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Author Topic: Behold the Fruit  (Read 1504 times)

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Offline Caminus

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Behold the Fruit
« on: April 27, 2011, 11:46:36 PM »
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  • http://www.peterkreeft.com/audio/03_ecuмenism/ecuмenism_transcription.htm


    Offline Hobbledehoy

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    Behold the Fruit
    « Reply #1 on: April 28, 2011, 09:47:53 PM »
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  • I had hoped this was a sad, sick joke, but unfortunately the author of this missive seems to believes these heretical errors.

    Here are some of the things that I found particularly disturbing.

    Quote
    Why should God let Protestants become Catholics when many Protestants, perhaps most, already know Christ more intimately and personally than many Catholics, perhaps most!  How can God lead Protestants home to the fullness of faith in the Catholic Church until the Catholic Church becomes that fullness that they knew as Protestants plus more, not any less!  When Catholics know Christ better than Protestants do, when Catholics are better Protestants than Protestants, then Protestants will become Catholics in order to become better Protestants!
     

    Complete ignorance of the incomprehensible treasury of dogmatic and moral theology [the latter including ascetic and mystical theology] seems to be shown here.

    Quote
    God pulled them out of a Catholic Church and put them into a Protestant sect because God is spiritual gravity and God pulls us towards Himself, like a massive sun.  If His rays are blocked in one place, we must go elsewhere to find them, for find them we must!  They draw us, they give us life.  They are a matter of life or death, not a religious shopping mart.


    God-gravity! What precise, scholastic terminology! This certainly couldn't be tainted with the Hegelian trash fed to modern Catholics as something "better" than the teachings of St. Thomas and the Schoolmen... [nota bene: sarcastic mode is on].

    Quote
    The Jєωs must see us as more Jєωιѕн, more faithful, more martyrs, than the Jєωs.  The same with the Muslims.  They must see their “islam,” their absolute submission to God in us, and their spiritual warfare, their right jihad.  And the Buddhist must see in us a greater peace, a greater mindfulness.


    That reminds me of an interview of one of John Paul II's Jєωιѕн friends, who said something to the effect that he had inspired him to become a better Jєω. Compare this with Pope Pius XII, whose example of divine and fraternal charity converted the chief Rabbi of Rome unto Holy Mother Church after the Second World War.

    Quote
    And even the worldings and sex maniacs.  They must see in us the joy that they’re seeking and not finding.


     :facepalm:

    I think I know what he's trying to say here, but it is scandalous and offensive to the sensus Catholicus to word it this way, particularly if it is contextualized by the errors written throughout the article. But I find it interesting, because it deepens an impression I have always had regarding this sort of error.

    The ultimately necessary conclusion of heretical syncretism is the assent to [and, perhaps, even the practice of] the most depraved aspects and manifestations of fallen human nature, for syncretism [or, "ecuмenism"] is ultimately man superimposing his egocentricity upon God, transmogrifying Him according to the similitude of his own perverted image and likeness in the most subtle and base form of idolatry. It shares with Communism the autrolatrous construct that attempts to seduce and pervert souls to succuмb to the horizontalism that is the direct and mutually exclusive contradictory of grace: it is "the work of men's hands" (Ps. cxiii. 12) fabricated and disguised as the work of God.
    Please ignore all that I have written regarding sedevacantism.


    Offline gladius_veritatis

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    Behold the Fruit
    « Reply #2 on: April 28, 2011, 09:53:33 PM »
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  • Kreeft is a joke -- and has been for a LONG time.
    "Fear God, and keep His commandments: for this is all man."

    Offline Caminus

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    Behold the Fruit
    « Reply #3 on: April 28, 2011, 10:53:03 PM »
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  • Hob, excellent commentary.

    Offline Exilenomore

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    Behold the Fruit
    « Reply #4 on: April 29, 2011, 07:23:31 AM »
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  • Quote from: Hobbledehoy

    The ultimately necessary conclusion of heretical syncretism is the assent to [and, perhaps, even the practice of] the most depraved aspects and manifestations of fallen human nature, for syncretism [or, "ecuмenism"] is ultimately man superimposing his egocentricity upon God, transmogrifying Him according to the similitude of his own perverted image and likeness in the most subtle and base form of idolatry. It shares with Communism the autrolatrous construct that attempts to seduce and pervert souls to succuмb to the horizontalism that is the direct and mutually exclusive contradictory of grace: it is "the work of men's hands" (Ps. cxiii. 12) fabricated and disguised as the work of God.


    Exactly. Well said!  :applause:


    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    « Reply #5 on: April 29, 2011, 06:21:41 PM »
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  • Its sad, because Kreeft was actually my first foray into Catholicism and I accredit his writing to my conversion. This was only upon reading his books against moral relativism (which isnt really hard to defend, once you understand the basic tenets of it).

    His theology though has gone astray and exactly where the rest of his flock is... into a false church and thus perdition.

    Offline gladius_veritatis

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    « Reply #6 on: April 29, 2011, 07:35:44 PM »
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  • Quote from: Caminus
    Hob, excellent commentary.


    Not bad for a sede, considering...

    Quote from: stevusmagnus
    Sedes add nothing but irrelevant ad hominems and mockery from the sidelines where they perpetually sit, holding down the bleachers. One would think they could play soldier of Christ just for a day and join ... in engaging the enemy, but instead, like the traitors they are, they hold their venom for the man fighting the enemy! Their lot has sealed their own fate. They are a bunch of neutered dogs whose bark does nothing but distract Christ's true soldiers from the fight.
    "Fear God, and keep His commandments: for this is all man."

    Offline MyrnaM

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    Behold the Fruit
    « Reply #7 on: April 29, 2011, 08:20:03 PM »
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  • Stevusmagnus said that!!!

    I am beginning to believe he really is a mole, a double agent.  Hope I'm wrong truly I do.
    Please pray for my soul.
    R.I.P. 8/17/22

    My new blog @ https://myforever.blog/blog/


    Offline Caminus

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    Behold the Fruit
    « Reply #8 on: April 29, 2011, 10:41:28 PM »
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  • Quote from: gladius_veritatis
    Quote from: Caminus
    Hob, excellent commentary.


    Not bad for a sede, considering...

    Quote from: stevusmagnus
    Sedes add nothing but irrelevant ad hominems and mockery from the sidelines where they perpetually sit, holding down the bleachers. One would think they could play soldier of Christ just for a day and join ... in engaging the enemy, but instead, like the traitors they are, they hold their venom for the man fighting the enemy! Their lot has sealed their own fate. They are a bunch of neutered dogs whose bark does nothing but distract Christ's true soldiers from the fight.


    Considering the vitriolic tripe from P.I.O. and Mike, it's not altogether unfounded.  Since they can't make proper distinctions and throw all caution to the wind, all consideration of justice and charity, recklessly embracing a form of dogmatic SV's that is just as damaging as the errors which they purport to abhor, but maybe only slightly less offensive than the Dimond duo, those sentiments are not surpising at all.    

    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

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    Behold the Fruit
    « Reply #9 on: April 29, 2011, 11:15:22 PM »
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  • Quote from: MyrnaM
    Stevusmagnus said that!!!

    I am beginning to believe he really is a mole, a double agent.  Hope I'm wrong truly I do.


    I think he's just an ignorant lawyer who loves Wikipedia a bit too much.  :laugh1:

    Anyway, I do think his comment was un-called for. He keeps wondering why the sedes are making a big fuss, yet he doesn't realize it's because of his ignorance, as well as his uncharitable attitude towards sedes.
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.

    Offline gladius_veritatis

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    Behold the Fruit
    « Reply #10 on: April 30, 2011, 06:24:46 PM »
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  • Quote from: Caminus
    Considering the vitriolic tripe from P.I.O. and Mike, it's not altogether unfounded.


    Leaving aside the accuracy of your take, are you saying it is understandable when a man acts as if an exception is the rule?

    How would you feel if I blasted ALL who accept BXVI just because one of you happened to be an ass?  While I have actively opposed stevie, I have not acted as if he is representative of ALL who accept BXVI.  Why not?  Because to do so would be contrary to reason, the evidence, my own experience, charity and justice.  

    FWIW, such a course would be the essence of 'contrary to justice' (which is ironic, considering your reply).  You seem to be defending such a course, rather than facing the fact that his comment produces the very same effect as those of the Dimonds.

    Have a wonderful Sunday, amigo...
    "Fear God, and keep His commandments: for this is all man."


    Offline stevusmagnus

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    Behold the Fruit
    « Reply #11 on: April 30, 2011, 10:02:13 PM »
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  • I actually had the sede detractors on the Sungenis thread in mind when I said that. Perhaps I should name the sedes I have in mind instead of simply saying "sedes".

    Neverthertheless Hobble is pretty level headed and reasonable.