Read an Interview with Matthew, the owner of CathInfo

Author Topic: Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish  (Read 3402 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Meg

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2915
  • Reputation: +1422/-2276
  • Gender: Female
Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
« on: July 22, 2013, 02:24:45 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!3
  • I don't want to offend anyone here, since I'm probably the only one here who attends an NO, and I hope that I'm putting this thread in the proper section. I was so surprised by an interaction between two priests during announcement at the end of Sunday Mass at the Novus Ordo parish that I recently began attending, that I have to share it because it's so interesting.

    So on my never-ending quest to find a reverent NO (the parishioners at the FSSP parish I'd been attending are not at all friendly, and they are clickish) I started atteding a parish where at least they sing some traditional hymns. The NO parish I'd attended sings the horrid Gather Us In, written by a Lutheran. I don't get why Protestant songs are sung when there are so many beautiful Catholic songs.

    Anyway, at the end of Mass, the elderly priest gave a few announcements, and then a young priest, who I think is new to the parish and who was actually wearing a cassock (which I'd never seen there before) got up and also gave an annoucement. He said that this next Wednesday, there will be a well-known polyphony choir singing Mass. I wasn't really paying attention to what he was saying until this point. And then he said that it will be a Mass in the Extraordinary Form, and then he said that..."Father *** (he was referring to the priest who had previously given the announcement) said that you (referring to the congregation) shouldn't attend it." And the other priest then said...."No, what I meant was, that the Mass is very long to sit through, nearly 2 1/2 hours." In which the young priest responded....."Well, if they can sit through a 2 1/2 hour movie, then they can handle it." The priests were arguing about the Latin Mass in front of everyone!

    I'd wondered if maybe there was a behind-the-scenes battle going on at this parish between those who are attached to the NO and Vll, and those who prefer tradition. At the Mass where this announcement was made, I had almost walked out during Mass due to the homiliy that the elderly priest gave in which he was praising feminism. It was dreadful, but I'm glad I stayed. I'll be attending the TLM at this parish next week. Hopefully the young cassock-wearing priest, who dared to confront the aging liberal will be at least serving at the altar. I'm still amazed by the whole thing.

    Offline Capt McQuigg

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4662
    • Reputation: +2618/-9
    • Gender: Male
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #1 on: July 22, 2013, 04:07:00 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Pretty bad.  

    What was cliqish about the FSSP?


    Offline jen51

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1351
    • Reputation: +1351/-54
    • Gender: Female
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #2 on: July 22, 2013, 04:23:40 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • That is certainly interesting.

    I know there are many young NO priests who have a traditional lean. As an optimist, I would like to think this is God hearing our prayers that we say before or after Mass imploring him to raise up good and holy priests to shepherd His people.

    I hope that young priest finds his way out of the NO and takes all the parishoners with him.
    Religion clean and undefiled before God and the Father, is this: to visit the fatherless and widows in their tribulation: and to keep one's self unspotted from this world.
    ~James 1:27

    Offline claudel

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1082
    • Reputation: +821/-83
    • Gender: Male
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #3 on: July 22, 2013, 04:30:58 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Capt McQuigg
    What was cliquish about the FSSP?


    A good question. However, even if the sentiment you complain of is as you describe it, Meg, why should it matter to you? Please rid your mind of the idea that Mass is a social activity like a meet-and-greet or a house party. You are there to worship God in the manner prescribed by Christ Himself through His Apostles and their successors. An appropriate reason for staying away is the misdirection or subversion of the Faith by the celebrant or the parish authorities as a group, not the attitude of laypeople who don't know you and may not—for whatever reason—want to widen their circle of acquaintance to include you.

    This expectation of sociability from one's fellow congregants is one of the most perfidious side effects of the perversion wreaked on the Faith and on the mind-set of the faithful by the horrid council convened 51 years ago. When Archbishop Lefebvre spoke and wrote of the NO mass as "Protestant" and "making Protestants," this social aspect was certainly not the main thing he had in mind. Yet this Protestant-style desire for "fellowship" as a prime motivation for attending Sunday "services" simply underlines the truth of his perception. People formed by the NO are, whether they see themselves as such or not, Protestant to the core. True conversion is much more than a matter of a few smells and bells.

