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Author Topic: 'Sedes'  (Read 5969 times)

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Offline roscoe

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'Sedes'
« on: July 23, 2008, 10:34:33 PM »
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    • It seems as if there are 5 'sedes here

    Cletus
    Provo
    GV
    Dawn
    myself

    Is there any other Catholic forum where one is permitted to discuss this?

    With v2ers and SSPX, 'sedes' compose the third faction then. Is there anyone here who considers themselves to be of another faction calling itself Roman Catholic? I am assuming SSPX considers itself traditionalist and these two would be one and the same.
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    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'

    Offline Cletus

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #1 on: July 23, 2008, 10:56:20 PM »
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    • Am I a sedevacantist?

    On this forum I just defend sedevacantists from what I consider false accusations. I try to point out flaws in what I consider bad arguments against sedevacantism.

    Why would I do that if I weren't one?

    I'm  trying to stick to a certain agreement. To a certain understanding about this forum.

    I try to stay strictly on the defensive about the issue. I don't "start things" about the ones deemed Vicars of Christ by most here whom I cannot call Vicars of Christ. But I do jump in when things get started against sedevacantism.

    That is permitted.

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    Offline Cletus

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #2 on: July 23, 2008, 10:58:18 PM »
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    • Roscoe, you forgot the universal villains and whipping boys and girls amongst Trads and Seds: the so-called Home Aloners.
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    Offline roscoe

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #3 on: July 23, 2008, 11:08:06 PM »
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    • Could you give an example of a good argument against sedevacantism?
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    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'

    Offline roscoe

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #4 on: July 23, 2008, 11:10:29 PM »
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    • OK Cletus lets put it another way. Do you think Card Siri was actually elected Pope in 1958?
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    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'

    Offline Cletus

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #5 on: July 23, 2008, 11:38:25 PM »
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    • Quote from: roscoe
    Could you give an example of a good argument against sedevacantism?


    I can think of an occasion on which a Traditional Catholic who accepts the Vatican II popes as true popes and who also knew his Bellarmine and Van Noort bested a sedevacantist in argument.

    Some sedevacantists speak exclusively of heresy as that of which putative popes must be guilty if they are to be rejected as true popes. And then they go on to list vagaries that don't even approach the level of heresy. "He refused to wear the papal tiara. He dissed St Philomena. He looked at the scantily clad lady athletes."

    When they might have checked out areas of "papal" vagary which did not excite them, which are not splashy, but which do approach heresy territory: speaking of Christ as someone Who had His "disillusionments" in this world during the Stations of the Cross, for example.

    But no, I can't think of any good arguments against sedevacantism as its more savvy exponents present it. (And not that they agree on everything.)
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    Offline Cletus

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #6 on: July 23, 2008, 11:42:46 PM »
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    • Quote from: roscoe
    OK Cletus lets put it another way. Do you think Card Siri was actually elected Pope in 1958?


    Maybe he got the most votes at one point and there was some hanky-panky there. But was he elected pope? Was he pope for one minute? I doubt it. I think he may have backed off from the honor for reasons we can never know. And that was that. Then we got, er, Good Pope John and Vatican II.
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    Offline roscoe

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #7 on: July 23, 2008, 11:49:05 PM »
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    • TCW speaks of Card Siri's election specifically as fact and I think it is most probably true. To bad D Hobson does not have a forum.
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    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'

    Offline roscoe

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #8 on: July 23, 2008, 11:54:43 PM »
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    • And you didn't actually give the example ot the good argument that you had the occaision to encounter where the 'sede' was bested. This isn't another something you are making up like in the Card Rampolla discussion is it?
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    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'

    Offline Cletus

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #9 on: July 24, 2008, 12:04:44 AM »
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    • Yep. All made up. Shame on me.

    Have a good one.
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    Offline roscoe

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #10 on: July 24, 2008, 12:37:58 AM »
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    • Cletus- I highly doubt that Jesus will deny you a place in Heaven.
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    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'

    Offline Dawn

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #11 on: July 24, 2008, 06:55:05 AM »
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    • Roscoe, I also hang visit D Hobson's site. There is an awful lot of proof behind Siri. Now, why he did not shout from the mountain tops that he was Pope and the ones that threatened him be damned. I do not know. Did he not apologize for not risking his life (or that of his family) by not standing firm?
    Tell me a little of what you think please?
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    Offline roscoe

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #12 on: July 24, 2008, 02:40:06 PM »
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    • There has to be an explanation for what has happened since the heretical v2 'council'. The election of Card Siri seems to me the best one. As you may know, I also suspect that Card Raphael was actually elected in 1914 and ben 15 may in fact be an anti-pope.

    You would enjoy reading Genius of the Vatican by Sencourt and Contemporary Church History by Premoli. Ciao
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    There Is No Such Thing As 'Sede Vacantism'...
    nor is there such thing as a 'Feeneyite' or 'Feeneyism'

    Offline Dawn

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #13 on: July 24, 2008, 04:33:23 PM »
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    • Wow those are very rare books indeed. Ben 15. The Pope during WWI. Yes, I do know that he was busy with the war, AND attacking the Church from the inside and making it weak and ready for this diabolical attack. What are your thoughts on Pius XII?
    Roscoe, I hear people calling for the lynch mobs with my last question to you!!!
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    Offline Dylan

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    'Sedes'
    « Reply #14 on: July 25, 2008, 07:08:52 AM »
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    • Quote from: roscoe
    It seems as if there are 5 'sedes here

    Cletus
    Provo
    GV
    Dawn
    myself


    I, too, am a Sedevacantist.
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