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Author Topic: Autobiography of Archbishop Thuc  (Read 155843 times)

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Offline Ladislaus

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Re: Autobiography of Archbishop Thuc
« Reply #290 on: June 01, 2026, 11:25:57 AM »
Back and forth between being traditional not being traditional. Secret consecrations he later regrets.

Not exactly stable reliable behavior.

Getting closer to the truth, except not "secret" ... less secret than several of the latest performed by +Williamson.

Palmar was extraordinarily public and even had competent witnsesses, that Fr. Revaz SSPX ... so even Bishop Kelly's criteria were met.

Hiller / Heller witnessed the +Gueard des Lauriers and +Carmona / +Zamora ones.

He regretted Palmar later, yes ... after Dominguez came out at Pope.  Initially, his fault was in being somewhat gullible in buying into their legitimacy, but then ... +Williamson believes in Garabandal, Valtorta, and Bogus Ordo "Eucharistic Miracles".  +Fellay bought into that Dawn Marie.  If either of those two had been convinced of the preternatural character of Palmar, they may have proceeded as well.  PLUS ... Father Barbara, a friend of +Lefebvre, reported that +Lefebvre admitted to him (at the dinner table) to having sent Fr. Revaz to +Thuc, saying something along the lines of, "I'm sure that Archbishop Thuc can do it for you."  So that could have added even more credibility to the entire thing if it had received an implicit endorsement from +Lefebvre.  I could easily see Father Revaz going to +Thuc saying, "Archbishop Lefebvre sent me to get you, since he's too busy."  I mean, if I thought +Lefebvre had intended for me to go somewhere, I'd probably have gone also.  AND people do report preternatural phenomena at Palmar, levitaiton, "stigmata", etc.

Yes, he did participate in a Novus Ordo "Mass" once due to pressure from the bishop, perhaps partly due to human respect, partly due to the fact that the bishop provided his only source of financial support, where he put him up in a dirty little apartment in exchange for having him teach catechism to children and hear Confessions.  That incident speaks to the Archbishop's incredibly virtue, as no one ever heard him utter a word of complaint that it was beneath his dignity or office to teach little children catechism or to hear Confessions as an "assistant pastor" to some schmuck.  Now, +Thuc's confessional line ended up going practically out the back door into the street, and the pastor became jealous of his popularity and bounced him.

So that was the only "back and forth" that can be proven.  Toward the very end of his life, when he had been kidnapped by a group of Vietnamese (probably Commie agents), we don't know whether he freely signed anything attributed to him, whether it was forged, or whether done under duress or when he was impaired.  So, there's no independent corroboration or evidence that he realigned with the Conciliars at that time.  +Mindszenty signed a false confession one time, but put "cf" at the end ("coactus feci" ... I did this under coercion.)

In the end, probably less back and forth than Archbishop Lefebvre had done, to be honest.

But if there's on legitimate fault one MIGHT attribute to him is that he was somewhat easily manipulated by a combination of being naive, always thinking the best of people ... and succuмbing to various forms of pressure (and Vietnam has this culture of respect and honor where refusing someone a request was considered an insult ... barring of course good reason to do so ... but the kneejerk response was of wanting to comply by default).

But he was NOT insane, NOT out of his mind, but WAS in total control of his faculties, showed tremendous virtue, humility, charity ... where his one fault may have been being given a little to human respect and being somewhat naive, so as to make some poor prudential judgments, but then he wouldn't have been the first nor the last.  Nor was it true that he simply ordained and consecrated anyone who showed up asking for it, having refused a fair number of askers, and in one case ordaining but not consecrating.  Many have lied about having been consecrated by +Thuc.

Then, none of the other arguments from Bishop Kelly hold any water, such as needing to have the consecrations public, not done in secret, and having competent witnesses.

Hopefully you're not dumb enough to make that objection against his consecrations / ordinations ... since +Williamson did several in secret:  +Ballini, +Morgan, and there was some delay in publicizing +Stobnicki also.  No witnesses at any of those, just his word and that of the consecrands.

Yet you do have a lot of temerity for critizing him for "secret" consecrations, when none of his were anywhere near as "secret" as some of +Williamson's.

Online Persto

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Re: Autobiography of Archbishop Thuc
« Reply #291 on: June 02, 2026, 01:01:33 PM »
https://www.cathinfo.com/video-texts/the-truth-about-archbishop-thuc-(part-2)-the-original-docuмents!-79873/


The Testimony of Dr. Heller to Fr. Zepeda
"People can claim it, but they lie. This person is mentally sick, and that's the end of it. As opposed to, he has to sign a piece of paper, or print out papers, docuмents for him to sign, because you can't ask somebody who is mentally sick to sign a paper, okay? So, even the Vatican doesn't accept that idea that he was sick. Secondly, as I have the picture of Cardinal Law (a bishop in 1984), you know, that's obviously his name,... but the aspect of this is a high official in the United States in 1984 going to him, and they are together, having pictures taken in full regalia. Now, tell me, who, as a high official, would go take his picture with someone who is crazy? Right? So, when they say that, but he's not in his right mind, like he said, they say it, and then hope it sticks. If they say it enough times, they believe it, right?


The next thing is, the bishops who succeeded in Vietnam were consecrated by Thuc. And they continued. So if there's a question, he was crazy, then are you going to say those are also not valid? That's why my whole thing is the Vatican has not questioned his mental abilities."

Note: Dr. Heller was a leader of the resistance to the Conciliar church.  He knew Abp. Thuc personally, and was present at the Episcopal consecrations of Abp. Thuc of Gerard de Lauriers and Carmona and Zamora.
On April 30, 1975, 185 members – about half of the Congregation of the Mother Coredemptrix (CMC)– left Vietnam as boat people just before the Fall of Saigon. They arrived in the United States and there was a big resettlement center for Vietnamese and Cambodian refugees in Arkansas at Fort Chaffee.  A chaplain at the base connected the group with then-Bishop (Cardinal) Bernard Law of the Diocese of Springfield-Cape Girardeau, Missouri. “The bishop … [found] out about us and he sponsored us into his diocese.” The group then moved to Carthage, Missouri to stay at the vacant Oblates of Mary Immaculate (OMI) Seminary, which the Bishop invited them to purchase for $1 to use as their monastery.

Archbishop Pierre Martin Ngô Đình Thục died at the monastery in 1984.


Offline Ladislaus

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Re: Autobiography of Archbishop Thuc
« Reply #292 on: June 02, 2026, 03:33:25 PM »
So so sad that he went crazy towards the end.

He didn't really go crazy ... just look at his eyes on that very last photo (posted not too far above).  He's clearly got that glazed look in the eye of having been drugged.

He was perfectly lucid until they kidnapped him toward the end, but he had performed the consecrations 3 years prior.

Re: Autobiography of Archbishop Thuc
« Reply #293 on: June 03, 2026, 12:07:15 PM »
oh goodness...

Re: Autobiography of Archbishop Thuc
« Reply #294 on: June 03, 2026, 12:37:45 PM »

So, newChurch Vietnamese drugged Archbishop Thuc... but what's the Cabbage Patch boy's excuse?


:popcorn: