Author Topic: Supporting your Traditional Catholic school (Read 5335 times)

Caminus · « **Reply #30 on:** March 14, 2011, 11:35:31 AM »

I suggest reading this for anyone interested in the historical development of Catholic education. There are points in the book that I think would correct several misconceptions advanced by some in this thread.

tlmforme · « **Reply #31 on:** March 14, 2011, 12:04:08 PM »

Quote from: Matthew

You're talking to someone who plans on homeschooling his children.

But I am under no delusions about how easy it is, or what kind of "awesome education" we'll be able to give them. Maybe if we have a genius or gifted child and/or one who excels in self-directed learning, then we'll have some cases of stellar results.

But more often than not, homeschooling is putting the Faith before worldly learning.

I think that's what it comes down to. Homeschooling, for most families, will NOT result in a better-educated child than private (or even public?) school. But they will keep the Faith. If the Faith is what matters most, then there's no problem. But don't claim it's academically a great idea, because usually it isn't.

Heck, the famous St. Mary's, KS is a mediocre-to-lousy option, academically speaking. I've heard that from several who have attended the school.

Matthew

I had not heard that about St. Marys before I subscribed to this message forums. I'm beginning to understand more about the SSPX, since I'm a traditional Catholic & attend the TLM. exclusively, but am still in communion with the Pope maybe my opinion doesn't matter. However, there is another "St. Mary's" in Kansas & it's excellent scholastically:

Year # of Proficient or Above Total # of Scores % of Proficient or Above
2005 167 174 96%
2004 121 137 88.4%
2003 159 183 86.9%
2002 115 133 86.5%
2001 150 175 86%

Am I correct in assuming that you (generic you) would rather send your child to a government run school than a "Novus Ordo" school?
I realize that they are very lax about doctrine, however, the public schools in my area are filled with drugs, guns, etc.

If we are to raise TRUE Catholic leaders to replace those like Nancy Peℓσѕι, Ted Kennedy, John Kerry, et al., they will definitely need to know their faith.....but they are also going to have to be very proficient scholastically.

tlmforme · « **Reply #32 on:** March 14, 2011, 12:18:51 PM »

Quote from: Matthew

I can see how a person could get nostalgia for a time in which *most* things were far better than they are today. Many things were just as broken, but that isn't what you focus on.

I'm only in my 30's, but I could imagine getting misty-eyed for the "good old days" of the early 1990s, when Generation X was busy getting a high school education, before Social Media, texting, cell phones, and advanced video games hit the scene. Students were that much more capable of writing, reading, and being understood than equivalent students today.

However, I am realistic enough to admit that the music was still not in line with Catholic morality, the nation as a whole was still not Catholic, etc., etc.

Simply comparing the early 1990's with today, the 90's come out way ahead. But what does that mean, really? If it's just a relatively higher point on the slope we've traveled down?

I think the 50's are just an even HIGHER point on the slope -- but it's still a mid-point in the slope, not the "apex of Catholic civilization". That would be the 1300s.

Also, I believe that I, personally, would probably be *most* nostalgic for the 1990s, because that's when I remember coming of age. That's when I got my first computer, got my first car & drivers license, got my first job, moved into my first apartment, etc.

That's why a lot of people are nostalgic for the 50's -- things were better in many ways, and that's when they came of age, yet before they were burdened with the heavy duties of parenthood.

Matthew

Matthew, I am nostalgic about many things of the 50's......REAL Ice Cream Sodas, children being able to walk to school without fear of some pervert attacking them & 5 cent Cokes that were a drink instead of something one "shoots up with".

However, when it comes to my faith....well, that's too important to credit to nostalgia. At least, it is to me. The reasons I came back to traditional Catholicism can't be summed up simply. I'll just say that the "Eucharistic MEAL", the blending of the laity & the ordained priesthood, the CITH & MANY other things that I consider abuses.....drove me back to studying & searching for the things that once worked. I am starting with the tlm., in a parish where there are specific times for Confession.

