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Offline parentsfortruth

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"Who am I to judge gay people?"
« on: July 29, 2013, 08:49:30 AM »
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  •  29 July 2013 Last updated at 09:14 ET

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-23489702#TWEET837994



    Pope Francis: Who am I to judge gay people?

    The Pope's position on gay people appears to contrast with that of his predecessor

    Pope Francis has said gay people should not be marginalised but integrated into society.

    Speaking to reporters on a flight back from Brazil, he reaffirmed the Roman Catholic Church's position that homosexual acts were sinful, but homosexual orientation was not.

    "If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge him?"

    He also said he wanted a greater role for women in the Church, but insisted they could not be priests.

    The Pope arrived back in Rome on Monday after a week-long tour of Brazil - his first trip abroad as pontiff - which climaxed with a huge gathering on Rio de Janeiro's Copacabana beach for a world Catholic youth festival.

    Festival organisers estimated it attracted more than three million people.

    His remarks on gay people are being seen as much more conciliatory than his predecessor's position on the issue.

    Pope Benedict XVI signed a document in 2005 that said men with deep-rooted homosexual tendencies should not be priests.

    Pope Francis said gay clergymen should be forgiven and their sins forgotten.
    Gay 'lobbying'

    "The Catechism of the Catholic Church explains this very well," Pope Francis said in a wide-ranging 80-minute long interview with Vatican journalists.

    "It says they should not be marginalised because of this but that they must be integrated into society."


    But he condemned what he described as lobbying by gay people.

    "The problem is not having this orientation," he said. "We must be brothers. The problem is lobbying by this orientation, or lobbies of greedy people, political lobbies, Masonic lobbies, so many lobbies. This is the worse problem."

    On the role of women in the Church, he said: "We cannot limit the role of women in the Church to altar girls or the president of a charity, there must be more.

    "But with regards to the ordination of women, the Church has spoken and says no... That door is closed."

    Answering questions about the troubled Vatican bank, he said the institution must become "honest and transparent" and that he would listen to advice on whether it could be reformed or should be shut down altogether.

    "I don't know what will become of the bank. Some say it is better that is a bank, others that it should be a charitable fund and others say close it," he said.
    'Undisciplined'

    Before leaving Brazil, Pope Francis gave a highly unusual one-to-one interview to a Brazilian TV programme.

    The interview was shown on TV Globo's high-profile Sunday night documentary programme Fantastico, broadcast not long after the Pope departed for Rome.

    The Pope was asked about the moment on his visit when his driver took a wrong turn and his vehicle was surrounded by crowds.

    "I don't feel afraid," he answered. "I know that no-one dies before their time.

    "I don't want to see these people who have such a great heart from behind a glass box. The two security teams [from the Vatican and Brazil] worked very well. But I know that I am undisciplined in that respect."

    Asked about the recent protests by young people on the streets of Brazil, the Pope said: "The young person is essentially a non-conformist, and this is very beautiful.

    "It is necessary to listen to young people, give them places to express themselves and to be careful that they aren't manipulated."

    Asked about his simple lifestyle and use of a small car, he said it wasn't a good example when a priest had the latest model of a car or a top brand.

    "At this moment I believe God is asking us for more simplicity," he added.

     :barf:
    Matthew 5:37

    But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over and above these, is of evil.

    My Avatar is Fr. Hector Bolduc. He was a faithful parish priest in De Pere, WI,

    Offline ClarkSmith

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #1 on: July 29, 2013, 09:21:37 AM »
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  • This is what happens to the Catholic Church when its traditions are stripped and changed to the lukewarm Vatican II church.


    Offline Christopher67

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #2 on: July 29, 2013, 09:25:55 AM »
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  • As a side note, I wish one of the "jourrnalists" would have asked him to elaborate on his comment concerning "masonic lobbies".......

    Offline Mithrandylan

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #3 on: July 29, 2013, 09:43:37 AM »
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  • Quote from: Christopher67
    As a side note, I wish one of the "jourrnalists" would have asked him to elaborate on his comment concerning "masonic lobbies".......


    Really

    Incidentally, I can imagine the neocats and neotrads painting this interview as:

    "POPE UPHOLDS CATHOLIC TEACHING ON GAYS, WOMEN; CONDEMNS MASONS"
    More Catholic Discussion: http://thetradforum.com

    Offline StCeciliasGirl

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #4 on: July 29, 2013, 09:50:56 AM »
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  • I came here JUST for this. Thank you.

    And the article on HuffPo (HoPo) goes into more detail about the specifics of his current appointment who made headlines last week. I'm too mad to quote, but basically:

    • the media shouldn't be looking at anyone's NON-CRIMINAL SEXUAL BEHAVIOR.

    Okay, nevermind that clergy/priests shouldn't be HAVING sexual behavior, who is he to tell the secular press what to look at?

    Imo, this is anti-christ bad. The secular press is pointing out what a bunch of hypocrites those with "Holy Orders" are, and the Pope says, "Yeah so? Bite me."

