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Author Topic: Biblical Commission Of 1909  (Read 12598 times)

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Offline SoldierOfChrist

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Biblical Commission Of 1909
« Reply #60 on: December 15, 2013, 04:02:09 PM »
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  • Quote from: icterus
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    It would appear that the zionists bluffed and the Pontifical Commission folded.


    Well, that's insane.  

    However, as long as trads are honest and consistent enough to judge the 1909 decree heretical, I feel like the point of the thread is made.  I just worked my way through the awful and long-winded and essentially un-edited (or edited by a ten-year-old) creation book published by Kolbe and written by Warkulwiz.  In it, he goes on about 1909 as if it assists their case.  As long as that myth is put to rest, I figure the thread has done its job.

    So, the modernist takeover is rolled back to 1908....


    Please don't put words in my mouth.  This strawman tendancy of your's is very discouraging for the hopes of future arguments.

    As long as Icterus keeps intentionally bearing false witness against his neighbors, then my point is made, that he is a willfull, public sinner.  [I'm not actually saying that, but it's just as fair as your above statement.]

    Offline icterus

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    « Reply #61 on: December 15, 2013, 04:10:38 PM »
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    So, the modernist takeover is rolled back to 1908....


    Ok, then how about "The capitulation to Zionists is rolled back to 1908".

     :smoke-pot:


    Offline SoldierOfChrist

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    « Reply #62 on: December 15, 2013, 04:16:20 PM »
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  • Icterus, since you've now returned to the table, how about a comment on all of the demostrated hoaxes of evidence regarding man's "evolution" from ape to man?  If you've forgotten the link, here it is Evidence for man's ascendance from monkeys

    Offline icterus

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    « Reply #63 on: December 15, 2013, 04:21:40 PM »
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  • Yes, I'll be glad to do that.  I ask your patience.  We are hosting clerics for dinner tonite, and I have to keep the new dog isolated from clean cassocks.  

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    « Reply #64 on: December 16, 2013, 05:40:36 AM »
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    Quote from: SoldierOfChrist
    Quote from: Neil Obstat
    .

    When the Biblical Commission of 1909 gave halting permission for exegetes to discuss the age of the earth and the real duration of the seven days of Creation recounted in Genesis, the commissioners were unaware of the fact that the so-called scientific literature at the time was hypothesizing entirely on cooked data.  If they had known the truth, that is, if the MASK had been adequately removed from Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ as previous popes had announced doing (but they nonetheless were not quite capable of unmasking this particular aspect) then they would never have backed off the way they did.  

    We could have had a very different twentieth century, IOW.

    But apparently it was to be given to the world that this Big Lie would not be exposed for the lie that it is.  

    But now, it has been exposed.  Only now, too many scientists are rather committed to a system that presumes the fables are reliable.  They're afraid of losing their 'credibility' -- which translates to honor bestowed by other men.  You know, like getting elected "man of the year" and that sort of thing.

    It has been exposed and perhaps, just maybe, the new movie, The Principle, will have some chapter on the exposure.  If so, it's going to be a little sad that the Biblical Commission of 1909 didn't get a chance to see The Principle before they cut loose with their ANSWERS to Questions.  But if they HAD seen the movie, it would have been a miracle, because there was no such thing as 'movies' like this in 1909.  

    If the Commission had seen this movie, they would have thought that they had seen a phantasm or a dream, because motion pictures in 1909 had no synchronized sound.


    .


    It would appear that the zionists bluffed and the Pontifical Commission folded.  They are crafty little devils.  Same can be said of the Church backing off of the copernican theory, after being given evidence which could support either geocentrism or heliocentrism; not exclusively heliocentrism which was posited to them at the time that they began to back off.

    That being said, I do not think that it is right to demonize people like [jaundice], for being fooled by the same slight of hand, which caused the Church to back off, but never to reverse its stance on geocentrism and creation.  



    It seems to me you're being far too kind. If jaundice were really interested in learning, he would pay attention.  But he thinks he knows it all because he's already 'been there' and doesn't need to be confused by any facts.  

    Nor does he care what you have to offer and it's a waste of time for you to show him what he's missing because he's not going to look at it -- or think about it.  

    That is called "pertinacious impudence."  And there is no virtue in it.


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    The problem, as I see it, is that people like [jaundice] find it difficult to accept the overwhelming evidence that a conspiracy of immense proportion is under way.



    Rather, what such ilk are all invested in, is cohabiting with the devil.  

    They don't want to know the truth.  

    These people were the ones who openly left the Church in ages past when the Supreme Pontiff defined dogma and condemned error, because in order to believe what was defined they would have to relinquish their tenacious grasp on sin.  

    Those who had a problem with impurity, for example, rebelled at the definition of the Immaculate Conception in 1854.  And again, those who wanted birth control, divorce and same-sex marriage couldn't take it when the Assumption of Our Lady body and soul was defined in 1950.  

    It is for no small reason that Our Lady told Jacinta of Fatima that "more souls go to hell for sins of the flesh than for any other reason."


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    He said that what causes him difficulty in believing in cօռspιʀαcιҽs, is that ultimately, they would require everyone to be involved in them, and he does not see that as a possibility.  



    Another smoke screen.  They're not 'cօռspιʀαcιҽs' when they are factual.  The demigods Charlie are worshipped in the halls of academia but nobody is willing to admit it as such, because they're either liars or they have willfully blinded themselves to the truth, just as the Jews in the day of Our Lord when they did not recognize the time of their visitation.  

    Those with eyes to see, let them see.
    Those with ears to hear, let them hear.
    Those who blind themselves or plug their ears:  let them be anathema.

    Take a look at the Virgin Mary in the Last Judgment fresco in the Sistine Chapel.  She looks with stark horror at the fate of the damned, those she tried to warn, those she so desired could be saved, but those who would not see and those who would not hear, lest they be healed and saved from hell.  

    That's the way it is.


    Quote
    However, just as he was tricked by the zionists into accepting their "data" and "evidence", without looking into it to see if it truly was credible, the Church was also fooled into backing off, and I would say that many real scientists have never questioned the veritability [the word is "veracity"] of the foundational evidence required to even propose evolution as a likely possibility.  



    The whole thing is built on myth and the non-scientific dreams of hobbyists.


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    With regards to heliocentrism, the same people never analysed the theory in enough detail to recognize the metaphysical (not scientific) choices which were made necessarily, in order to further [their] theorization.  I think that [jaundice] is a real Catholic, who has been fooled by very crafty zionists.  



    Or, jaundice could be a fraud who has merely succeeded in fooling you.


    Quote
    Far from requiring everyone to be "in on it", this conspiracy required nothing more than for individuals of unquestionable intellect and training, to be fooled into believing the reality [make that FANTASY] which was presented to them, without questioning the origin of the data, and if they did question it, to keep their mouths shut in order to avoid certain professional failure, brought on by the ostracization of the mob of believers in the new modernistic belief system.  [jaundice] is one of those who still believes and I do not fault him for it.  I too, once believed in evolution and heliocentrism.  I once thought that the novus ordo was "regular" church, and that traditionalism was a form of protestantism, ie not Catholic.  I learned the Truth by seeking it.  



    As Shakespeare said, "Therein lies the rub."

    The difference between you and jaundice is,  you sought the truth, and when someone presented to you helpful information, you did not ignore it.

    You were not willfully blind and deliberately deaf.


    Quote
    That is what [jaundice] is doing.  And I know beyond the shadow of a doubt, that if he continues to seek and to pray, that the Holy Ghost will lead him towards Truth.

    Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion

    Keep in mind that the Protocols were recorded in the late 19th century, meaning that they were either written by prophetic frauds who knew the future of what the next 100 years would hold for mankind, or they are an authentic blueprint of what a clandestine group of evil, God-hating geniuses, planned to do in the next 100 years, and then did it.



    The willfully blind and deliberately deaf will close their eyes and stop their ears and they can go to hell.  (Which is what it means to be anathema.)


    Quote
    Quote from: The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion
    Protocol II

    1. It is indispensable for our purpose that wars, so far as possible, should not result in territorial gains: war will thus be brought on to the economic ground, where the nations will not fail to perceive in the assistance we give the strength of our predominance, and this state of things will put both sides at the mercy of our international agentur; which possesses millions of eyes ever on the watch and unhampered by any limitations whatsoever. Our international rights will then wipe out national rights, in the proper sense of right, and will rule the nations precisely as the civil law of States rules the relations of their subjects among themselves.

    2. The administrators, whom we shall choose from among the public, with strict regard to their capacities for servile obedience, will not be persons trained in the arts of government, and will therefore easily become pawns in our game in the hands of men of learning and genius who will be their advisers, specialists bred and reared from early childhood to rule the affairs of the whole world. As is well known to you, these specialists of ours have been drawing to fit them for rule the information they need from our political plans from the lessons of history, from observations made of the events of every moment as it passes. The goyim are not guided by practical use of unprejudiced historical observation, but by theoretical routine without any critical regard for consequent results. We need not, therefore, take any account of them - let them amuse themselves until the hour strikes, or live on hopes of new forms of enterprising pastime, or on the memories of all they have enjoyed. For them let that play the principal part which we have persuaded them to accept as the dictates of science (theory). It is with this object in view that we are constantly, by means of our press, arousing a blind confidence in these theories. The intellectuals of the goyim will puff themselves up with their knowledge and without any logical verification of them will put into effect all the information available from science, which our agentur specialists have cunningly pieced together for the purpose of educating their minds in the direction we want.



    They didn't have to specify the fact that their key principle would be the tacit worship of their demigods Charlie.  They knew that, but they dared not put it down in writing.  It was a spoken secret, and it would not be told, lest the one who would speak it would suddenly be found to be mysteriously missing in action -- before he could speak -- a lot like Andrew Breitbart was and Steve Bridges.  


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    DESTRUCTIVE EDUCATION

    3. Do not suppose for a moment that these statements are empty words: think carefully of the successes we arranged for Darwinism, Marxism, Nietzsche-ism.



    Quiz question:  Who was it again, who arranged Darwinism, which is founded squarely on the worship of the demigods Charlie?


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    To us Jews,



    Oh, right.  The Jews.  But you'll NEVER become a Freemason if you admit that you believe that.  They won't even let you into the FIRST LEVEL for an ice cream social.  And of THAT I can assure you, from personal experience.  Been there.


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    ..at any rate, it should be plain to see what a disintegrating importance these directives have had upon the minds of the goyim.

    4. It is indispensable for us to take account of the thoughts, characters, tendencies of the nations in order to avoid making slips in the political and in the direction of administrative affairs. The triumph of our system of which the component parts of the machinery may be variously disposed according to the temperament of the peoples met on our way, will fail of success if the practical application of it be not based upon a summing up of the lessons of the past in the light of the present.

    5. In the hands of the States of to-day there is a great force that creates the movement of thought in the people, and that is the Press.



    Notice there isn't one sentence of this that would appear in any reputable book or report or official docuмent of any credible organization -- but perhaps something would fit in to an ExSPX interoffice memo -- that is, one that would be burned once it is received and read.  


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    The part played by the Press is to keep pointing our requirements supposed to be indispensable, to give voice to the complaints of the people, to express and to create discontent. It is in the Press that the triumph of freedom of speech finds its incarnation. But the goyim States have not known how to make use of this force; and it has fallen into our hands. Through the Press we have gained the power to influence while remaining ourselves in the shade; thanks to the Press we have got the gold in our hands, notwithstanding that we have had to gather it out of the oceans of blood and tears. But it has paid us, though we have sacrificed many of our people. Each victim on our side is worth in the sight of God a thousand goyim.


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    But it certainly looks like you skipped over the more important material.  Now, you don't have to warn me that jaundice is going to ignore it, as usual, because I know that he has a vested interest in not looking at the facts because if he were to look at them and think about them, it would be incuмbent upon him to act accordingly, which he WILL NOT DO, and therefore, he will not look at them:


    Quote from: Neil Obstat
    .

    The history of the bad hypothesis of evolution (it's not a theory) is rife with the self-contradictions and exposure of falsehood that you have there, S'C.  

    One after the other, as their contrived fables were presented to the world, they became shown for what they were:  fakes.  But that made no difference when the Freemasonic press and public opinion funded by atheists kept alive the fable fantasy that so-called evolution was still a viable "theory" (it's not a theory).

    It's a very embarrassing history, which explains why supporters of the bad hypothesis of 'evolution' are ashamed to talk about it, like jaundice, for example.  

    No sooner was one "Piltdown man" shown to be a phony and another "Java man" rose up to take his place.  The nefarious heretic Pierre Teilhard de Chardin ran around the world seeking pig's teeth to file down and stain with shoe polish so that the Freemasonic-Yid press could parade the news from the International Date Line to Greenwich meridian.  

    And so it was in America, from sea to shining sea.

    Meanwhile, all of the fundamental THEORY upon which those fables relied was hidden and overlooked.  What THEORY was that?  

    Well, what THEORY was it, anyway, that said that the age of the cosmos is measured not in thousands of years but in millions or billions or whatever?  

    What THEORY was it that said that the age of the earth is determined by the "observable" evidence?  

    What THEORY was it that said that radiometric dating of fossils is reliable because the 'established' age of surrounding rock formations and alluvial deposits was 'known'?

    WHOSE THEORY was it that said we can know the age of sedimentary rocks, gneiss, feldspar, carborundum, shale, red limestone, clay, granite, metamorphic rock, conglomerate, earthquake faults, and dinosaur bones merely by inspection and consultation of revered volumes of forgotten lore?  

    Don't ask jaundice, because he's never heard of the guy, and he's too yellow to bother finding out.


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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    « Reply #65 on: December 16, 2013, 05:49:03 AM »
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  • .


    As Shakespeare said, "Therein lies the rub."

    The difference between you and jaundice is,  you sought the truth, and when someone presented to you helpful information, you did not ignore it.

    You were not willfully blind and deliberately deaf.  


    And when you told someone that you would read some material, or watch a video or check out a website, you would do it, unlike jaundice, who is FAR MORE LIKELY to be this type of troll, fake and liar who goes, "LET'S NOT AND SAY WE DID."  


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    Offline icterus

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    « Reply #66 on: December 16, 2013, 08:58:37 AM »
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  • Neil wrote:

    Quote
    Oh, right.  The Jews.  But you'll NEVER become a Freemason if you admit that you believe that.  They won't even let you into the FIRST LEVEL for an ice cream social.  And of THAT I can assure you, from personal experience.  Been there.


    Neil, you're going on ignore.  I think most likely you are not responsible for what you're typing.  

    In addition, you seem to be hopelessly attached to an idea that is even crazier than most of the others floating around here, that all of modern geology was penned by one untrained man, and everyone who has come after has not done any actual work, but just built on an edifice so shoddy that you, one lone untrained man, can pull it all down.

    That's so stupid it does not deserve any time, research, or response.  I have serious criticisms for a lot of the ideas and personalities here, but you are so far beyond the pale that I am not going to dignify your craziness with any responses.  

    Bona fortuna, mate.  I think you'll need it.  


    Offline icterus

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    « Reply #67 on: December 16, 2013, 10:07:59 AM »
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    Chardin and the Phony Ape-Men
    Adapted from The Death of Evolution by Wallace Johnson
    Evolution leads logically to polygenism -- that is, a belief, not in one physically perfect first man (Adam), but in groups of brutish first men and women mutating from parents who were not human.


    Two claims.  

    1. Evolution leads logically to polygenism

    Yes, apparently, but Pius XII ruled on this already, separating out the one event, human genesis, from the rest of the issue of evolution.  

    2. not in one physically perfect first man (Adam), but in groups of brutish first men and women mutating from parents who were not human.

    No.  The insertion of 'brutish' here is not helpful.  Now we have to parse this out.  
    What Pius XII allowed was the theology of 'special transformism' which is the idea that God ensouled an existing body (or ensouled a newly conceived baby) which was physically identical in characteristics and genome to its parents or contemporaries.  I.E., if this scenario which Pius allowed researched is true, then Adam looked identical to Adam's parents or brothers, had the same genome, etc.  
    Special transformism says that in the reception of a soul, the preternatural gifts were given to Adam.
     
    Nothing here about 'brutish' or 'mutating'.  That's a childish musunderstanding.


     
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    Polygenism plays havoc with the central Christian dogma of Original Sin.


    Pius XII said it was not apparent how the two could be reconciled.  'Plays havoc' is childish scare-language, not academic, and reminds us once again that this is not an academic book.  

    Quote
    And lately under the influence of Teilhard de Chardin's (1881-1955) evolutionary theology, all the Catholic dogmas are being turned upside-down. If we can demonstrate that the ape-men never existed, then the whole case for evolution, polygenism and Teilhardianism collapses.


    No, all Catholic dogmas are not being turned upside down.  In addition to being fatally imprecise, this is just silly.  NO one is talking about the Trinity, for example.  


    Quote
    The average person now believes that there were strange creatures in prehistoric times, not quite men and not wholly animal. We are being told, in the name of science, that these ape-men existed, and, that we came from them.



    ..and for very good reason the average person believes what has been amply demonstrated.  Fish-amphibian transitions existed.  Reptile-mammal transitions existed.  The fossil record is not a 19th century curiosity.  Moving on...

    Quote
    If this theory is wrong, then our era is really the darkest age of all. But right or wrong, the theory is successful. So much so that Adam and Eve are laughed out of court. We are witnessing the triumph of a very diabolical game, and the aim of the game is to get rid of God and undermine the veracity of the Bible.


    Or, the aim of the game is discover human origins, defend those assertions against your peers, and win awards, get tenure, and gain money and respect.  

    Quote
    There have been various "family trees of man" put forward for our new belief system, disagreeing and conflicting with one another. But several members of the "family" have been shown to be phony.


    Ok, finally to the point.  So, there are two problems in these sentences that are critical to this topic.

    1.In the early days of any discipline, the rough outline of a theory is determined.  It's like heliocentrism.  The first decades of the discoveries were full of various models, all conflicting.  Over time, observation disproves most of them, and over time, one emerged as the best fit for the data.

    Any discovery works like this.  If you go the early history of a field, you find exactly that - many divergent theories being winnowed by the process into few and then ultimately, one.  This is how human research works.  Words like 'brainstorming' are applicable to the process.  If anyone has ever been part of any group process, you know how the meetings go.  The first ones are all over the map, as discussion and research progress, the impractical falls away and the practical is left.  

    Johnson's critique of science is dishonest in the extreme.  I'm sure that, at a meeting with his publishers, he made a proposal for a book, and this proposal was debated and the concept refined.  If I wanted to criticize him and had the minutes I could say "Many different schemes for this book were put forward - all disagreeing and conflicting with each other!".  He, being dim, would look at me and say "You idiot, that's how new ideas work!" and I'd say "Yeeeees.  Exactly."

    If people are trying to determine the history of something, proposing different versions and then looking for confirmation of the those versions is exactly how it works.  There is no other way for it to work.  This critique is so unbelievably stupid...but again, this is not a scholarly book.  It's a screed that appeals only to the choir of true believers.

    2.The last date in this article is 1937, and the 'bad guy' is Teilhard de Chardin.

      Do you know who cares about Teilhard?  Catholics and New Agers.  That's it.

      No one rests anything on any discoveries of Teilhard.  In the heady days of the early 20th century, there was lots of excitement about finding proto-humans.  Telihard was a crank.  So?  It has been a long, long time since those days, and of course Johnson is not dealing with anything that happened after 1937.  He's gone for only the lowest-hanging fruit, because lampooning a few cranks from early in the last century is easy.

    I'd like to see him deal with the endogenous retrovirus signatures in primate lines.  Or in the geographic dispersion of trichromic vision in primates.  Or any of a hundred other lines of reasoning linking the human ancestors with chimp and bonobo ancestors.  

    Look, it's a simple thing for anyone to do:

    Examine your sources.  Do they deal only with the scientific past?  Like Neil the crazy crank here, doe he deal only with 19th century figures as if all science was done in the past?  Does he ignore what is going on now?  Is there discussion with and of legitimate experts in the current field?  

    There are, in fact, pretty darn legitimate and technical critiques of Darwinism operating today...but they are based on an Old Earth (because that is established.  Solidly.) and they are based upon actual research, not fantasies.  I love them.  Some of them are even sort of convincing.  Sadly, Catholics are being completely left out of the party.  It's too bad.  


    Offline SJB

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    « Reply #68 on: December 16, 2013, 10:58:08 AM »
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  • Quote from: Icterus
    No, all Catholic dogmas are not being turned upside down.  In addition to being fatally imprecise, this is just silly.  NO one is talking about the Trinity, for example.  


    When one dogma is "overturned," it matters little which ones remain untouched.
    It would be comparatively easy for us to be holy if only we could always see the character of our neighbours either in soft shade or with the kindly deceits of moonlight upon them. Of course, we are not to grow blind to evil

    Offline SJB

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    « Reply #69 on: December 16, 2013, 11:01:31 AM »
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  • Quote from: Icterus
    Any discovery works like this.  If you go the early history of a field, you find exactly that - many divergent theories being winnowed by the process into few and then ultimately, one.  This is how human research works.  Words like 'brainstorming' are applicable to the process.  If anyone has ever been part of any group process, you know how the meetings go.  The first ones are all over the map, as discussion and research progress, the impractical falls away and the practical is left.  


    Not all conclusions are actually factual however. Your faith in man is unshakable.
    It would be comparatively easy for us to be holy if only we could always see the character of our neighbours either in soft shade or with the kindly deceits of moonlight upon them. Of course, we are not to grow blind to evil

    Offline icterus

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    « Reply #70 on: December 16, 2013, 11:03:56 AM »
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  • SJB wrote:

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    Not all conclusions are actually factual however. Your faith in man is unshakable.


    Non sequitur...and silly.  I'm pointing out that the criticism offered by Johnson is nonsensical.  

    Do you disagree?  

    If so, why?

    If not, then be a man and say you agree and quit calling down doom over every single thing I post.  You come off like a nutcase, when I suspect you are not.



    Offline icterus

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    « Reply #71 on: December 16, 2013, 11:08:41 AM »
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  • Quote
    When one dogma is "overturned," it matters little which ones remain untouched.


    Nonsense statement.  Nothing in your sentence has any content.  Dogmas cannot be overturned.  Ergo, 'when' in your statement is a hypothetical, a condition that cannot exist and which mankind has no experience with, and therefore to say anything about such a condition is fatuous.

    If you mean to say "In the mind of the heretic" then again, nonsense.  You have no idea how disbelieving one dogma as opposed to another will affect the heretic.  If disbelieving in the resurrection, he may never again be convinced of it.  If disbelieving in the Trinity, he may stumble across De Trinitas in the library and become re-converted.  Who knows.  Quit typing nonsense.  

    Offline icterus

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    « Reply #72 on: December 16, 2013, 11:09:44 AM »
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  • SJB, I'm calling you to a better class of posts.  You could be discussing the actual matter at hand.  Instead, you are just junking up threads with nonsense.  I know you can do better.  I call on you to do so.

    Offline SJB

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    « Reply #73 on: December 16, 2013, 05:00:46 PM »
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  • Quote from: icterus
    Quote
    When one dogma is "overturned," it matters little which ones remain untouched.


    Nonsense statement.  Nothing in your sentence has any content.  Dogmas cannot be overturned.  Ergo, 'when' in your statement is a hypothetical, a condition that cannot exist and which mankind has no experience with, and therefore to say anything about such a condition is fatuous.

    If you mean to say "In the mind of the heretic" then again, nonsense.  You have no idea how disbelieving one dogma as opposed to another will affect the heretic.  If disbelieving in the resurrection, he may never again be convinced of it.  If disbelieving in the Trinity, he may stumble across De Trinitas in the library and become re-converted.  Who knows.  Quit typing nonsense.  


    If you notice, the word "overturned" is in quotes. Do you have any idea what the quotation marks might signify?
    It would be comparatively easy for us to be holy if only we could always see the character of our neighbours either in soft shade or with the kindly deceits of moonlight upon them. Of course, we are not to grow blind to evil

    Offline icterus

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    « Reply #74 on: December 16, 2013, 05:11:59 PM »
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  • Quit being coy.  It's not attractive.