Author Topic: Catholic Bishop Calls for Womens Ordination (Read 5486 times)

stevusmagnus · « **Reply #60 on:** May 06, 2011, 10:24:38 AM »

Quote from: Telesphorus

A good way to cut through the sophistic nonsense is to ask how you could explain the "recognize but disobey" position to Protestants.

You start telling them about the ecclesiastical authorities and how they preserve the unity of the Church but then the Protestants will want to know why there is no genuine submission to those authorities.

The non-Catholic isn't going to buy into the idea that Stevus and the SSPX follow the Popes and the Bishops.

You give them the example of St. Athanasius and tell them to read the story and point them to a book. It would be a good teaching lesson on infalliblity and its limits. Also you point out to them that the PCED said it is not a sin to assist at their Masses and they fulfill the Sunday obligation. You also point out to them that there is a difference in the fact that the SSPX is a society with an irregular canonical situation, and individuals in the Society or who assist at their Masses who are Catholics inside the Church.

You also point out the difference between Prot "reformers" like Luther who rejected 1500 years of Tradition and Traditionalists who support 2,000 years of Tradition.

You give them "The Great Facade" to read.

Telesphorus · « **Reply #61 on:** May 06, 2011, 05:22:52 PM »

Quote from: stevusmagnus

You give them the example of St. Athanasius and tell them to read the story and point them to a book.

The Romans deposed Liberius when they believed he had become a heretic. Liberius wasn't an Arian. But Benedict XVI is a modernist.

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It would be a good teaching lesson on infalliblity and its limits.

As Catholics we're bound to accept the magisterium of the Popes. Now how do I explain to a Protestant that I accept the Pope but not his magisterium?

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Also you point out to them that the PCED said it is not a sin to assist at their Masses and they fulfill the Sunday obligation.

And yet the Pope says that the SSPX priests have no ministry in the Catholic Church. So they are priests acting outside the Pope's authority, presuming Benedict XVI is Pope.

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You also point out to them that there is a difference in the fact that the SSPX is a society with an irregular canonical situation, and individuals in the Society or who assist at their Masses who are Catholics inside the Church.

Sure I'll point out they are Catholics only they reject the magisterium of the Popes while calling them true Popes.

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You also point out the difference between Prot "reformers" like Luther who rejected 1500 years of Tradition and Traditionalists who support 2,000 years of Tradition.

Yes, traditionalists support 2000 years of Tradition, but the current Pope signed the joint declaration on justification (which was approved by John Paul II. So was the Pope wrong in the 1500s or is the Pope wrong now? If Luther was wrong then then he's wrong now, if the Pope doesn't say Luther was wrong then he's departed from the Catholic Faith.

TKGS · « **Reply #62 on:** May 06, 2011, 06:57:32 PM »

Quote from: Telesphorus

Yes, traditionalists support 2000 years of Tradition, but the current Pope signed the joint declaration on justification (which was approved by John Paul II. So was the Pope wrong in the 1500s or is the Pope wrong now? If Luther was wrong then then he's wrong now, if the Pope doesn't say Luther was wrong then he's departed from the Catholic Faith.

Speaking of Martin Luther, is everyone getting excited about 31 October 2017?

It's coming fast! Think of all the celebrations that are being planned at this moment in Rome and in dioceses all around the world!

I wonder if the Catholic bishop of Wittenburg will re-enact the big event.

gladius_veritatis · « **Reply #63 on:** May 06, 2011, 07:31:17 PM »

Well, ML was, in JP2's words (utter from the pulpit of a Lutheran church), a "profoundly religious man..."

JPaul · « **Reply #64 on:** May 08, 2011, 08:01:28 PM »

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Yes, traditionalists support 2000 years of Tradition, but the current Pope signed the joint declaration on justification (which was approved by John Paul II. So was the Pope wrong in the 1500s or is the Pope wrong now? If Luther was wrong then then he's wrong now, if the Pope doesn't say Luther was wrong then he's departed from the Catholic Faith.

The Pope is obviously wrong now. If he believes that Luther did err and leave the Church, then he has departed from the Catholic Faith in that he rejects the decisions of the Church and his predecessors.

The problem with modern man is that he will not submit to God and His Church.

JMJ