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Author Topic: Are we on the final Pope?  (Read 4457 times)

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Offline cassini

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Are we on the final Pope?
« Reply #15 on: February 11, 2017, 09:50:16 AM »
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  • Quote from: ranlare
    Good factual theological reasoning RomanCatholic1953.

    We are 100% currently not under the last Holy Father according to the holy St Malachy's heavenly prophecy.  


    Does the same go for popes John XXIII, JPI, JPII and Benedict XVI?

    JPII was De Labore Solus (About the Work of the Sun) which after his 1992 farce on the Galileo case asserting Pope Paul V, St Bellarmine etc., were ignorant and didn't know the difference between faith and science.
    Seems to me St Malachy got that one right.

    Offline Amakusa

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #16 on: February 23, 2017, 08:20:29 AM »
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  • The true interpretation of the last mottoes:

    The Prophecy of the Popes was published by Arnold de Wion in 1595, in his Lignum Vitae. The docuмent is a list of Latin phrases or “mottoes”, describing all popes of the Church history from Celestine II to the last pope to come, Peter the Roman. Arnold de Wion attributed this prophecy to St. Malachy. Father Ménestrier and several other writers attempted to refute this claim, arguing that the text was published only in 1595, in other words several centuries after the days of St. Malachy and that of the first popes mentioned in the list. But it would not be the first time that a literary work is recovered and published after a so long period of “inexistence”: for instance, the first known mention of the Codex Vaticanus is from the 15th century, whereas this old manuscipt of the Bible dates back to the 4th century! In 1901, Abbot Maître published a book where he well answered the arguments of Fr. Ménestrier. In the same way, it is utterly false to claim that the Latin phrases prior to 1595 are clearer and more relevant that the later mottoes.

    Before I read the book of Abbot Maître, La prophétie des papes attribuée à St. Malachy, I did not believe in this prophecy, I saw it as fanciful and I thought that it was not authentic. But Abbot Maître, who was a doctor of theology and philosophy, wrote a very good analysis which strongly supports the authenticity of this docuмent. However, the problem we are currently facing is that the Catholics do not understand the true meaning of the last mottoes of this prophecy. Since the phrases predict both the situation of all popes (or antipopes) and that of the Church, the primary reason why the Catholics do not understand the last mottoes is that the great majority of them do not understand the Church crisis.

    The motto of Pope Paul VI is Flos Florum, because he is the “Flower of Flowers”, the Pope of popes (namely the best pope in history). He is none other than the Martyr-Pope of the end times. The authenticity of the prophecy of St. Malachy was confirmed by the Swiss exorcisms, and the demons were compelled by heaven to mention “the half moon”, which is the next motto after that of Paul VI. They explained that John Paul I and John Paul II were two half moons, because they had double-barrelled names. There is not a single pope or antipope in the whole history of the Church who chose a double-barrelled name, because they would have had the feeling that they were “half popes.” In 1999, Éric Faure explained in “Le Pape Martyr de la fin des temps” that Jason and Menelas, who usurped the high priesthood in the Old Covenant, bore Greek names in order to please their invaders, which contradicted the tradition of the Jews, since no high priest had ever chosen a foreign name. The current crisis of the Church is very similar to the maccabean crisis in many regards, but I have not the time to translate the work of Éric Faure. The Schism House has recently published some articles in which they try to make a parallel between the maccabean crisis and our current situation, but their comparison is not fully relevant, since they ignore the fact that there was a true pontiff in exile (Onias III) at the time of the maccabean crisis, whereas they claim that there is no pope in the present crisis!

    During the Swiss exorcisms, the demons were compelled by heaven to declare that Wojtyla, “just like Luciani, received his light from the other pope [the true one], Paul VI, who is still living.” What is the meaning of such words? Abbot Maître, in his book, explained that the moon represented antipopes in the prophecy of St. Malachy: this is the case of Benedict XIII (1329-1423), whose motto is “Cosmedine moon” (he was the Cardinal-deacon of St. Mary in Cosmedin); but this is also the case of the antipope Felix V, who is described by the motto of Nicholas V (“the small moon”), because he put an end to his schism and submitted to Pope Nicholas. On the contary, the sun symbolizes the true Pope, whose light comes from Jesus Christ. In chapter XII of the Apocalypse, the woman is “clothed with the sun”, and has “the moon beneath her feet”. Antipopes do not emit their own light: their light is mere appearance, and they steal the true light ot the legitimate popes. For this reason, they are like the moon, which light comes from the sun. More interestingly, one should know that Wojtyla was created a Cardinal by Pope Paul VI in 1967, and Luciani in 1973. At the latter date, Paul VI was still not definitely replaced with a double: the definitive substitution occurred only in 1975. From 1972 to 1975, most of the time it was the true Pope who appeared in public, not the double; but in the course of 1975, the situation was reversed. Therefore, Luciani and Wojtyla were both created Cardinals by the true Pope. On the contrary, Ratzinger was created a Cardinal by the double on June 27th 1977, and Bergoglio by Wojtyla (antipope John Paul II) on February 21st 2001: it means that they are not even valid Cardinals. That's one more reason why Luciani and Wojtyla share the “half moon” motto, whereas Ratzinger and Bergoglio share the next motto.

    Moreover, Luciani and Wojtyla were elected while Pope Paul VI was still residing in the Vatican, as a prisoner, before he escaped from the Vatican on July 12th 1981. The “eclipse of the sun”, which is the next motto after them, had still not occurred: the Holy Father was to go into exile three years after their elections. But the prophecy is even more precise! There are two “half moons” in one single motto, two antipopes, because the exile of Pope Paul VI was to occur during the pontificate of Karol Wojtyla: one half moon plus one half moon makes a full moon, the moon of the next motto, which eclipses the sun! Then, why do Ratzinger and Bergoglio share the same motto, “the eclipse of the sun”? Because they were elected while the Holy Father was already in exile, and it is under their reign that he will reappear. But there is even one more reason, which proves that the prophecy of St. Malachy is truly and indisputably divine: the motto does not only describe the situation of Paul VI regarding the antipopes, it describes the situation of Bergoglio regarding Raztinger. On September 25th 2005, the French news “France 2” revealed that Bergoglio had got one third of the votes during the conclave of April, which prevented the election of Ratzinger in the beginning; but Bergoglio had then failed to be elected. This information came from a Cardinal who had broken the secret of the conclave. Thus, we can see that Bergoglio (who has the sun is in his coat of arms!2) was eclipsed by Ratzinger during the conclave of 2005, and he reappeared in 2013 just like the sun which reappears after it has been eclipsed by the moon. In the same way, Pope Paul VI, who was eclipsed in 1981 (when he fled into exile) is to reappear in the coming years. Therefore, the motto describes both the situation of Ratzinger and Bergoglio, and that of the Church, whose chief on earth is Pope Paul VI.

    Most of the time, the mottoes of the prophecy describe either the situation of the pope or antipope who is concerned, or the situation of the Church (and sometimes both). Thus, my analysis is in accordance with the common interpretation. The fact that four antipopes are grouped in two mottoes is not a problem, for two reasons: firstly it is justified by the unprecedented situation we are facing, secondly the prophecy of St. Malachy has sometimes been hard to interpret, notably during the Great Western Schism (the true popes were not mentioned first!). In the prophecy, the antipopes are not described in the same way as the true popes: for instance, it seems that there is never a name of saint in the antipopes' mottoes (otherwise, it would be desecrated in some way). But it is also interesting to note that during the Great Western Schism, the mottoes of the antipopes only describe their situation as Cardinals, in order to show that they are not legitimate popes: Benedict XIII was Cardinal Deacon of St. Mary in Cosmedin (“The moon of Cosmedin”), Clement VII was Cardinal Priest of the Holy Apostles in Rome (“From the apostolic cross”); Alexander V was Archbishop of Milan (a “papabile” title), which arms were a sun with wavy rays (“Whip of the sun”); and John XIII was Cardinal Deacon of St. Eustace of Rome, and came from Naples, which has the emblem of the siren (St. Eustace is often depicted with a stag): his motto is “Stag of the siren”. Therefore, my interpretation of the “half moon” motto is in accordance with the interpretation of the ancient mottoes: the half moon symbolizes the situation of Cardinals Luciani and Wojtyla, who received their light from Pope Paul VI since they were named by him.


