seek your glory in everything; and with all our strength, of body and soul... 
    - St Francis de Assisi


    Offline WhiteWorkinClassScapegoat

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    Re: Catholic refutations against this
    « Reply #5 on: November 29, 2024, 07:24:13 AM »
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  • Now no blacksmith could be found in all the land of Israel, for the Philistines said, "Otherwise the Hebrews will make swords or spears." -1 Samuel 13:19

    Offline Godefroy

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    Re: Catholic refutations against this
    « Reply #6 on: November 29, 2024, 07:38:10 AM »
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  • Now no blacksmith could be found in all the land of Israel, for the Philistines said, "Otherwise the Hebrews will make swords or spears." -1 Samuel 13:19
    I doubt one could be found in Israel today. Blacksmithing seems like very hard work for a nation of lawyers, accountants and psychiatrists

    Offline Jaynek

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    Re: Catholic refutations against this
    « Reply #7 on: November 29, 2024, 08:33:48 AM »
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  • I doubt one could be found in Israel today. Blacksmithing seems like very hard work for a nation of lawyers, accountants and psychiatrists
    The Jєωιѕн lawyers, accountants and psychiatrists are in the US and other Western countries.  Israel is a nation of soldiers.  There is compulsory active military service starting at 18 usually followed by transfer to the reserves. The military budget is in the billions.  And there is no good moral understanding of when fighting is justified like we have in Catholicism.  Do not underestimate their potential for violence.  This has not changed since the Philistines were worrying about it.


    Offline WhiteWorkinClassScapegoat

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    Re: Catholic refutations against this
    « Reply #8 on: November 29, 2024, 09:01:20 AM »
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  •   Israel [...] a nation of lawyers, accountants and psychiatrists
    and child-traffickers, organ-traffickers and sex-slave traders of white young women (mostly from destitute areas of Ukraine, Russia and eastern Europe)