    Offline ardevain1

    • Newbie
    • *
    • Posts: 19
    • Reputation: +40/-0
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #4 on: July 22, 2013, 04:35:25 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Meg
    I was so surprised by an interaction between two priests during announcement at the end of Sunday Mass at the Novus Ordo parish that I recently began attending, that I have to share it because it's so interesting.

    1- So on my never-ending quest to find a reverent NO

    2- (the parishioners at the FSSP parish I'd been attending are not at all friendly, and they are clickish)

    3- The NO parish I'd attended sings the horrid Gather Us In, written by a Lutheran. I don't get why Protestant songs are sung when there are so many beautiful Catholic songs.

    4- In which the young priest responded....."Well, if they can sit through a 2 1/2 hour movie, then they can handle it." The priests were arguing about the Latin Mass in front of everyone!

    5- I'd wondered if maybe there was a behind-the-scenes battle going on at this parish between those who are attached to the NO and Vll, and those who prefer tradition.


    1- I doubt that you'll ever find one.  Priests who say the NO Mass with any level of reverence and ceremony are usually railroaded out by their bishops.  I do not encourage you to keep looking, either. Archbishop Lefebvre said that, even though the Sacrifice may be validly re-presented and the Sacrament may be validly confected, the NO is a danger to the Faith.

    2- TradCats can be like that.  At a "parish" where I once assisted at Mass there was a particular lady who watched out for new faces and whenever she saw one, cornered the person(s) and warned them to not associate with "those people over there."  You have to work around that. Go up to someone who looks most like wanting to avoid newcomers and, with a smile on your face, introduce yourself and ask for an introduction to what is going on there.  Believe me, the TradCats who especially don't trust strangers will open right up.

    4- The last NO Mass I attended was my Godfather's funeral.  If you think Gather Us In is horrible, try On Eagles' Wings.  It'll curdle milk.

    5- There might be.  The old priests, who can be counted on to have made a lifetime investment in the Nervous disOrder, are finding that the young priests have seen the success of the Tridentine Mass in keeping people Catholic.

    ¡Viva Cristo Rey!
    If you are a Catholic and still breathing air, you are a member of the Church Militant![/i] If you are not fighting under Jesus Christ's banner, remember there is a penalty for "dereliction of duty."


    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 7055
    • Reputation: +1981/-187
    • Gender: Female
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #5 on: July 22, 2013, 08:29:51 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • Quote from: Meg
    I don't want to offend anyone here, since I'm probably the only one here who attends an NO, and I hope that I'm putting this thread in the proper section. I was so surprised by an interaction between two priests during announcement at the end of Sunday Mass at the Novus Ordo parish that I recently began attending, that I have to share it because it's so interesting.

    So on my never-ending quest to find a reverent NO (the parishioners at the FSSP parish I'd been attending are not at all friendly, and they are clickish) I started atteding a parish where at least they sing some traditional hymns. The NO parish I'd attended sings the horrid Gather Us In, written by a Lutheran. I don't get why Protestant songs are sung when there are so many beautiful Catholic songs.

    Anyway, at the end of Mass, the elderly priest gave a few announcements, and then a young priest, who I think is new to the parish and who was actually wearing a cassock (which I'd never seen there before) got up and also gave an annoucement. He said that this next Wednesday, there will be a well-known polyphony choir singing Mass. I wasn't really paying attention to what he was saying until this point. And then he said that it will be a Mass in the Extraordinary Form, and then he said that..."Father *** (he was referring to the priest who had previously given the announcement) said that you (referring to the congregation) shouldn't attend it." And the other priest then said...."No, what I meant was, that the Mass is very long to sit through, nearly 2 1/2 hours." In which the young priest responded....."Well, if they can sit through a 2 1/2 hour movie, then they can handle it." The priests were arguing about the Latin Mass in front of everyone!

    I'd wondered if maybe there was a behind-the-scenes battle going on at this parish between those who are attached to the NO and Vll, and those who prefer tradition. At the Mass where this announcement was made, I had almost walked out during Mass due to the homiliy that the elderly priest gave in which he was praising feminism. It was dreadful, but I'm glad I stayed. I'll be attending the TLM at this parish next week. Hopefully the young cassock-wearing priest, who dared to confront the aging liberal will be at least serving at the altar. I'm still amazed by the whole thing.


    Where is that at?  There is supposed to be no priest shortage. And yet there are two priests. Did you ever attend a resistant Mass?  

    Or even sspx.  

    Those who are in cliques and are mean are not Catholics but hypocrits who lack charity.

    We used to be novus ordo but we now attend offered by Father Hewko.  

    You should give the young priest the book by Archbishop Lefebvre Against the heresies.  

    There is nothing wrong with Catholics hanging out with other Catholics but wait until outside Church.  










    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline Spork

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 309
    • Reputation: +155/-17
    • Gender: Male
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #6 on: July 22, 2013, 08:35:01 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • The CMRI Masses I attended have the sentinels for sure. I took the interrogations in stride. Community is a by product of Faith Hope and Charity, not a primary means to salvation that the Novus Ordo realm advances. Go to the FSSP. They have valid Masses with priests who are not afraid to criticize the NO, VII, and the Bishops.

    Offline Rosemary

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 245
    • Reputation: +155/-3
    • Gender: Female
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #7 on: July 22, 2013, 08:51:13 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • Quote from: Spork
    The CMRI Masses I attended have the sentinels for sure. I took the interrogations in stride. Community is a by product of Faith Hope and Charity, not a primary means to salvation that the Novus Ordo realm advances. Go to the FSSP. They have valid Masses with priests who are not afraid to criticize the NO, VII, and the Bishops.


    I go to a CMRI Mass and have never been interrogated.

    The FSSP should be avoided, as there "Masses" are most likely not valid.  This is because, even if the "priests" were ordained in the valid Latin Rite, they were "ordained" by "bishops" "consecrated" in the invalid Paul VI Rite.
    Mariae Nunquam Servus Peribit


    Offline Frances

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2660
    • Reputation: +2239/-17
    • Gender: Female
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #8 on: July 22, 2013, 09:06:10 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  •  :pray:  :really-mad2: :scratchchin:
    Most Bizarre Encounter-  "Saved By the [Sanctuary] Bell"
    Three years ago I went to weekday Mass at an independent chapel in the Midwest. (USA) I was quite early, so slipped into a pew and began to pray the Rosary.  There were two women in front of me, one of whom was in a Franciscan habit.  Suddenly, I became aware that someone was in my "personal space" breathing on the back of my neck. I turned around to find an elderly man "in my face."  He began an interrogation.  "Are you Catholic?"  (A strange question since I was wearing a long-sleeved, nearly ankle-length dress, a veil on my head, and I was holding a Rosary.)  "Yes.". "Are you a TRADITIONAL Catholic?". "Yes.". "In this church we have the Latin Mass, only Latin.  Do you know that?". "Oh, yes.". "You don't go to that novus mass, do you? Father will say it in Latin.  The whole Mass is in LATIN.  Is that what you came for?". "Yes.  I came for Mass...in Latin.".  He looked satisfied and sat back in the pew.  No sooner did I resume praying the Rosary, then his breath was back.  "When did you last go to Confession?".  (I thought, "Is this guy for real?  Is he senile?"). The priest had no idea how glad I was to hear the bell and see him come out to say Mass.  (Yes, the LATIN Mass!). I later received an apology from the sister and an explanation that he was, indeed, a bit senile, having become paranoid about "infiltrators."  Apparently, he was the self-appointed one-man welcome committee for daily Mass.  He has since gone to his reward.  I often thank God for giving me a sense of humor!
     St. Francis Xavier threw a Crucifix into the sea, at once calming the waves.  Upon reaching the shore, the Crucifix was returned to him by a crab with a curious cross pattern on its shell.  

    Offline Mabel

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1893
    • Reputation: +1383/-18
    • Gender: Female
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #9 on: July 22, 2013, 09:40:27 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • Quote from: Rosemary
    Quote from: Spork
    The CMRI Masses I attended have the sentinels for sure. I took the interrogations in stride. Community is a by product of Faith Hope and Charity, not a primary means to salvation that the Novus Ordo realm advances. Go to the FSSP. They have valid Masses with priests who are not afraid to criticize the NO, VII, and the Bishops.


    I go to a CMRI Mass and have never been interrogated.

    The FSSP should be avoided, as there "Masses" are most likely not valid.  This is because, even if the "priests" were ordained in the valid Latin Rite, they were "ordained" by "bishops" "consecrated" in the invalid Paul VI Rite.


    Excellent point. The FSSP is nothing more than a compartment to silence those within the NO and to provide a safe haven for those wrapped up in externals, but not with keeping the Faith.

    Same here. I've been to eight different CMRI mass centers from coast to coast, never a problem. The people I've referred to them have never undergone any interrogation either.

    Offline Mithrandylan

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3450
    • Reputation: +4100/-252
    • Gender: Male
      • The Trad Forum
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #10 on: July 22, 2013, 10:10:19 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • Quote from: ardevain1
    Quote from: Meg
    I was so surprised by an interaction between two priests during announcement at the end of Sunday Mass at the Novus Ordo parish that I recently began attending, that I have to share it because it's so interesting.

    1- So on my never-ending quest to find a reverent NO

    2- (the parishioners at the FSSP parish I'd been attending are not at all friendly, and they are clickish)

    3- The NO parish I'd attended sings the horrid Gather Us In, written by a Lutheran. I don't get why Protestant songs are sung when there are so many beautiful Catholic songs.

    4- In which the young priest responded....."Well, if they can sit through a 2 1/2 hour movie, then they can handle it." The priests were arguing about the Latin Mass in front of everyone!

    5- I'd wondered if maybe there was a behind-the-scenes battle going on at this parish between those who are attached to the NO and Vll, and those who prefer tradition.


    1- I doubt that you'll ever find one.  Priests who say the NO Mass with any level of reverence and ceremony are usually railroaded out by their bishops.  I do not encourage you to keep looking, either. Archbishop Lefebvre said that, even though the Sacrifice may be validly re-presented and the Sacrament may be validly confected, the NO is a danger to the Faith.

    2- TradCats can be like that.  At a "parish" where I once assisted at Mass there was a particular lady who watched out for new faces and whenever she saw one, cornered the person(s) and warned them to not associate with "those people over there."  You have to work around that. Go up to someone who looks most like wanting to avoid newcomers and, with a smile on your face, introduce yourself and ask for an introduction to what is going on there.  Believe me, the TradCats who especially don't trust strangers will open right up.

    4- The last NO Mass I attended was my Godfather's funeral.  If you think Gather Us In is horrible, try On Eagles' Wings.  It'll curdle milk.

    5- There might be.  The old priests, who can be counted on to have made a lifetime investment in the Nervous disOrder, are finding that the young priests have seen the success of the Tridentine Mass in keeping people Catholic.

    ¡Viva Cristo Rey!


    A little further elaboration:

    1- While it's true that most Novus Ordo's are irreverent, even the 'reverent' ones are only reverent inasmuch as one is forced, at least as a bystander, to be under the impression that the ritual is 'serious.'  No supersoakers, no sermons aimed at riling the crowd, no (or very little) immodest dress... but you can find these things at a mosque or a Buddhist temple, too.  Time and time again, the reliable and invariable failure of the NO is in the Catholicity department.  There is nothing uniquely Catholic about the NO.  It is ecumenical.  Even if you find the NO that's performed by someone in a fiddleback with in Latin with incense facing east, all you've done is found a high bastard mass, in contrast with the usual low bastard mass.  I've been to quite a few of those Novus Ordo's, actually.  It's still Cain's offering.  It's one of the many flavors at the Baskin-Robins megachurch.  

    2- The real thing here is, who cares?  Not that a miserable social life at a parish can't pose problems, but forsaking the true mass for the NO because you don't like the people in the pews is heightened lunacy!  But, let's go ahead and accept for argument's sake that Tradition has this 'problem' of 'sentinels' and whoever else... would you rather your friends use contraception?  Curse and use profanity?  Think protestants are saved?  C'mon...

    3- They sing non-Catholic songs because the Church that sponsors them is non-Catholic.  It's the same reason that they perform a non-Catholic liturgy and offer non-Catholic sacraments, and believe in things the Catholic Church has condemned.  The horrid music is only incidental to the horrid faith.

    4- Has the young priest ever celebrated the TLM?  How on earth could it take two and a half hours?  :p  

    5- The young priest will not last.  In all likelihood, he is preferential to the TLM (i.e., believes it to be the same thing as the NO, simply a prettier form) in which case he cannot justify trying to get people to attend it in place of the NO.  Most diocesan clerics who celebrate the true mass and the NO hold this position-- after all, they have to, per Summorum Pontificum.  In the off chance that he actually sees an innate difference between the two, he will not last.  He will either be beaten into submission to the conciliar Church (most likely) or he will leave it, seek a conditional ordination and join a trad group (unlikely, but it's happened before).  And if you want to ask why, points one and three should get you pretty close to the answer... the Conciliar Church is not Catholic, it does not have a Catholic liturgy, it does not believe in Catholic doctrine, it does not have Catholic music-- why on earth would it want one of it's shepherds to?

