Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: 40 Holy Martyrs of Sebaste  (Read 10687 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline CM

40 Holy Martyrs of Sebaste
« Reply #115 on: August 09, 2009, 08:02:18 PM »
The Dimonds argue that aut, which means 'or' can also mean 'and'.

But this is wrong.  Also, they believe that if it did mean 'and' that this would somehow support the dogma of the necessity of water baptism.  It does not.  They are completely illogical.

If the decree read "this translation cannot be effect without the laver of regeneration and the desire thereof,"

Then BOTH would have to be missing for justification to be impossible, not just either one or the other.

If both have to be missing, then the presence of only one is enough, but this is illogical.  If you accepted this false understanding, then you would have to say that not only can a person be justified who desires baptism, but never receives it, but you would also have to say that a person can be justified who received baptism but desires not to.

Do you see?

Offline gladius_veritatis

  • Supporter
40 Holy Martyrs of Sebaste
« Reply #116 on: August 11, 2009, 12:41:33 AM »
Quote from: Catholic Martyr
Your examples are all of people that Holy Scripture, the infallible Word of God, proclaim to be saints.  Do you see that you are attacking a strawman?


Could you please share the sacred text/s with us that state/s that St Joseph, Our Lady, etc., ARE IN HEAVEN?  From what I recall, only the text about Dismas (who is not named) could be so construed.  What was that you were saying about a straw man? :wink:


Offline CM

40 Holy Martyrs of Sebaste
« Reply #117 on: August 11, 2009, 01:26:52 AM »
Gladius, I already admitted that I don't know any text that says St. Joseph is in heaven.  But I BELIEVE it with every bone in my body.  Why?  Because I don't have to DENY A DOGMA to do so.

And now I will happily admit that the Bible is not explicit about the salvation of the Blessed Virgin Mary, although Apocalypse powerfully asserts it, however implicitly.

So now what?  Do you think you just won some kind of victory over me?

Take it.
 :sign-surrender:
:sleep: