Author Topic: Bp. Williamson's Christmas Miracle? (Read 7396 times)

Catholic Knight · « **Reply #20 on:** December 26, 2023, 08:55:55 AM »

Quote from: Plenus Venter on December 25, 2023, 07:57:27 PM

Yes, it's pretty straight forward, RM.
He was elected by the Cardinals at the last conclave, and has been held to be Pope by the Catholic world ever since and has not been convicted of heresy by the Church nor declared not to be Pope.
Therefore, we presume that he is Pope, in spite of his non-Catholic behaviour, in spite of all the doubts.
This presumption in favour of validity which Bishop Williamson obviously adheres to, is exactly the same position as Archbishop Lefebvre, and is in no way an endorsement of the sedevacantist position, quite the contrary.

The presumption in favour of validity holds when there is no reasonable evidence to the contrary. However, there is enough evidence in the case of Jorge Bergoglio to establish at least a well-founded positive and probable doubt, and this on more than one front (e.g., public manifest formal heresy, invalid election). As such, St. Robert Bellarmine's teaching comes to mind, that is, "papa dubius, papa nullus".

Based on what Bishop Williamson said in the above sermon, he should be concluding that Jorge Bergoglio is a doubtful pope and that therefore we do not owe him obedience.

Marulus Fidelis · « **Reply #21 on:** December 26, 2023, 09:03:49 AM »

Quote from: Plenus Venter on December 25, 2023, 09:20:13 PM

the guide that was given us in Archbishop Lefebvre

Someone should do a compilation of titles and adjectives given to Abp. Lefebvre by his followers, we might arrive at a veritable litany fitting for a saintly pope.

Quote

Now this I say, that every one of you saith: I indeed am of Paul; and I am of Apollo; and I am of Cephas; and I of Christ. Is Christ divided? Was Paul then crucified for you? or were you baptized in the name of Paul? (1 Cor 1:12-13)

Lefebvre isn't the guide of faith and principle of unity given to you by God, that would be the Pope. YOU chose Lefebvre, YOU decided he was a saint, YOU decided to trust him with your soul. One could choose Abp. Thuc to be his light and saviour just as well as you chose Abp. Lefebvre and you would both be wrong in putting your trust in man.

The number one reason people don't have the true faith today is because they put their entire trust in man, not God.

Marulus Fidelis · « **Reply #22 on:** December 26, 2023, 09:05:36 AM »

Quote from: Catholic Knight on December 26, 2023, 08:55:55 AM

St. Robert Bellarmine's teaching comes to mind, that is, "papa dubius, papa nullus".

What I'm hearing is that the Quran-kisser's and Mass-wrecker's papacies aren't even doubtful.

Catholic Knight · « **Reply #23 on:** December 26, 2023, 09:09:26 AM »

Quote from: Centroamerica on December 25, 2023, 08:10:55 PM

The real question is why would anyone want to, as a lay Catholic, fight aggressively to support the idea that Bergoglio is your spiritual leader and the successor of St. Peter.

It is because many in the so-called Resistance are under the false impression that Archbishop Lefebvre taught some universal principle that a putative pope is always to be accepted as a true pope. However, the Archbishop taught no such thing. Rather, he taught that whether a putative pope is truly pope is based on the evidence. See here.

Plenus Venter · « **Reply #24 on:** December 26, 2023, 09:18:33 PM »

Quote from: Centroamerica on December 26, 2023, 05:42:47 AM

Of course, your third option is to murder your ego and investigate for yourself without the pride of being right.

Sound advice, CA. I'm glad we agree on something. :-)

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Author Topic: Bp. Williamson's Christmas Miracle? (Read 7396 times)

Catholic Knight

Re: Bp. Williamson's Christmas Miracle?

Marulus Fidelis

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Marulus Fidelis

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Catholic Knight

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Plenus Venter

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