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Author Topic: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio  (Read 4670 times)

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Offline Miser Peccator

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Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
« Reply #30 on: July 04, 2023, 01:51:35 AM »
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    • Quote from: SeanJohnson on July 03, 2023, 04:48:13 PM
    Conversely, some won't accept any help God sends them.


    Why would you accept help from somebody who lies to your face?

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    I exposed AB Vigano's public meetings with Crowleyan Satanist Dugin so I ask protection on myself family friends priest, under the Blood of Jesus Christ and mantle of the Blessed Virgin Mary! If harm comes to any of us may that embolden the faithful to speak out all the more so Catholics are not deceived.



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    Offline Angelus

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #31 on: July 04, 2023, 08:53:48 AM »
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    • While I agree that Vigano has said some questionable things in the past, what he is saying now is spot on:

    1. Vigano calls out the Antipope and the AntiChurch
     
    "A crucifix dipped in urine is worth a papal audience full of smiles and a 'thumbs up'; the Pachamama thrown into the Tiber arouses deploration. One wonders of which 'church' he can be considered 'pope': certainly not the Catholic one."

    He says Bergoglio is CERTAINLY NOT the Pope of the CATHOLIC CHURCH. He is, at the very least, saying that Bergoglio has defected and that, currently, the is not a legitimate Roman Pontiff. 


    2. Vigano suspects that Bergoglio is the Antichrist

    "One wonders if the antichrist is not seated already on the throne of Peter."

    Vigano correctly identifies the Antichrist as the "Pope" of the Counterfeit Church, the Anti-Pope of the Anti-Church.

    Please meditate on the words from St. Paul in 2 Thessalonians 2:

    3 Let no man deceive you by any means, for unless there come a revolt first, and the man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition, 4 Who opposeth, and is lifted up above all that is called God, or that is worshipped, so that he sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself as if he were God. 

    The "revolt" is the Synod on Synodality. The man who opposes "all that is called God" is Bergoglio. And it is Bergoglio that has usurped the Holy See and "sitteth in the temple of God." He shows himself "as if he were God" when he, for example, undermines the teachings of Jesus Christ and his Church on unrepented mortal sin being an impediment to receiving Holy Communion (Amoris Laetitia).
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #32 on: July 04, 2023, 10:45:48 AM »
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    • Quote from: Miser Peccator on July 04, 2023, 01:51:35 AM

    Why would you accept help from somebody who lies to your face?

    It's a huge stretch and another slander to call him a liar.  It's one thing to consider him mistaken about one or another matter.  I think he was too hopeful of Trump's sincerity and intentions to do good, and I felt he was too soft on Ratzinger when he passed away ... for instance.  But it's quite another thing to call him a liar.  You have proof that he was lying?  It's been one thing after another from you, slandering him as being a Mason because of how he closed some of his letters ... when it was pointed out to you that it's merely an Italian expression, found even in Traditional Catholic Italian Missals, that's the equivalent of Amen.  You never retract these errors even after they're exposed, but keep doubling down on your slanders.

    And you also continue to slander him pretty much every time you post by implying in your signature line that you and your family are in danger for exposing +Vigano, as if the latter were inclined to put a hit out on you for posting on CathInfo.
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    Offline Marulus Fidelis

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #33 on: July 04, 2023, 10:51:58 AM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on July 04, 2023, 10:45:48 AM
    And you also continue to slander him pretty much every time you post by implying in your signature line that you and your family are in danger for exposing +Vigano, as if the latter were inclined to put a hit out on you for posting on CathInfo.
    Indicative of paranoia present in those that spend too much time researching evil. Someone has to expose it, I know. A woman? Hardly.
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    Offline Cera

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #34 on: July 04, 2023, 12:11:21 PM »
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    • Quote from: Angelus on July 03, 2023, 07:19:22 PM
    I'm willing to give him a chance, but will he ask a real Bishop (like Williamson or Faure) to consecrate him using the traditional Rite? Then he could do some good by properly ordaining in the traditional rite all of those New Rite cancelled priests.
    He may have already done this, but discretely.
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    Offline hollingsworth

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #35 on: July 04, 2023, 12:45:01 PM »
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    • Quote
    SJ: As I have collected his (Vigano's) complete works, and followed his conversion to Tradition, I can say that at this time (i.e., May - 2020), he had just started saying the Tridentine Mass 6 months prior, and his doctrinal conversion followed rapidly.  In another year, he would be questioning the legitimacy of Vatican II and rejecting the entire conciliar church, and calling for a reversion to the pre-Pian liturgy.


    I think Sean states the case pretty clearly and accurately.  But as is the wont of the usual suspects on CI, they will beat the  topic to death.
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    Offline Quo vadis Domine

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #36 on: July 04, 2023, 12:56:07 PM »
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    • Quote from: Angelus on July 04, 2023, 08:53:48 AM
    While I agree that Vigano has said some questionable things in the past, what he is saying now is spot on:

    1. Vigano calls out the Antipope and the AntiChurch
     
    "A crucifix dipped in urine is worth a papal audience full of smiles and a 'thumbs up'; the Pachamama thrown into the Tiber arouses deploration. One wonders of which 'church' he can be considered 'pope': certainly not the Catholic one."

    He says Bergoglio is CERTAINLY NOT the Pope of the CATHOLIC CHURCH. He is, at the very least, saying that Bergoglio has defected and that, currently, the is not a legitimate Roman Pontiff.


    2. Vigano suspects that Bergoglio is the Antichrist

    "One wonders if the antichrist is not seated already on the throne of Peter."

    Vigano correctly identifies the Antichrist as the "Pope" of the Counterfeit Church, the Anti-Pope of the Anti-Church.

    Please meditate on the words from St. Paul in 2 Thessalonians 2:

    3 Let no man deceive you by any means, for unless there come a revolt first, and the man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition, 4 Who opposeth, and is lifted up above all that is called God, or that is worshipped, so that he sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself as if he were God.

    The "revolt" is the Synod on Synodality. The man who opposes "all that is called God" is Bergoglio. And it is Bergoglio that has usurped the Holy See and "sitteth in the temple of God." He shows himself "as if he were God" when he, for example, undermines the teachings of Jesus Christ and his Church on unrepented mortal sin being an impediment to receiving Holy Communion (Amoris Laetitia).


    Although I find Father Vigano’s words encouraging, I think that his (and your) belief that Bergoglio may be the Antichrist is incorrect. My understanding is that the Antichrist will be someone who is extremely charismatic and appealing to nearly everyone, to almost fool even the elect.

    I’m sure you’ll agree that Bergoglio is not appealing in the least to ANYONE who has a conservative bone in their body, whether Catholic, Protestant, Orthodox, or atheist.
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    For what doth it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his own soul? Or what exchange shall a man give for his soul?

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #37 on: July 04, 2023, 12:59:22 PM »
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    • Quote from: Marulus Fidelis on July 04, 2023, 10:51:58 AM
    Indicative of paranoia present in those that spend too much time researching evil. Someone has to expose it, I know. A woman? Hardly.

    I'm not one to withhold criticism, but it needs to be just and balanced.  So, for instance, we had the allegation that +Vigano is a Mason because he concluded his letters with a phrase that sounded similar to the Masonic "So mote it be."  But with some digging, it was an Italian expression for "Amen" that was found verbatim in pre-Vatican II Catholics Missals when translating into Italian.  There are allegations of Ecuмenical prayer simply because +Vigano addressed a speech by video to the Jericho rally, the topic of which was the 2020 election fraud.  At no point did +Vigano engage in Ecuмenical prayer.  We have allegations that +Vigano is allied with Dugin simply because, again, he appeared online at a conference in which Dugin also participated, an anti-jab conference in honor of a deceased Italian Catholic priest.  We have allegations that +Vigano is pro-jab because he said a kind word or two about Trump in trying to persuade him to do the right thing, despite having be probably THE most outspoken Catholic voice against the jab.  +Vigano realizes that praising Trump is the only way to persuade him and that criticism causes him to double down against you.  I agree that he was too soft on Ratzinger after he died, but he was probably trying to avoid being too harsh to prevent saying too much bad about a recently departed de mortuis nil nisi bonum.  I do think he's a bit naive about Trump being well intentioned, but in his letter he did say that he "dared hope" that Trump would do the right thing, a hope some of us don't share.  There are also criticisms of things +Vigano did or said before he became a Traditional Catholics, without any allowance for someone learning and being moved by the grace of God.

    Legitimate criticism can get lost in the noise of this assaults that appear to be motivated less by objective reality than by some personal animosity against the man.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #38 on: July 04, 2023, 01:02:33 PM »
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    • Quote from: Quo vadis Domine on July 04, 2023, 12:56:07 PM

    Although I find Vigano’s words encouraging I think that his (and your) belief that Bergoglio may be the Antichrist is not correct. My understanding is that the Antichrist will be someone who is extremely charismatic and appealing to nearly everyone to almost fool even the elect.

    LOL, that's what I was saying when I considered him to be a rather "lame" Antichrist.  :laugh1:

    I think these guys were definitely precursors, just as you had the false High Priests of the Maccabees in the time leading up to the advent of Our Lord.  I think there will be a Holy Pope and Great Monarch to turn things around, a Triumph of the Immaculate Heart, followed by a period of peace, concluding with the arrival of THE Antichrist.  Obviously I could be wrong, and it's just a theory.  Our various interpretations of modern events are not matters of faith.
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    Offline Quo vadis Domine

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #39 on: July 04, 2023, 01:12:41 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on July 04, 2023, 01:02:33 PM
    LOL, that's what I was saying when I considered him to be a rather "lame" Antichrist.  :laugh1:

    I think these guys were definitely precursors, just as you had the false High Priests of the Maccabees in the time leading up to the advent of Our Lord.  I think there will be a Holy Pope and Great Monarch to turn things around, a Triumph of the Immaculate Heart, followed by a period of peace, concluding with the arrival of THE Antichrist.  Obviously I could be wrong, and it's just a theory.  Our various interpretations of modern events are not matters of faith.


    Yep! The only type of person that Bergoglio is appealing to is the Elton John type. :laugh1:
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    For what doth it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his own soul? Or what exchange shall a man give for his soul?

    Offline Donachie

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #40 on: July 04, 2023, 01:16:59 PM »
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    • The earth's not flat any more than the day is long and goes round and round the hours. The dance of the hours, they go round, and so does the turf, and so the sea, and hello muddah fadduh.
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    Offline Angelus

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #41 on: July 04, 2023, 03:12:00 PM »
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    • Quote from: Quo vadis Domine on July 04, 2023, 12:56:07 PM

    Although I find Father Vigano’s words encouraging, I think that his (and your) belief that Bergoglio may be the Antichrist is incorrect. My understanding is that the Antichrist will be someone who is extremely charismatic and appealing to nearly everyone, to almost fool even the elect.

    I’m sure you’ll agree that Bergoglio is not appealing in the least to ANYONE who has a conservative bone in their body, whether Catholic, Protestant, Orthodox, or atheist.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #42 on: July 04, 2023, 03:58:30 PM »
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    • That graph might just be THE perfect indicator of what percentage of US "Catholics" have any semblance or vestiges of Catholic faith left.  Jorge is a "litmus test" for Catholicity, as no one who has any faith left could possibly view Jorge "favorably".
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    Offline SimpleMan

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #43 on: July 04, 2023, 04:16:41 PM »
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    • I have to wonder whether Vigano gets by with talking such smack, because he has the goods on someone (>cough cough<), and it's either let me speak my mind and leave me alone, or try to punish me and I'll tell everything I know.
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    Offline Quo vadis Domine

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    Re: Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano on Antipope Jorge Bergoglio
    « Reply #44 on: July 04, 2023, 06:14:53 PM »
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    • Quote from: Angelus on July 04, 2023, 03:12:00 PM


    I was being somewhat hyperbolic but, if the poll is accurate, 63% of U.S. adults having a favorable opinion of the degenerate, doesn’t shock me one iota and as Lad suggested, it indicates how few U.S. “Catholics” are really not truly Catholic.

    Remember, the Antichrist will be almost universally respected and admired.
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    For what doth it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his own soul? Or what exchange shall a man give for his soul?
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