    • He joked about the "gay lobby". Said it would be wrong IF... [it existed, but it doesn't]. No wolves in HIS Vatican.

    • He PERSONALLY looked into the scandalous matter reported about his latest Msgr. gay (meaning he ASKED his dining buddy Ricca if he was actively participating in gay stuff), and found nothing (Ricca said 'nope, I'm eating dinner') —and even noted that anything that had happened in the past was the past

     :mad:

    So tell me WHY Pope Honorius, well-loved in his day, dead, and buried for DECADES, was anathematized and excommunicated? I mean, if "the past doesn't matter"??? ??? ???

    Pope Francis, making this guy's case:

    Legem credendi, lex statuit supplicandi

    +JMJ


    Offline Charlemagne

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #5 on: July 29, 2013, 09:58:51 AM »
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  • Francis is starting to make Paul VI look like a staunch defender of the Faith.
    "Kindness is for fools! They [modernists] want to be treated with oil, soap, and caresses, but they ought to be beaten with fists. In a duel, you don't count or measure the blows, you strike as you can. War is not made with charity. It is a struggle, a duel." -- Pope St. Pius X

    Offline Meg

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #6 on: July 29, 2013, 10:06:28 AM »
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  • Quote from: Charlemagne
    Francis is starting to make Paul VI look like a staunch defender of the Faith.


    I was thinking something similar...that this new Pope makes JP2 look almost traditional. I think that Francis may not be very bright. How could he make those comments and not know that the media would pick them up and make them into headlines? It's all very distressing. And on top of the Franciscans of the Immaculate not being able to celebrate the TLM without permission. I partly blame the cardinals who elected him.

    Offline Charlemagne

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #7 on: July 29, 2013, 10:09:58 AM »
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  • Quote from: Meg
    Quote from: Charlemagne
    Francis is starting to make Paul VI look like a staunch defender of the Faith.


    I was thinking something similar...that this new Pope makes JP2 look almost traditional. I think that Francis may not be very bright. How could he make those comments and not know that the media would pick them up and make them into headlines? It's all very distressing. And on top of the Franciscans of the Immaculate not being able to celebrate the TLM without permission. I partly blame the cardinals who elected him.


    I think he knows exactly what he's doing. He's crazy like a fox - much like the fox Our Lord referred to in St. Luke 13:32.
    "Kindness is for fools! They [modernists] want to be treated with oil, soap, and caresses, but they ought to be beaten with fists. In a duel, you don't count or measure the blows, you strike as you can. War is not made with charity. It is a struggle, a duel." -- Pope St. Pius X


    Offline Meg

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #8 on: July 29, 2013, 10:16:00 AM »
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  • Quote from: Charlemagne
    Quote from: Meg
    Quote from: Charlemagne
    Francis is starting to make Paul VI look like a staunch defender of the Faith.


    I was thinking something similar...that this new Pope makes JP2 look almost traditional. I think that Francis may not be very bright. How could he make those comments and not know that the media would pick them up and make them into headlines? It's all very distressing. And on top of the Franciscans of the Immaculate not being able to celebrate the TLM without permission. I partly blame the cardinals who elected him.


    I think he knows exactly what he's doing. He's crazy like a fox - much like the fox Our Lord referred to in St. Luke 13:32.


    You're probably right. I always like to give the Popes the benefit of the doubt, but that's increasingly difficult to do. I feel like the cause of tradition within the Church is being set back 10 - 20 years.

    Offline MiserereMeiDeus

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #9 on: July 29, 2013, 10:45:10 AM »
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  • Just in case anyone hadn't figured it out already, it is now clear beyond any doubt why Cdl. Mahony was so ecstatic when the current putative pope was picked.
    "Jesus was the fruit of Mary, as Elizabeth expressed it: 'Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb.' Whoever wishes for the fruit, must go to the tree; whoever wishes for Jesus must go to Mary; and he who finds Mary, also certain

    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #10 on: July 29, 2013, 10:45:34 AM »
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  • The man sitting on his porch in white looks much more papal than Pope Francis.  

    We're just seeing the beginning.  


    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #11 on: July 29, 2013, 10:46:37 AM »
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  • The comment about young people being non-conformist is laugh out loud ridiculous.  Everything about the youth in the WYD was conformity.  

    Contemporary youth is conformity on steroids.  They even rebel in identical manner.  


    Offline poche

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #12 on: July 29, 2013, 12:22:49 PM »
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  • Integration into the Church doesn't mean approval of immoral lifestyles or ordaining "gay" priests tommarow. Forgiving and forgetting the sins of the the sinful priests is good, of course the adage "go and sin no more" still applies.  

    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #13 on: July 29, 2013, 12:31:02 PM »
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  • Effeminate behavior is a vice.
    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle

    Offline poche

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    "Who am I to judge gay people?"
    « Reply #14 on: July 29, 2013, 12:53:52 PM »
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  • "If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge him?"

    Seeks God and has good will implies at least a commitment to live in chastity.

     

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