Catholic Samurai · « **Reply #33 on:** March 14, 2011, 04:25:31 PM »

Quote from: tlmforme

Am I correct in assuming that you (generic you) would rather send your child to a government run school than a "Novus Ordo" school?
I realize that they are very lax about doctrine, however, the public schools in my area are filled with drugs, guns, etc.

Where I come from, there is not difference. "Catholic" school is where you end up (at a monetary cost) after you get expelled from every other public school, that is if your not going straight to Juvey Hall. And that's the way it's been here for nearly half a century.

Catholic Samurai · « **Reply #34 on:** March 14, 2011, 04:33:23 PM »

Quote from: tlmforme

If we are to raise TRUE Catholic leaders to replace those like Nancy Peℓσѕι, Ted Kennedy, John Kerry, et al., they will definitely need to know their faith.....but they are also going to have to be very proficient scholastically.

When God wanted to kick King Saul "out of office", he chose a simple shepherd boy out in the country to take his seat.

tlmforme · « **Reply #35 on:** March 14, 2011, 05:55:46 PM »

Quote from: Caminus

I suggest reading this for anyone interested in the historical development of Catholic education. There are points in the book that I think would correct several misconceptions advanced by some in this thread.

And here's another one:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/on.com/Sis/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=on.com/Sis&linkCode=as2&tag=httpwwwchanco-20

I believe that it was in this book that I read about the burning of the Ursuline Convent
In 1834, a few hundred locals descended on the convent. As the nuns and their young charges cowered, both the convent and school were ransacked and torched by the mob. A mausoleum was then opened, coffins overturned and the remains scattered. When the three nights of arson and mayhem was over, the Ursuline convent and the school it housed were in ruins.

Yet this order of nuns survived & grew. We have a proud history, we've just forgotten it, or buried it under hatred & false ecuмenicism.

The desolation of the Ursuline Convent in August 1834 is not one of the proud events that historic Boston touts to patriotic visitors. And it is hardly unique. America's past is littered with similar examples of intolerance, sectarian hatred and ultimately, religious violence. A decade after the attack on the Ursuline Convent, Philadelphia was torn apart by the anti-Catholic Bible Riots, in which dozens died and the homes of mostly Irish Catholic immigrants were destroyed along with two Catholic churches in an argument begun over which Bible to use in public school.

tlmforme · « **Reply #36 on:** March 14, 2011, 06:19:03 PM »

Where I come from, there is not difference. "Catholic" school is where you end up (at a monetary cost) after you get expelled from every other public school, that is if your not going straight to Juvey Hall. And that's the way it's been here for nearly half a century.[/quote]

That's not a new problem. Catholic schools have always been willing to give anyone a chance if they had the room. The "trouble makers" were usually non-Catholics sent there for "the nuns to straighten them out". In fact, they had a pretty good record of doing so. My husband's best friend was enrolled in Immaculate Conception (a school in our area) in the 6th grade. He was one of these kids. He became a Catholic in high school, the only one in his family. He is now a retired highway patrolmen, a Traditional Catholic & a Grandfather several times over.

I'm surprised at the problems in the Catholic Tx. schools. There are 10 diocese if I remember correctly & all have at least one, most 2-3 Latin Mass communities.

Ah well, Tx. is a country of it's own. It was in Dallas, on a business trip, that I saw my first store with a sign that read:

"LIQUOR, GUNS & AMMO sold here". :good-shot:

tlmforme · « **Reply #37 on:** March 14, 2011, 06:24:27 PM »

When God wanted to kick King Saul "out of office", he chose a simple shepherd boy out in the country to take his seat. [/quote]

True & I sure hope he sends us one. Until then, however, a good education & a solid faith is the only way that I can see that WE can do anything to displace these "pick & choose Catholic politicians".........that plus prayer, fasting, offering our pain & sufferings for a resurgence of Catholic politicians. Our Bishop refused to give the Eucharist to Nancy Peℓσѕι.

Catholic Samurai · « **Reply #38 on:** March 15, 2011, 12:42:16 AM »

Quote from: tlmforme

That's not a new problem. Catholic schools have always been willing to give anyone a chance if they had the room. The "trouble makers" were usually non-Catholics sent there for "the nuns to straighten them out". In fact, they had a pretty good record of doing so. My husband's best friend was enrolled in Immaculate Conception (a school in our area) in the 6th grade. He was one of these kids. He became a Catholic in high school, the only one in his family. He is now a retired highway patrolmen, a Traditional Catholic & a Grandfather several times over.

This is not the 50's, and THAT is not the reason why Catholic schools are populated with delinquents (to use a soft term). The kids in Catholic school are absolutely NO different from those in a public school, and there is hardly any more religion in the former than there is in the later. At the last "Catholic" school I visited I had trouble telling which girl wasn't a hooker because they all dressed like hookers. As for the males, I cant tell which one isn't a gangster.

Zenith · « **Reply #39 on:** March 17, 2011, 06:03:21 AM »

Quote from: Matthew

1. Homeschooling is putting the Faith before worldly learning. Education quality is poor. The main -- if not only -- advantage of traditional Catholic homeschooling is the benefit to one's Faith.

I would disagree in most cases with this statement. I was homeschooled for 90% of my education and I know quite a lot of homeschoolers who did very well for themselves. They managed well to become doctors, engineers, jounalists, teachers, etc...

Homeschoolers here in Australia have a good reputation for doing well academically. I personally know quite a few big 8-10 child families who homeschooled all their children successfully.

Like everything there has to be a balance so that children are not too isolated and sheltered and I believe this is the reason a lot of people are against it due to their bad experiences.

I believe the parents are the first and foremost educators of their children and it is up to them to educate themselves in the Faith so that they know what is good for their children.

If the parents are capable and willing to homeschool their children then I congratulate them as I know it takes a lot of work.

I think the schools 200 years ago that were run by teaching orders such as the Dominicans would have been far better than even Traditional schools today as SSPX is a Priestly society that was not originally formed primarily for the education of the young.

There are many problems with even Traditional Schools and I believe on of the main problems is that parents do not take their responsiblity of forming their children themselves seriously and so they send them to Traditional schools with the attitude that the school will do all the education for them including discipline and teaching them the Faith. Before the parents realise the children have lost the Faith and no longer go to Mass because the Parents have neglected their primary responsibilties of raising the children in the Faith.

Zenith · « **Reply #40 on:** March 17, 2011, 06:24:29 AM »

Quote from: jmid

I've seen very few homeschool children "succeed " most of them seem extremely uneducated, and alot of them actually end up losing the faith for some reason.
Quote

Well that might be the case in some circuмstances though definitely not the majority.

Public school is not as bad for the faith in my humble opinion, because the evil is so easily recognizable.
If you teach catechism and pray together at home, then your children will see thru the BS at school and will have to face it and hopefully reject it. This is the world we live in. They will have to face it someday. With their parents help and prayer they will overcome.

A bad homeschool or Trad school will kill the faith of a child, more than a public school,from what I experienced.

Please do not lock your children in the house, not letting them have friends. They have to learn to make good decisions. How else than by falling down and with guidance from their family they learn to walk the narrow path??

To me this seems quite irresponsible. When your children come home swearing at the age of 8, will you think the same then? When your children are exposed to bad company and make friends who are smoking weed and getting drunk and practicing what they learnt in sex education, will you be happy?

Even if you teach your children what is right and wrong, bad company can destroy them and it does not take long to slip. It is call peer pressure.

This is a little like the account of Our Lord's temptation when the devil told Him to throw Himself off the cliff and the Angels would hold Him up so that He would not dash His feet. We should not place ourselves in the occasions of sin or put God to the test.
No matter how well we know right from wrong,, bad company can be the ruin of us.

How can Homeschooling or a Trad school be more dangerous if we know that the company is far better than public schools?

That is a rediculous claim.

Catholic Samurai · « **Reply #41 on:** March 17, 2011, 10:24:37 AM »

Im inclined to believe jmid is unfamiliar with the environment of public schools based on his post. He must have a wonderful public school in his area.