    From the book "The Survival of Paul VI, Predicted by St. John the Apostle".


    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #17 on: February 23, 2017, 09:04:57 AM »
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  • I've heard many theories about the popes.  I've never heard that Paul VI is still living.  Is there a website?

    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #18 on: February 23, 2017, 09:16:06 AM »
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  • If there was a 'pope in hiding' it surely was Cardinal Siri.  There is ample evidence to suggest that he was elected 4 times and forced to resign, spanning the anti-popes of John XXIII, Paul VI, JPI and JPII.  What happens now, since he's dead, is a ?.  Maybe Benedict was valid?

    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #19 on: February 23, 2017, 09:47:39 AM »
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  • Quote from: Croixalist
    If you fold the prophecies up 7 Popes, starting with the 72nd Pope on the list, Gregory XIII, whose motto is actually a reference to Medici Pope Pius IV who made him cardinal, and give him the 65th Papal "Motto" which is a reference to another Medici Pope, Clement VII, I think it matches up better overall with the rest of the Popes on the list. They're so obscure that it wasn't before Pope Leo XIII's motto that people really started to take notice again. I've posted my "adjusted" list before, but to make a long story short, we would currently be at "Religion Destroyed" with the "Angelic Shepherd" up next.

    At least there's a little more room to breathe and space for an "Era of Peace" before the very end. But as it is, it's a broken "prophecy" that I wouldn't attach much importance to.


    Interesting. I'm intrigued.   Do we have a link?
    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle


    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #20 on: February 23, 2017, 03:34:31 PM »
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  • Pope Paul VI would turn 120 this year.  To think he's in hiding somewhere when he didn't really look all that healthy and robust in 1975 when he was 78 really puts a lot of pressure on this idea.  

    Would a pope who allowed a body double to bring all that destruction to the Holy Church be in a state of mortal sin?  

    The Siri Theory is much more believable than the Pope Paul VI still in hiding theory.  

    The whole Vatican II bringing destruction to the Catholic Church doesn't have to be accepted as a theory - we can all see it daily with our own eyes.


    Offline Croixalist

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #21 on: February 23, 2017, 04:36:13 PM »
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  • Quote from: LaramieHirsch
    Quote from: Croixalist
    If you fold the prophecies up 7 Popes, starting with the 72nd Pope on the list, Gregory XIII, whose motto is actually a reference to Medici Pope Pius IV who made him cardinal, and give him the 65th Papal "Motto" which is a reference to another Medici Pope, Clement VII, I think it matches up better overall with the rest of the Popes on the list. They're so obscure that it wasn't before Pope Leo XIII's motto that people really started to take notice again. I've posted my "adjusted" list before, but to make a long story short, we would currently be at "Religion Destroyed" with the "Angelic Shepherd" up next.

    At least there's a little more room to breathe and space for an "Era of Peace" before the very end. But as it is, it's a broken "prophecy" that I wouldn't attach much importance to.


    Interesting. I'm intrigued.   Do we have a link?


    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/The-Prophecy-of-the-Popes-Plus-One-Plus-Ultra-A-Debunking

    It's been so long, I misquoted myself. The next Pope on deck would be "Intrepid Faith" which might imply a short-lived "Fatima" Pope before the "Angelic Shepherd." I'm grouping Francis in with Benedict under "Religion Destroyed" until someone does what needs to be done for the consecration of Russia.

    Also of note about the "fold" at Pope Gregory XIII, he was the Pope who began to implement the Gregorian Calender which saw a 10 day jump ahead. As far as I know, 1582 was the only year not to have an October 13th.
    Fortuna finem habet.

    Offline Amakusa

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #22 on: February 24, 2017, 04:41:25 AM »
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  • Here is my blog about Paul VI's survival: https://paulvisurvivalsecretfatima.wordpress.com/

    My French blog has much more material.