    Meg, don't settle for traditional table scraps.  Get ye the real mass, the real sacraments.  Godspeed!

    More Catholic Discussion: http://thetradforum.com


    Offline Ambrose

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3447
    • Reputation: +2423/-11
    • Gender: Male
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #11 on: July 23, 2013, 12:01:16 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Spork
    The CMRI Masses I attended have the sentinels for sure. I took the interrogations in stride. Community is a by product of Faith Hope and Charity, not a primary means to salvation that the Novus Ordo realm advances. Go to the FSSP. They have valid Masses with priests who are not afraid to criticize the NO, VII, and the Bishops.


    Sentinels?  Could you define what these "sentinels" do and explain why you use that term?  Who questioned you?  Why do you use the term, "interrogation?"  Is it possible that the priest or some laypeople were being friendly with you and making conversation?  

    I have never heard of such behavior at the CMRI.  I know many who go there and have referred many to go to them and not once have I heard such a thing.  

    From my experience with CMRI, they are very friendly and welcoming.  I have never been "interrogated" by them, even when traveling in chapels where no one knows me.   I simply went to Mass and left, and was never "interrogated."



    The Council of Trent, The Catechism of the Council of Trent, Papal Teaching, The Teaching of the Holy Office, The Teaching of the Church Fathers, The Code of Canon Law, Countless approved catechisms, The Doctors of the Church, The teaching of the Dogmatic

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 7055
    • Reputation: +1981/-187
    • Gender: Female
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #12 on: July 23, 2013, 07:48:32 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • Quote from: Frances
    :pray:  :really-mad2: :scratchchin:
    Most Bizarre Encounter-  "Saved By the [Sanctuary] Bell"
    Three years ago I went to weekday Mass at an independent chapel in the Midwest. (USA) I was quite early, so slipped into a pew and began to pray the Rosary.  There were two women in front of me, one of whom was in a Franciscan habit.  Suddenly, I became aware that someone was in my "personal space" breathing on the back of my neck. I turned around to find an elderly man "in my face."  He began an interrogation.  "Are you Catholic?"  (A strange question since I was wearing a long-sleeved, nearly ankle-length dress, a veil on my head, and I was holding a Rosary.)  "Yes.". "Are you a TRADITIONAL Catholic?". "Yes.". "In this church we have the Latin Mass, only Latin.  Do you know that?". "Oh, yes.". "You don't go to that novus mass, do you? Father will say it in Latin.  The whole Mass is in LATIN.  Is that what you came for?". "Yes.  I came for Mass...in Latin.".  He looked satisfied and sat back in the pew.  No sooner did I resume praying the Rosary, then his breath was back.  "When did you last go to Confession?".  (I thought, "Is this guy for real?  Is he senile?"). The priest had no idea how glad I was to hear the bell and see him come out to say Mass.  (Yes, the LATIN Mass!). I later received an apology from the sister and an explanation that he was, indeed, a bit senile, having become paranoid about "infiltrators."  Apparently, he was the self-appointed one-man welcome committee for daily Mass.  He has since gone to his reward.  I often thank God for giving me a sense of humor!


    That is funny.  
    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 7055
    • Reputation: +1981/-187
    • Gender: Female
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #13 on: July 23, 2013, 07:56:40 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • Strangers should be welcomed to come to Mass.  
    And if they aren't traditional Catholics,  we should convert them.  After mass introduce them to the priest so he can guide them.

    Bishop Williamson is a convert.  

    And it's not my fault that I was no.  I was baptized Catholic.
    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline Meg

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2915
    • Reputation: +1422/-2276
    • Gender: Female
    Amazed by announcement at Novus Ordo parish
    « Reply #14 on: July 23, 2013, 10:25:22 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!3
  • Quote from: Viva Cristo Rey
    Strangers should be welcomed to come to Mass.  
    And if they aren't traditional Catholics,  we should convert them.  After mass introduce them to the priest so he can guide them.

    Bishop Williamson is a convert.  

    And it's not my fault that I was no.  I was baptized Catholic.


    I agree that strangers should be welcomed. If our beloved TLM is to become better known and understood and loved, it would help to welcome folks who are interested, espescially since the TLM is difficult to understand at first. IMO.

     

    Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16