    The Siri thesis is indefensible since it contradicts Catholic doctrine. John XXIII and Paul VI were peacefully accepted by the whole Church, therefore Cardinal Siri cannot have been elected in their place. They arre infallibly legitimate. It seems that Cardinal Siri was about to be elected in the conclave of 1978, but this conclave was invalid since Paul VI was (and is) still alive.


    We know for sure that Paul VI is infallibly alive because he is the last pope peacefully and universally accepted by the whole Church.
    From this time the Church has made no efforts to elect a new pope (a legitimate one).

    In the Apocalypse the Martyr Pope is said to be elected during the Second Vatican Council and he is said to reappear when Babylon (the EU and the false Church) will fall. Now, the Swiss exorcisms predicted that Pope Paul VI would reappear when the bankruptcy has occured in Europe. See my book on the Apocalypse...


    Offline AlligatorDicax

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #23 on: February 24, 2017, 07:00:47 PM »
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  • Quote from: Pax Vobis (Feb 7, 2017, 8:49 pm)
    There's no right or wrong way to interpret St Malachy's list [....]

    Except by interpretating his list based on words that actually ain't there.

    Quote from: Pax Vobis (Feb 7, 2017, 8:49 pm)
    St Malachy uses a phrase similar to:  "the end of the age".

    I can't find any such phrase.  Where in the text did you see that?   Feel free to quote from his original Latin text.

    Quote from: Pax Vobis (Feb 7, 2017, 8:49 pm)
    He never says "end of time".

    Not that I've seen.  Just as where I'd expect to have seen it, he didn't write "end of the age".

    Quote from: Pax Vobis (Feb 7, 2017, 8:49 pm)
    I don't presume to say this is accurate, but it makes sense.

    It might make "make sense" to readers here, but I've seen no evidence of it.  Which brings readers back to the problematic issue of being "accurate".

    Sooo, what have I overlooked, and where?

    Offline AlligatorDicax

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    « Reply #24 on: February 25, 2017, 08:01:21 AM »
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  • I dug into the subject prophesies most recently in late 2013, altho' I didn't post anything to CathInfo about it.

    Readers unfamiliar with the prophecies of St. Malachy might do well to start with 2 articles in the original edition of Catholic Encyclopedia:
    · "St. Malachy"
    • ,  altho' possibly disappointing to readers, because it defers discussion of his prophecies to another article:

    · "Prophecy",  especially its section devoted to this saint
    • .


    The Latin book Lignvm Vitae, in which the papal prophecies of St. Malachy were first known to be published (1595), specifically in its 5-page section attributed to "S. Malachias", is viewable free (via Google Books) on line[##]; "Petrus Romanus" appears on p. 511.

    -------
    Note +: William Grattan-Flood 1910: §"St. Malachy".  The Catholic Encyclopedia, vol. 9.  <http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09565a.htm>.   

    Note #: Arthur Devine 1911: §"Prophecies of St. Malachy" in "Prophecy".  The Catholic Encyclopedia, vol. 12.  <http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12473a.htm#malachy>.

    Note ##: Liber Secundus p. 507 &seq.  <http://books.google.com/books?id=a4o8AAAAcAAJ&pg=507#v=onepage&q&f=false>.   The site puts a heavy load on a browser (computing or data-transfer), so patience is definitely a virtue when using this on-line resource: Slight movements of the slider-bar on the left, before the initial page image is fully loaded, can move the focus to a view hundreds of pages away from the page specified by the URL; use the grasping-hand pointer instead.

    Offline Jovita

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #25 on: February 25, 2017, 09:49:07 AM »
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  • Are we on the final Pope?

    Gee, I sure hope so. Enough is enough already.
    This happened in Rome on the Feast Day of the Chair of St. Peter.


    Offline Pax Vobis

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    « Reply #26 on: February 25, 2017, 11:06:36 AM »
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  • Quote
    Pax Vobis said:
    St Malachy uses a phrase similar to:  "the end of the age".

    AlligatorDicax said:
    I can't find any such phrase.  Where in the text did you see that?   Feel free to quote from his original Latin text.

    I was posting based on a blog I read many years ago; i've tried to find it again and cannot.  The blogger was quoting a friend who had studied the manuscripts and who said that he inferred a break between 'gloria olivae' and 'petrus romanus', not based on a word but how the text was laid out on teh page, compared to the previous entries.  I've never seen the actual text, nor do I know where it even is, so I can't confirm.  This is just his opinion.

    Offline Croixalist

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    « Reply #27 on: February 25, 2017, 03:24:22 PM »
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  • Quote from: Pax Vobis
    Quote
    Pax Vobis said:
    St Malachy uses a phrase similar to:  "the end of the age".

    AlligatorDicax said:
    I can't find any such phrase.  Where in the text did you see that?   Feel free to quote from his original Latin text.

    I was posting based on a blog I read many years ago; i've tried to find it again and cannot.  The blogger was quoting a friend who had studied the manuscripts and who said that he inferred a break between 'gloria olivae' and 'petrus romanus', not based on a word but how the text was laid out on teh page, compared to the previous entries.  I've never seen the actual text, nor do I know where it even is, so I can't confirm.  This is just his opinion.


    The main thing is that "persecutione extrema" would seem to indicate the Antichrist. In addition, Peter the Roman isn't numbered nor is it worded like the rest of them. There are a few people who believe that the Petrus Romanus entry was a later addition because it was so different. Could be!

    For an example of how seriously these prophecies were taken in the past, here's a 1942 Italian docuмentary on Pope Pius XII entitled "Pastor Angelicus":

    [youtube]https://www.youtube.com/embed/l9pVFRSa3QI[/youtube]

    At least the Prophecies used to offer some amount of consolation. It's too bad they're so suspect.


    Fortuna finem habet.

    Offline AMDGJMJ

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #28 on: February 25, 2017, 05:11:20 PM »
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  • Quote from: Pax Vobis
    Quote
    Pax Vobis said:
    St Malachy uses a phrase similar to:  "the end of the age".

    AlligatorDicax said:
    I can't find any such phrase.  Where in the text did you see that?   Feel free to quote from his original Latin text.

    I was posting based on a blog I read many years ago; i've tried to find it again and cannot.  The blogger was quoting a friend who had studied the manuscripts and who said that he inferred a break between 'gloria olivae' and 'petrus romanus', not based on a word but how the text was laid out on teh page, compared to the previous entries.  I've never seen the actual text, nor do I know where it even is, so I can't confirm.  This is just his opinion.


    I do remember hearing this before too, but don't remember the source as it was quite some time ago...
    "Jesus, Meek and Humble of Heart, make my heart like unto Thine!"

    http://whoshallfindavaliantwoman.blogspot.com/

    Offline OurFatherRN1

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    Are we on the final Pope?
    « Reply #29 on: March 03, 2017, 01:26:16 PM »
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  • Every Peter is Roman (Petrie Romanus), every Catholic is Roman.....but one more thing...

    There may be a sign in the heavens, on September 23rd, 2017.  Found in Apocalypse 12:1 - taken from the Douay Rheims:   1.  And a great sign appeared in heaven: A woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars: [2] And being with child, she cried travailing in birth, and was in pain to be delivered.

    On September 23rd, 2017, the constellation Virgo will be with Leo Above her.  In Leo there are 9 stars.  Between Leo and Virgo will be mercury, mars and Venus, which will be 12 stars crowned on (just above) Virgo.  At virgos feet will be the moon, and just below the moon will be Serpens, the snake constellation.  She, Virgo, will also have at her left shoulder, on her back, the Sun, sometime on September 23rd, which will be Virgo, clothed with the sun, as Apoc. 12:1 states, also the 12 stars, and the moon at her feet, with Serpens, which coincides with Catholic traditional artwork depicting the Virgin.  According to astronomers, this is the only time during the time of Christ, that this has happened, we glean.  One more thing.... Jupiter, the largest planet in our solar system appears just below the torso of Virgo, right were a child would be delivered, and sometime around the 23rd, passes in her torso and out of her torso, the king planet, Jupiter, the biggest planet.

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